43 Spanish barrel

[Norm]

I have a real nice Argentine Rolling Block that has a possible ringed chamber. I'm looking for a replacement barrel or parts gun. The action and stock are in real good condtion and I'd sure like to keep loading and shooting 43s. Any help would be appreciated.
I'm recently retired from the Army, and new to black powder single shot rifles. Just got this roller last spring. I love the long sight radius and long range shooting fun.

[Buckshot]

I have a real nice Argentine Rolling Block that has a possible ringed chamber. I'm looking for a replacement barrel or parts gun. The action and stock are in real good condtion and I'd sure like to keep loading and shooting 43s. Any help would be appreciated.
I'm recently retired from the Army, and new to black powder single shot rifles. Just got this roller last spring. I love the long sight radius and long range shooting fun.

Hey Norm, and welcome to the board! Have you made any investigation of the 'Possible' chamber ring yet? Why do you think it has a ring?

If it turns out that it does have a ringed chamber, my only suggestion would be to contact gunsmiths catering to the BPCR crowd, as they might have some take off barrels cluttering up the corners. I had bought a 1897 RB in 7x57 in good external condition but the barrel was trash internally.

We were up visiting my daughter who was in college in Columbia, CA. As it was up in the gold country of the Sierras I decided to check out the yellow pages for possible gunshops to look into while there. There was a listing for the Sharon Barrel company, and I'd heard of them before too. I called about my smokless RB action and getting a barrel for it (In some BP cartridge). The guy said why do that if it was so nice? Said he just happened to have a super barrel that came off one and I could have it for $100.

I drove over to check it out and it was like brand new so I snagged it. He said he'd spent considerable time trying to convince the PO to leave his RB like it was, since it too was a nice one and they ain't making no more of'em :-).

...................Buckshot

[Norm]

Hi Buckshot
The rifle was putting a little dimple on the case necks. I had my gunsmith look at it and he said it was a possible ring. He advised not to shoot it except for possible light loads of pistol powder and a round ball. I want it for long range. So I'm looking for a new barrel.
Good idea! I know some of the silhouette shooters get new target barrels. Those old barrels have to be somewhere!
Thanks for your interest and input. I appreciate it very much.

Norm

[nitroproof]

Norm~

'bout 15 years ago I came across a .43 Spanish roller with a rough bore. I had it relined to 45/70. Liner's invisable and it shoot great.

[Boz330]

Buckshot, there used to be a Sharon Barrel Co. back in the 70s that made some of the best ML barrels going, but I thought they went out of business. Wouldn't happen to be the same place would it?
I have one of their barrels in a 58cal that is in the process of becoming a Hawkin Rifle. I'm expecting good things from it. IIRC they sold for $200 back in the 70s which was a pretty good chunk of change then.

Bob

[KCSO]

If you are going to stick to b/p pressures or close why not reline the chamber. Have a gunsmith bore out and thread the chamber area and screw in a liner and rechamber. I have dont this to a couple of trapdoors with good bores and ringed chambers and it worked out good.

[Norm]

KCSO, That sounds like a winner. I'll talk with the smithy about it. Thanks all for the interest and help.

Norm

[Buckshot]

Buckshot, there used to be a Sharon Barrel Co. back in the 70s that made some of the best ML barrels going, but I thought they went out of business. Wouldn't happen to be the same place would it?
I have one of their barrels in a 58cal that is in the process of becoming a Hawkin Rifle. I'm expecting good things from it. IIRC they sold for $200 back in the 70s which was a pretty good chunk of change then.

Bob

...............Same company, different owners. I was there in the mid 90's.

............Buckshot

[WBH]

I think you will find that a good re-lining job will run you $250-$300. And I mean a good one, because there are alot of off-center and ill-fitted jobs out there. A new Green Mountain barrel won't cost you much more installed. Just my 2 cents.

[TNsailorman]

The problem that I ran into several years ago was to find a gunsmith that could and would chamber for the .43 Spanish. I still haven't found one. If anyone knows of one who does reasonable work, please post it so some of us might take advantage. Most gunsmiths I have talked to about my rolling block want to rebore and rechamber for the 45/70 or 45/90.

[MtGun44]

I have a RB in .43 Spanish and so far (not a lot of effort) have gotten
only mediocre results, even tho the bore is pretty good. To me the best
argument for the rebore to .45-70 is the darned brass. It is over $1.50
per case, and not particularly high quality. I have had a couple of primer
pocket floors rip out when seating a primer. (Bertram)

The other issue is the range of bullet molds and diameters available. There
is really only one non-custom mold out there (Lyman) and the super expensive
RCBS semi-custom. The 45-70 has dozens and dozens of sizes, designs and
diameter molds available.

Also, the .45-70 has been around for 100 yrs when all those others fell bythe
wayside for a reason. It is very accurate with many loads and brass lasts
nearly forever, most rifles are not picky. Goes from 700 fps plinking loads to
540 Garrett Hammerheads knocking over pachyderms, and everything in
between - it can almost be all things to all users.

