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View Full Version : Krag 311284 Boolit ?



Loudenboomer
12-27-2007, 01:05 PM
I was all set to buy a Lyman 311284. Now I'm not so sure. I thought I'd run It by you experts.:) My 1898 Krag bore slugs .310. Inside of my fired case neck is also .310. I was thinking a .311 boolit should be perfect. My old Lyman 44th addition says this bullet has a normal as cast dia. of .315. Largest suggested sizing is .313.
This would be great but have they changed the dia. of this Boolit? When I called Lyman they told me This bullet usually falls form the mould @ .311. I told them given bore and neck size I thought I needed a .311 for my sized bullet. They said If your final size needs to be .311 this mould may be too small. I sure would like to use the 311284. I want to match the orig. Krag loading as close as possible. I hope I don't have to go to one of the lighter fatter Brit. Boolits.:( Given my slug and neck size what would you do????

45 2.1
12-27-2007, 01:14 PM
There is some variation in as cast sizes of these due to cherry wear and your choice of alloy. My mold casts at 0.312". It is a fine boolit for the Krag. Get one and try it out.

scb
12-27-2007, 01:25 PM
Mine too also casts .312-.311. They are the best boolit out of my 1898 Springfield.

Buckshot
12-28-2007, 05:10 AM
...............The 311284 was originally designed FOR the Krag to allow National Guardsmen to fire at 600 yard ranges. The Krags, while superb rifles that were lovingly produced and finished could be capable of some steller accuracy. However the barrel manufacture wasn't all it should have been and Krag barrels can sometimes be embarassingly large in the groove.

Also, Lyman moulds used to produce outsized boolits. Over some length of time the complaints sank in and Lyman took care to produce moulds dropping boolits closer to the common bore-groove diameter. It seems though that the pendulum has swung a bit too far the other way, especially on the noses. Possibly to keep costs down Lyman is letting cherries be sharpened and used a few time too many these days it appears.

...............Buckshot

DonH
12-28-2007, 07:41 AM
If you need a .311 bullet and the mould drops a bullet at .311 why do you have to size it? Just run it in the sizer die to lube and seat the gas check.

45-70marlin
12-28-2007, 07:52 AM
If the bullet is to small you could lap the mold out a bit.

eka
12-28-2007, 09:46 AM
It sounds to me like the 311284 would be just about the right size for you as cast. Like was said earlier, no sizing needed. Some feel sizing may hurt accuracy and as cast bullets tend to shoot better. However, in my limited experience, I have never found a reasonable amount of sizing to harm accuracy. I'd say the chances are that bullet would shoot great.
Good luck,

Keith

Loudenboomer
12-28-2007, 10:44 AM
If I had more room in the throat. I was going to go 2 thou. over groove. (.312.)
I was thinking .311 would be fine but got a little Leery when Lyman customer service said the .311 is for #2 alloy, wheel weights will be a shade smaller.

Maineboy
12-28-2007, 11:08 AM
I have an old unvented single cavity mold marked 308284. The boolit measures about .311-.312 on the driving bands but only about .298 or a bit more on that long nose and it does not shoot well in my worn throat, .310 bore Krag. What does give outstanding accuracy in my rifle is the .314299 sized .311 seated as far out as possible. The nose of that boolit is much fatter and will sit on the lands when a round is chambered. I've considered beagling the 308284 but never got around to it.

Shiloh
12-28-2007, 12:05 PM
What does give outstanding accuracy in my rifle is the .314299 sized .311 seated as far out as possible. The nose of that boolit is much fatter and will sit on the lands when a round is chambered. I've considered beagling the 308284 but never got around to it.

Ditto this.

The 314299 sized at .312 gives superb accuracy for my Krag. I seat them to engrave the boolit nose, and they still fit the magazine and cycle through the action. My 311299 drops boolits at .310+ and the nose at .298+. It shoots OK, but is little to small for fine accuracy.

I should try the 311299 with lino to see if is a little fatter, but I prefer to save it as alloy for "sweetening" my wheel weight metal. I don't have a lot of Lino.

