35 Rem vs 357 Max

[crabo]

How would these two cartridges compare in a Contender carbine?

Thanks,

Crabo

[Scrounger]

From data I have seen it may be possible to approach .35 Remington velocities in a .357 Max of equal barrel length. Note I said "MAY." But the Max will be about 40K in chamber pressure and the .35 Rem considerably less. Both cases may be difficult to acquire at times. The same relationship exists between 7 TCU and 7-30 Waters. I think if you are using cast bullets, the lower chamber pressure of the .35 Rem and 7-30 Waters has the potential to produce greater accuracy.

[45r]

Rimmed cartridges are easier to work with in a contender.Both have enough power with a well placed shot.

[crabo]

The reason I ask this question, is that I have been toying with the idea of building a contender carbine for a knock around gun and plinker. I would want to shoot cast bullets in it. I have heard good things here about the 35 calibers being good deer calibers. I could shoot 357s in the max, but I don't have a clue how they would shoot from the max chamber.

[fourarmed]

In my limited experience (one revolver) magnums do not shoot accurately in maximum chambers. However, in the same revolver, 358429 crimped over the front band in front of (IIRC) 13 gr. of 4759 gave outstanding accuracy out to about 150 yds and is a mild load.

[wiljen]

Having had both, the 357 Max is more efficient and both cartridges are in the same class. VV120 is your best bet with the 357 Max.

[JSH]

I will agree to disagree.......................in part to the efficency thoughts. I have the 35 rem rimmed, use 303 or 30-40 brass. This is one of the better shooting rounds out the gate with the variety of bullets I have thrown at it.
I had a 357 max long enough to know that I was not going to fool with it after doing a chamber cast, factory barrel. Looked like a minerature 375WW to some extent. I would like a line up of equal barrel length, then use the same powders and bullets to compare them. The max works at a higher pressure so that would have to be kept in mind.
IMHO, there just is not any way the smaller case can keep up with the 35Rem with heavy bullets, say 170 and up.
Not to knock anything nor is this directed at you wiljen. I have just seen a lot of terms thrown around between the 35R and the max. Efficenctcy being the most used term. Run them both to equal pressures and lets see what is the truth or fact. I have wanted to compare the 357 mag, 357max, 35 Herret and the 35 rem for a long time. Have just never had all of them at the same time to do so.

I would really like to know what everyone deems "efficient"? I myself threw that out the window a long time ago when I started fooling with "pocket rifles". A grain or two of powder for the few cents, I don't worry about that and I am pretty darn tight myself.
I look more at what I want on the receiving end of the gun rather than what at what I am loading to get there, in a safe manner of course.
Sorry for hijacking the thread. I don't mean to come across as to offend any one of you guys. Just discussion.
Jeff

[357maximum]

Wanna guess what my vote on this one is?


I have done anything with my 15 inch max encore pistol, that my 35 rem 336 will do, and at far cheaper propellent costs. All I shoot is cast in both, same ol same ol......plus the max keeps me legal to the "straight walled pistol" rule michigan has for deer. I use wq'ed 50/50 ww/pure and have not one pressure issue, and the bullets expand beautifully in critters.

Rem 7.5 primers, and Vhit N-120 and just about any 170-215 gr design will make for small groups and big smiles in my 16 twister from MGM.

My vote has been cast....

[S.R.Custom]

In my limited experience (one revolver) magnums do not shoot accurately in maximum chambers.

Depends... heavier bullets tend to do better, specifically those with a long enough bearing surface that they can engage the chamber throat before they entirely leave the case. A 125 grainer, on the other hand, will clear the case before it contacts the throat, and for that instant the bullet is making the jump, the propellant gases will whistle right around the bullet and blow uselessly out of the barrel ahead of the bullet. Not much hope of accuracy in that instance...

Notice I said heavier bullets tend to do better, and by that I mean better than the 125 grainers. But not a whole lot. All that free-bore before the bullet hits rifling compromises accuracy by quite a bit. Jacketed bullets hold up better under that kind of abuse, and with the heavier jacketed bullets you can expect fairly decent accuracy.

You'll note that these are not concerns with the .35 Remington. And the .35 Rem ammo will work in your .35 Remington Marlin lever gun, too... :mrgreen:

[Scrounger]

Michael, do you consider MGM a better barrel than Thompson?

[357maximum]

I do....Jeff 223 did get one loser from them though.....I will take that MGM barrel to the grave with me. I had my rREAL throat cut short,........... I absolutely despise TC's "forcing cone" arrangement......worthless in IMNSHO.

[Scrounger]

I have an unfired carbine Thompson barrel, I have a chance to pick up an MGM carbine barrel. I think I will get it.

[jeff223]

here's a good read for you
http://specialtypistols.ottllc.com/sp10.html
my vote is for the 357max,i love this caliber
i shoot a G2 Contender with a 15 inch SSK barrel chambered in 357max and shes wearing a Burris 3x12 scope.its a real kick ass setup:mrgreen:

[Ed Barrett]

I have been shooting a .357 max for about 3 years in a single shot rifle, I have a 35 rem. but it is in a lever action. I've found the 357 max to be very accurate and very cast freindly. I would tend twords the 357 max.

[JSH]

Ed, are you going to the MVA winter show? I will buy ya a cup of coffe and visit. PM me with a phone# and I will call you. Missed you the last time, your pard felt ill if I recall.
Jeff

[35remington]

The max is a very efficient and velocity is very good for the small charges used.

How it ranks, power wise, to the .35 Remington depends upon how it is loaded, and whether or not you use the rather mild handloads and factory loads published and produced for the .35 Remington.

Sticking with the mild stuff for the .35 Remington, its potential for velocity isn't much higher than the Maximum, given the pressure levels of the Max and its smaller head size which tends to equalize any difference between the cartridges.

However, given a .35 Remington loaded for the Contender action, especially a G2, the .35 Remington will outrun the Max by a somewhat significant margin, given equal length but longer barrels-but in shorter than 14 inch I would tend to go with the Maximum. Friend has a .357 barrel chambered for the Max and is delighted with it. His is a 12 inch, and it may be the perfect woods cartridge, very economical to shoot and very accurate. This cartridge seems to have a lot of loyal followers, Dave included.

But unchain the .35 Remington from its rather low SAAMI allowance of 33,500 psi (okay with careful handloading) and the larger cased .35 Remington moves ahead of the Max by a pretty good amount. I am suggesting 42,000 equivalent loads. Given this 42,000 level pressure, a 336 .35 Remington rifle will easily outdo a .357 Maximum handgun.

In my own Contender (14 inches before the muzzle brake) 2300+ fps is easily possible with 180 Hornady SSP's with no difficult extraction or ejection even with the older frame design, which is ahead of what the Maximum will produce by a notable amount.

For your knock about carbine and plinker, which implies efficiency and easy shooting, I would go with the Maximum. Sort of a modern Schuetzen caliber.