So - I have one, but the caliber swap does sound kinda attractive. . . . .

Bill

[Buckshot]

..............Of course they wanna do 45-70 or 45-90 :-) Lots of moulds, brass is cheap. Even 45-90 is cheap compared to 43 Spanish, and who is campaigning a 43 Spanish in ANYTHING except us wierdo's, ha! Every gunsmith has a 45-70 reamer and every other gunsmith has a 45-90 reamer. Plus there are many different 45 cal barrels available out there.

http://www.fototime.com/7CD7CAD02940F78/standard.jpg

This is my Rem RB in 43 Spanish. A 1879 Argentine contract rifle.

http://www.fototime.com/23E5560C8BB6BF7/standard.jpg

Some targets shot with it. These were at 50 yards.

.................Buckshot

[The Double D]

Hi Buckshot
The rifle was putting a little dimple on the case necks. I had my gunsmith look at it and he said it was a possible ring. He advised not to shoot it except for possible light loads of pistol powder and a round ball. I want it for long range. So I'm looking for a new barrel.
Good idea! I know some of the silhouette shooters get new target barrels. Those old barrels have to be somewhere!
Thanks for your interest and input. I appreciate it very much.

Norm

Norm,

I'd find a different Gunsmith. Ringed chambers don't make dimples in brass they make bulges.
If you are getting dimpled brass it could be from debris in the chamber. Could be dirt, could be oil or maybe a little rust or corrosion. Push comes to shove you could have the chmaber lined.

[Norm]

The problem that I ran into several years ago was to find a gunsmith that could and would chamber for the .43 Spanish. I still haven't found one. If anyone knows of one who does reasonable work, please post it so some of us might take advantage. Most gunsmiths I have talked to about my rolling block want to rebore and rechamber for the 45/70 or 45/90.

Ditto TN, I'd sure like to locate a gunsmith that would do this.
Double D, I guess I wasn't clear, but the "dimple" is a little bulge, like from a pit in the chamber. I'm talking with Delta Gunshop in Colville WA and he is considering options. He didn't sound too positive about a .43 rechamber, tho.
I know a new barrel is in the same range, but If possible to keep it the same as issued, I'd prefer it. Last resort, a 45-70 rebore or rebarrel is what I'll do.

[Bull Schmitt]

With the number of 43 Spanish Rilling Blocks that have been rebarreled over the years I would think you should be able to find a "take off" replacement at a reasonable price. Many of these original barrels had fine bores.

[The Double D]

Ditto TN, I'd sure like to locate a gunsmith that would do this.
Double D, I guess I wasn't clear, but the "dimple" is a little bulge, like from a pit in the chamber. I'm talking with Delta Gunshop in Colville WA and he is considering options. He didn't sound too positive about a .43 rechamber, tho.
I know a new barrel is in the same range, but If possible to keep it the same as issued, I'd prefer it. Last resort, a 45-70 rebore or rebarrel is what I'll do.

Okay that sounds better. A pit is not a bulge, but the problem is the same. That being the case the issue with chamber reline is the way to go. Of course you are going to have to come up with a .43 Spanish Reamer. Short of buying one you will have to look real hard to find one. If you really had your heart set on .43 that is your only recourse.

So your options. Find a take off barrel that will fit. Key word fit. It may or may not fit. If the tenon is too short you can cut the shoulder back into the barrel times up. If it is to long you migth be able to adjust with spacers and shoulder cuts.

Better options. Rebarrel of course or reline the existing barrel to 45/70. Rebore if you can find someone to do it cheap enough. Relining and reboreing keep the same exterior profile.

There is one other thing you might try. It's a bit on the wacky side. I have a Turkish Martini that I am going to try it with.

Is this a bulge or a pit you have in your chamber. I don't think this will work for a bulge, but it should for a pit.

I have a Turkish Martini that has what appears to be a hole drilled in the chamber wall from in side. The Hole does not go very deep. From the debris found in the rifle and the marks on the action it appears someone tried to make a chamber cast with lead. The when they couldn't get the lead out they drilled the lead plug . The drill went through and made a hole in the chamber wall at the shoulder. A chamber cast shows a perfect impression of a drill bit.

I was going to reline the chamber. I may still. First what I am going to is fill the drilled hole with either Devcon steel or JB Weld and then rechamber. We'll see what happens when I shoot the gun. If it works, well and good. If it doesn't then I will reline the chamber.

As I said a bit wacky. I hear the Milsurp guys are doing this with pitted chambers.

Good luck.

[MtGun44]

Buckshot,

Well - you certainly showed what the .43 Spanish can do! Looks like I'll
just need to work harder with mine. :-D

Thanks for the good examples. Are all of those 23.0 of SR4759 with some
Dacron? What diameter boolit did you use?

Thanks.