Some of the folks on the forum have 311299's that are a little fatter and perform well with wheel weight alloy. Unfortunately, mine isn't one of them. :(
I never tried beagling it either.

Shiloh

Loudenboomer
12-28-2007, 12:29 PM
I've got a friend up here that is a big teflon tape fan. He says no problem if your boolit is a thou. or two to small. Just tape it before sizing.. I dunno.....:-?

Le Loup Solitaire
12-28-2007, 01:59 PM
311284 has been for me and many others an excellent performer in 30-06. A gentlemen by the name of Marshall thought very highly of it in his writings for Lyman in at least one of their loading manuals. Yes it was designed for the Krag and it is of a design that allows it to function well with other 30 cals. if like most other boolits, it is loaded correctly.
Lyman for a long time was "king of the oversize" and it was a real PITA. They turned a very deaf ear and blind eye to the fact and (despite) writings of icons in the world of reloading that the best shooting was done with boolits shot as cast and that sizing damaged the boolit; the more the sizing, the more the damage. References for this would include Sharpe, Harrison, Carmichael, Sears and others. Unfortunately the practice of saving cherry money and disregard for the shooter has carried on with some other manufacturers of boolit molds to this day. I once ordered a 30 cal mold from Redding for the excellent former RG-4 and got a version casting at .313. with WW. Aside from the fact that my 30cal bores measure .308 or .309 what was I supposed to do with .005? If I added any tin to the mix, the dia got even larger. I gave the mold to a friend to use in his .303 and it worked fine for him. Meanwhile as previously pointed out in another post, some iota of what was really going on finally penetrated "the mentality" and undersize versions began to appear, but as Col Harrison pointed out in his writings for the NRA handbook...if the undersize is carried too far and the nose of the boolit is allowed to go under..301 then the whole deal goes south as the nose doesn't ride...it slumps and so does the accuracy. If someone has one of the "slumpers"; molds can be taped or "beagled", they can be cast with more tin in the mix to play with the Terracorp concept, or they can be lapped in total or in part or they can be to some extent "bumped up" and they will do well. Some folks probably get the right mold to start with for what they want to do, but a lot don't so we have to work things out one way or the other to get it right.

Char-Gar
12-28-2007, 05:41 PM
I no longer worry about solutions to problems that may not present themselves. Buy your mold and run them though a 311 sizer to lube and crimp the gas check. Shoot them and see how things go.

Then and only them will you need to consider other options. I think you will find your initial results gratifying. This bullet seems to do best for me in the 1.6 to 1.8K fps range.

Most Krags will handled .312 to .313 bullets without having to neck turn the brass. I have one Krag that requires me to neck turn the brass to use .313 bullets.

Have fun...

Shiloh
12-29-2007, 01:04 PM
What are the measurements of the "as cast" from those of you with a Lyman 311284?? This would be with wheel weights as the alloy.


I acquired some yesterday after reading this post. They measure a fraction over .310 on the bands and just barely .299 on the nose. It turns in both the Krag and '03 when the nose is inserted in the muzzle.

Shiloh :castmine:

Loudenboomer
12-29-2007, 02:34 PM
Thanks Shiloh. Looking smallish from WW for me. Yes. It would be fun to see if others have fatter 311284's from WW and newer style moulds. The 314299 seems like it would work best all be it a little lighter than what I was looking for.

Shiloh
12-29-2007, 06:00 PM
The 314299 seems like it would work best all be it a little lighter than what I was looking for.

The 314299 works best in both my mentioned rifles as both the 311299 and the just measured 311284 are really just undersized. As mentioned earlier in this posting, and verified from some other mold and casting gun boards, the 311284 was designed specifically for the Krag rifle.

This was before there were folks scrounging wheel weights for boolit metal. I wonder what the alloy was that gave a boolit that would fit the often oversize bores of the Krag rifle?? Where thet using Lyman #2 or straight linotype??

I ask because there are a lot of folks whose molds drop boolits at .311 or more with a proper sized nose. My 311299 isn't, nor are the 311284 boolits that I just measured.

Shiloh :castmine: