Trapdoor Muzzleloader Musket - Could Use Some Help Here

[John Allen]

Ok, I got a weird one today that I could not pass up. It was $240.00 and I bought it.

The rifle is a muzzleloader. It has a trapdoor stock, 1873 ramrod, 1863 bright finish lock and a buffington sight.

I was thinking it might have been some odd ball Bannerman put together.

If anyone has any ideas I would love to hear them. BTW it has what looks like 8 groove rifling and appears to be 45 cal.


These are from the auction

100684

100685

[John Allen]

Here is a pic of the top. The top and the sides are flattened to match the breech plug area.

100686

[John Allen]

Here is the lock side. It looks like a bright finish lock.

100687

[John Allen]

Here is the buffington sight area

100689

[John Allen]

I forgot to mention the stock has the proper cartouches for a trapdoor.

[bob208]

,any years ago numrich made a muzzleloader conversion for the trapdoor. sounds like you got one.

[DIRT Farmer]

I have a barrel and hammer from one I converted back for a friend, hope to find a cheep stock and have a lock.

[missionary5155]

Good morning
Still makes a nice looking pachage. Should be a heavy barrel being only a caliber .45. What twist was it cut in ? If it is around 1-20 it woud be a dandy to shoot 400 plus grainers off cross sticks at pig sized targets at 500 yards.
Mike in Peru

[varsity07840]

Good morning
Still makes a nice looking pachage. Should be a heavy barrel being only a caliber .45. What twist was it cut in ? If it is around 1-20 it woud be a dandy to shoot 400 plus grainers off cross sticks at pig sized targets at 500 yards.
Mike in Peru

I think the Numrich drop ins were cut for roundball.

Duane

[smkummer]

Trapdoor actions are cheap. Numrich has them. Maybe a smith that is good with trapdoors could make it back into a 1884. just my .02

[John Allen]

I am going to keep it the way it is. I just have to figure out a load for it.

[John Allen]

Good morning
Still makes a nice looking pachage. Should be a heavy barrel being only a caliber .45. What twist was it cut in ? If it is around 1-20 it woud be a dandy to shoot 400 plus grainers off cross sticks at pig sized targets at 500 yards.
Mike in Peru

Mike, It looks like the rifling is cut for a patched roundball. I just have to find out the twist rate. The barrel looks unused. I have a really nice minie ball mold I would love to use for it.

[scattershot]

Sure sounds like a hybrid. Too old for a H&R, which were carbine style anyway. To determine your twist, run a cleaning rod with a tight fitting patch to the bottom of the bore, and make a mark at the front sight location. Pull the rod out until it has made 1/4 turn, and measure that distance. Multiply by 4, and that's your twist.

[Janoosh]

I think bob208 has it right. I have seen numrich drop in barrels for a trap door rifle. They have markings on them, perhaps polished off..??
Very nice gun, by the way.

[SamTexas49]

Sounds like we have similar rifles, cept I didnt have the buffington sight (wish it did). Here is link the the post on mine last year with info some folks provided on loads etc.

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?199080-Hopkins-and-Allen-45cal-Target-Rifle

[doc1876]

you will most likely be real happy with 75-150 grains of fffg, depending on what you are shooting, targets or deer.
If you do have a nice 1-16 or so twist, you could be enjoying a 300 plus grain bullet. something like this, there are many different bullet mfgs out there just dying for you business......and then if you are going to cast your own, there are so many moulds, you will get a headache!

[SamTexas49]

Here is the page from a Dixie Catalog (1972) that shows the drop in barrel you are describing.188386

[bedbugbilly]

Numrich made drop in barrels for them and they usually included a 1863 pattern hammer to go with them. The 1860 pattern hammer won't work. I bought one a number of years ago and dropped it in a chopped up 45/70 that I had. Yes. the barrel is cut for patched roundball. The Numrich barrel shot very well. As shown, the barrel was carried by
Dixie and were even advertised in different gun magazines in the 60s. It was a good option for someone who wanted a front stuffer. You have to remember that back in the 60s, no one really had an interest in 45/70 lie there is today. I can remember many 45/70s in those days going for $15 - $25 dollars at household auctions - unaltered and un-bubba'd. They were just "old guns".