Motorcycle Oil

[Scrounger]

Joe or any other engine expert: Remember my thread on tractors? Well I ended up buying an ATV. It can handle my light farm needs and The kids try to run the wheels off it when I let them. First time I serviced it, they sold me "Special Motorcycle Oil, $4.95 a Liter and Special oil filter, similarly over-priced". Recently I read some claims on the internet that regular oil for autos is actually better than the so-called "Special motorcycle oil". And that Fram and the other filter makers make standard priced filters for them, too. Considering that it needs to be serviced about once a month, the savings would be terrific. What are your thoughts on this?

[StarMetal]

Art

If your ATV has an aircooled engine there are different requirements for aircooled versus watercooled engines. Not that car engine oil won't work. I have a Suzuki ATV that I bought new in 95 and I've used the heck out of the thing, but I change oil and filter often in it. I use Castrol 10-50W because that sucker really gets hot in the summer here. I don't run it alot in the winter. I found a place on the internet and bought a bunch of filters for it at half the price that cycle shop here sells them for. Just as an aside, I remember when my brother bought his John Deere Model 112 lawntractor years ago. This was like back in the early 80's I believe. He was using John Deere oil at $3.69 a qt. I had to laugh when he told me. He asked what was so funny. I was working at the Sun Oil Refinery at that time and I had recently made a tour through the new canning facility and lo and behold there was a pallet of brand new ready to be filled John Deere Lawntractor oil cans. I told him that. At that time I believe a can of auto oil was way below a dollar. He was pissed. He said you mean to tell me that their special oil is nothing more the car oil? I said probably, may have had a few different specifications order by Deere. He never bought another can of their oil and the tractor is still running. They sell good products at the cycle shops Art, they are just way over priced. That's my opinion on the subject.

Joe

Oh Art, make sure you clean the airfilter often and if it requires oil on it do so.

[BCB]

Scrounger,
I have a Harley and I went to a brand name oil other than Harley because of the price. I took the bike to an independent mechanic to get some work done on the clutch. He is pretty efficient and when I went to pick up the bike, he asked me what oil I was putting in it. He knew it was not Harley oil—don’t ask me how he knew but he did. I believe he indicated the oil looked burnt. He actually changed the oil and filter and DID NOT CHARGE ME ONE CENT. He indicated that there was no better way to ruin the engine than to run oil other than Harley. It was the same SAE rating and weight and the whole deal. Don’t know, but I now run only the Harley oil. Fram filters were O.K. he said. Good-luck…BCB

[StarMetal]

BCB

Motorcycle clutches are wet clutches and run in the same oil as the engine. So some of the properties are different to be conductive to the clutches grabbing right and their wear. That is how he knew. The oil was probably getting burnt through the friction of the clutches slipping before they grab. I don't buy that you have to run Harley's oil in it and in fact know cyclists that don't and have no trouble. Don't forget, just as mine, that is that one mechanics opinion. All major oil companies make oil for alot of different applications and I'm sure you could find a good motorcycle oil from say Castrol for one, and cheaper then Harley's oil. Your eyes would probably pop out if you knew who makes Harley's oil for them.

Joe

[crazy mark]

Scrounger,
Go to www.denniskirk.com for fram filters and such for atv's and motorcycles. A good palce to buy stuff from. I used regular car oil in all my Honda street bikes over the years and never replaced a clutch or had any problems. Mark

[454PB]

As previously mentioned, many ATV's and motorcycles (Harley and BMW excluded) run wet clutches. Do not use any oil containing friction modifiers if the clutch is wet. In general, oils of 10w/30 and lower contain friction modifiers. So, stay with 10w/40 or 20w/50 and you are fine.

There is a lot of snobbery and bickering in the world of motorcycling concerning any consumable product (tires, oil, filters etc.). In my 40 years of motorcyling, I've learned to listen a lot and form my own opinions through careful experimentation.....kind of like shooting/casting/handloading!

[sc03a3]

just .02 from an old harley rider, the clutch and trans oil are separate from the engine oil in a harley.and no matter what you hear about other oil's being ok for use in a harley, don't beleve it. use only harley oil if you want a long and trouble-free life span for your engine. if your atv is air cooled it takes an oil made for air cooled engines, if liquid cooled then a oil like castrol 20/50w is fine.....sc03a3

[StarMetal]

For all that believe sc03A3's two cents read this:

http://www.oilsandlube.com/harleydavidson.htm

Joe

[sc03a3]

hi starmetal, ive been riding harleys since 1958, bought my last new one in 1990. i have no experence with amsol oils, but over the years i have saw a large number of trashed harleys that the owners used oils like penn or quaker 50w or 20w-50w[depending on engine type]for awhile folks were even tring areoshell "but its for air-cooled engines" with the same results as the penn/quaker boys. amsol may be the best oil in the world, but at around 9.00 a qt i will stick with harley, i know it works.....sc03a3

[David R]

You didn't say what brand your 4 wheeler is, but if its a polaris, they use 0W-40 synthetic oil in the engine. No ,it doesn't have to have the motorcycle brand on the bottle, but the specs have to be the same. Honda uses 10-W40............