Bill

[Bullshop]

Norm
You got me to thinkin about a roller I have. Its a re arsenalised arg 43 spanish in perty darn good condition with about a mint bore. I want an action to build a custom job on but cant bring myself to cut this one up. If you think you may want to talk about some horse tradin let me know.
BIC/BS

[Buckshot]

Buckshot,

Well - you certainly showed what the .43 Spanish can do! Looks like I'll
just need to work harder with mine. :-D

Thanks for the good examples. Are all of those 23.0 of SR4759 with some
Dacron? What diameter boolit did you use?

Thanks.

Bill

..........Bill, targets on the left were fired with SR4759 + dacron. Those on the right were shot with 28.0 grs of H4198 + dacron. Boolits were sized .440" and were WW with a bit of tin. Sorry, that's what I wrote in my book :-). This was someitme back and I didn't have a hardness tester, nore does it appear I weighed tin I'd put in.

...............Buckshot

[TNsailorman]

Buckshot, my .43 Spanish shoots minute of pie plate with the Lyman cast bullets that were supposed to be 378 grain but actually came from the mould at 391 to 401 grains and a diameter of .442. I never sized them as I never had a bullet lube/sizer. I either coated the bullet with the then new Lee alox or paperpatched them as they came from the mould. I didn't expect too much at the time because the rifling was not too good, being shallow, worn and slightly rounded. I always loaded black powder also, usually 3F but I did try some 2F. The 3F semmed to shoot a little better but not much. I lost the mould years ago when the city flooded my basement while I was gone on a trip and the mould was rusted pretty good by the time I got back. City refused to pay for the approximately $1200.00 worth of moulds, dies, and Lyman casting pot as well as several pieces of loading equipment. After seeing your loads and the results I think I will try one more time to get my rolling block back in action. I know with a worn barrel it will never be a tackdriver but maybe I can cut that pie plate in half. Any suggestion would certainly be appreciated. I have some of the Bertram brass(quality varies with Bertram, some Bell cases(very good brass with thick walls), and even some Remington that is factory original(with berdam primers no less). About 300 cases all told. James

[Norm]

Hey guys, here's the latest on my predicament. I was looking for a roller to use as a parts gun, and bid on one at Gunbroker. Got it. It has the same octagonal area around the chamber that mine has, with a very good bore :-D
Then the gunsmith called and proposed a reline, and has a line on a .43 reamer.
So that is what I'm gonna do. If I can keep the original barrel (which is pretty near excellent) I'll be happy.
So now I'll have 2 rollers. :-D:-D
I may take down the new one and do a restoration, maybe not. We'll see.
On that weird idea, another fella at e-gunparts suggested using Steel Bed, available at Brownell's. I didn't have the guts to try that myself, but some folks are making it work.

[paul edward]

If you are going to stick to b/p pressures or close why not reline the chamber. Have a gunsmith bore out and thread the chamber area and screw in a liner and rechamber. I have dont this to a couple of trapdoors with good bores and ringed chambers and it worked out good.

My 7mm RB has an oversize chamber. The barrel has already been set back and rechambered, but the problem remains. The local gunsmith school did the work but were not confidant that it would be safe to set the barrel back another turn.

Brass life is short due to case stretching so I load it at about 75% of suggested starting charges. The rifle, however shoots well and I would like to keep it in use.

I had thought of a replacement chamber as suggested by KCSO, but nobody I know seems to know much about the process. What is involved in re-lining a chamber?

PED

[StrawHat]

My 7mm RB has an oversize chamber.

Brass life is short due to case stretching so I load it at about 75% of suggested starting charges.
PED

I am willing to bet your brass life is short because you are using off the shelf 7mm dies.

Have you tried just neck sizing the brass after the first firing? That way the only brass that is moved is in the neck and not the whole casing.

If that works, you might consider a oversized set of dies. Okay custom dies are probably a better way of descibing them but that sounds expensive.

Then again, probably cheaper than a new barrel or relining a chamber.

Good Luck

[vernz]

Norm,

My gunsmith has an Argentine RB barrel in .43 Spanish with a pristine bore. It is the one without the Argentine army stamp on the upper knoxform flat. He wants $200 for it.

Vern

[dakota]

I was thinking a rechamber to 45 or 50 Alaskan and shoot only cast loads in one.

[Fast Asleep]

I suggest you contact JES Reboring to have your 43 barrel rebored and rechambered to 50/70 or 50/90.

[marlinman93]

I suggest you contact JES Reboring to have your 43 barrel rebored and rechambered to 50/70 or 50/90.

I sure hope he's figured this out after 15 years have passed!

[15meter]

I sure hope he's figured this out after 15 years have passed!

I like archeological digs. I've got a .43 and would have never found this thread without the excavation of others.

And I've been guilty on more than a few occasions of rescitating dead(almost) threads.

[missionary5155]

Retired... ex-military....
But yea our 43's like the RCBS .446 FN cast of 40-1 with 2F Goex and a cereal box wad..