I am sure if you keep it changed, no matter what brand you use as long as the specs are the same, you will have no trouble.


David

[rugerman1]

Need Oil Answers? Go to BobIsTheOilGuy Forum (http://theoildrop.server101.com/cgi/ultimatebb.cgi) .Look in the Motor Cycle Lubrication section and the Motorcycle UOAs(Used Oil Analysis) section.I used to be an Administrator/Moderator over there when I had more time available online.
Short answer:Use a HDEO(Heavy Duty Engine Oil),otherwise known as a diesel spec oil.These include,but not limited to:
Shell Rotella,both the dino 15w-40 http://www.shell-lubricants.com/products/images/50012_1.jpg (http://www.shell-lubricants.com/products/pdf/RotellaTMG.pdf)
and the GRPIII Syn 5w-40 http://www.shell-lubricants.com/products/images/54300_1.jpg (http://www.shell-lubricants.com/products/pdf/RotellaTSynthetic.pdf)
Pennzoil Long Life http://www.pennzoil.com/products/LongLife/images/LLHandigrip.jpg (http://www.sopus-staging.com/staging/longlife/site/LongLife.pdf)
Chevron Delo 400 http://www.chevrontexacodelo.com/resources/productschevronengineoil.jpg (http://library.cbest.chevron.com/lubes/compprd9.nsf/c88c682625e06af6882568db00737ce8/354b782d14879c3d88256dd60066c76a/$FILE/HDMO-30.pdf)
Mobil Delvac 1300 Super http://www.shopdiesel.com/images/large/MD1300SG1.jpg (http://www.mobil.com/USA-English/Lubes/PDS/NAUSE2CVLMOMobil_Delvac_1300_Super.asp)
Mobil Delvac 1 Synthetic http://store1.yimg.com/I/avlube_1857_588232 (http://www.mobil.com/USA-English/Lubes/PDS/GLXXENCVLMOMobil_Delvac_1_5W-40.asp)

[Willbird]

I prefer the rotella myself, my brother in law got me onto it, I especially like the convience of buying it in gallons not quarts.

As to HD, I used to hang out with a guy that worked on them full time, for a real eye opener some time picture a new HD with all the foriegn parts removed...there won't be enough left to ride.

If I somehow lost my mind and bought one of those thumping lurching dino's I sure wouldnt use their oil in it...............

All the bikes we saw the inside of there were zero zip oil related problems of any kind, , and that is with every brand and kind of oil out there, the ONLY problem we ever saw was some dipstick with a ponytail in his beard that thought straight STP would work. Otherwise keep oil in them, they lurch and thump on and on and on just like the energiser bunny...........if there is a theme to HD engines it is tractorlike......and robust is not a bad thing.

some HD's use the clutch pack from GM automatic transmissions, and GM for sure doesnt use harley oil in there....that clutch pack is very lightly loaded in a motorcycle as compared to a schoolbus.

Bill

[David R]

I have been using 15W 40 diesel oil in my BMW R75/6 since 1991. Still runs fine. Its great oil.

Same as any other motor, CLEAN is more important than which brand by far.

Oil breaks down by tempature. This is why you can get away with Never changing the diff oil in your car. It never gets hot and there are no combustion by products getting into it.

If your oil runs at 225 dagrees F, it will last so long before it starts breaking down. If it runs @ 325, then it breaks down sooner and has to be changed sooner.

This is why the new cars have motor oil coolers and aluminum oil pans.

David.

[waksupi]

Trying a picture

[StarMetal]

General Motors use to put oil coolers on Corvettes shipped to Europe, mainly Germany, because they knew they would be run at very high speeds for long times on the autoban. That would overheat the oil in any car. Well they discovered the could eliminate building an oil cooler by running those Vettes to Germany on Mobil 1 oil. That synthetic is that much better then regular motor oils. Now it's not worth you to use it in your family car especially if you change oil every 3000 miles. If you were going to go alot longer between changes and ran your car hard, then yes.

Joe

[David R]

When it gets to -35f or so, Mobil one works as good as a block heater.