Which Chronograph?

[mtgrs737]

I don't know if this is the right place for this question, but I didn't see anywhere else that it fit any better.

I am looking to get a chronograph to use in testing loads for my cast boolits and would like to hear from those here that have a chronograph and like it.

Thanks in advance!

Rich

[Sundogg1911]

I have a Chrony Beta Master with indoor shooting lights. It works well. I had a Pro-Chrono that also worked well, but a Buddy of mine mistook it for Big Game and Shot it! (He did pay me for it though) Either one would be a decent choice in my opinion.

[freedom475]

As far as cheap "in-home",I have had two Chrony"s and they worked Ok. One I shot on purpose because I was sick of it reading Error in bright sun light:twisted:. The other I shot on accident with a scoped revolver[smilie=1: My brother And I both have a Pro-chrono and we both prefer the Pro-Chrono's.:Fire: They are both good choices and we set them up in-line with the VERY-expensive unit that the range has and they were very well metered.

[AZ-Stew]

The Chrony units are good enough for our work. I prefer the ones that allow the control head containing the electronics and display to be brought back to the shooting bench, rather than being exposed to fire while attached to the metal case and sensor unit.

A couple of caveats:

If you shoot at a public range, string some kind of barrier or visual indicator (rope with pennants, surveyor's tape, crime scene tape, etc.) between the bench and the sensor unit so no one will walk between them, get their feet tangled in the control cable and pull your control head and display off the bench and ruin the display. One of the range masters at our range did mine in during a target changing break. I have to send the head back for replacement of the display.

When lining up your rifle or hand gun to shoot over the chronograph, be sure it is firmly supported on a proper gun rest (depending on whether its a long gun or a handgun), sight along the side of the firearm and along the top of the firearm to be sure you will be shooting through the "window" that exists above the sensors, below the sunshades and between the sunshade support rods. Don't rely solely on the view you see through your sighting device, and don't shoot without using a rest. Your chrono will last a lot longer.

Regards,

Stew

[mtgrs737]

Thanks for the replys guys, I will be looking at the units suggested. Anyone have one of the PACT units?

[standles]

I went with the CED version and the InfraRed screens. I would always get no or wierd readings on other crony's on overcast days. I also shoot inside sometimes and it was eaiser than a light addition.

The new version out claims to be moresensitive and not needing the IR upgrade except indoors.

Steven

[Swamprat1052]

I have a Pact and it seems to do the job. I bought it cause if I shoot it, I only mess up the cheap stuff, the real works are back on the bench with me and even I shouldnt hit it there. I've never shot it, but I know its just a matter of time. If you go with a pact be sure to remove the battery everytime when you are finished, if I dont do that I buy lots of batteries. It pulls them down when not in use, at least mine does. Thats the only problem I have had with it.

Swamprat

[dragonrider]

I have a pact, first generation, been using it for years. Except for the 3 or 4 time I or a friend have shot the skyscreens I have been very pleased with it. I would buy it again.

[Ranch Dog]

CED for me!

[piwo]

Thanks for the replys guys, I will be looking at the units suggested. Anyone have one of the PACT units?

I have the BETA CHRONY...... I like it, had it for years.....

[crowbuster]

same thing swamprat said, i really like mine. easy to setup and use as well.

[mtgrs737]

Thanks for the replies guys, I appreciate them!, I will be looking at them all real soon!

[Shiloh]

I have the BETA CHRONY...... I like it, had it for years.....

Ditto This.

A reliable inexpensive unit.:)

Shiloh

[JohnH]

The main thing to remember about chronographs is that they are light sensitive and sensitive to where the boolit crosses over the electric eye.

Lightly shaded or scacttered light (bright but overcast skies) is always best, but the most important detail here is that the light condition be consistant, irregular readings can result if you are shooting while fast moving cloud cover creates alternate bright and shaded light.

As well, the height above the electric eye, and the windage over the electric eye can affect the readings. You want the boolit to be centered ovver the eye's "vision window" and you want the height of the boolits path to be consistant.

Some will discount (throw out) a first shot reading if it is higher or lower than the remainder of the shots readings. Don't do this, this is telling you something about your rifle and load combination. If you see this condition, fire another group of loads over the clock on a different day and see if the results are similar. As well, I always fire the shots I'm clocking onto a target for group. I've seen some strange combinations. I"ve seen first shot high or low but within the tolerance of the velocity statistics, and I've seen the first shot be dead inthe group, yet out of the velocity statistics.

Standard Deviation is very important. What it tells is is what velocity we can expect a lod to produce, above or below the average velocity. Example: If we have an average of 2000 fps and a SD of 30, then we can expect each shot fired to be at or between 1970 and 2030 fps. If your first shot consistantly clocks out of that, somethings afoot, though not nessicarily bad. Typical bell curves for statistical process control are based on 3 standard deviations =/- the average. Using our example, we wouldn't consider something really wrong with a lod untill it was less than 1910 fps or greater than 2090 fps. (Understand that I am applying machine tool manufactuering practice here but in clocking more than 5000 rounds over the last 5 years, the practice fits pretty good) I fire 2, 5 shot groups allowing the barrel to cool fro at least 5 minutes between groups and then use the ten shots for the math. Groups of less that than 10 will produce statistical anomolies.

I've seen some outstanding statistical loads that wouldn't stay on a pie plate and some lousy statistical loads that shoot very well. Add distance to those and the groups began to rapidly fall apart. Obviously what we are looking for are loads that produce low statistical variations and good groups. Mostly what that tells us is that our loading practices are consistant.

For most of us, a chronograph is at it's most useful in telling us when we've reached pressure limits. Since we don't have pressure guns, then the only other means of knowing what is happening in our gun is knowing the velocity a load is producing. We often work with powders of unknown quality, and assuming that one lot of 846 is the same as another can be disasterous. A lot (production run) of powder for military use is developed on a spec of burning rate, typically allowing as much as a 10% variation from the desired norm. Military loadings of that powder are based on closed bomb tests of that particular lot and some of what we use can be out of spec. Obviously thats why it may have shown up on the surplus market. Without knowing what the velocity of load is producing, it is impossible to know or even have a working guess of what pressures are being produced.

[mainiac]

Ive had a pro-chrono for years. It has things in it rattling around when you move it. Dont know what is in there, but ive never had a problem with this thing. When it dies,I will buy another just like it.

[racepres]

Ive had a pro-chrono for years. It has things in it rattling around when you move it. Dont know what is in there, but ive never had a problem with this thing. When it dies,I will buy another just like it.

Me Too!!

[MakeMineA10mm]

I went with the CED version and the InfraRed screens. I would always get no or wierd readings on other crony's on overcast days. I also shoot inside sometimes and it was eaiser than a light addition.

The new version out claims to be moresensitive and not needing the IR upgrade except indoors.

Steven


As you can tell from reading many of the posts above, there are some considerations - quality and sensitivity of the "eyes", size of the opening you're shooting through (so you don't accidentally shoot the unit), and general accuracy (which includes things like less susceptable to changing light conditions, verification of the velocity, etc.).

IMO, the best chrono for the shooting public that is reasonable size and price is the Oehler Model 35P. Unfortunately, when I met Dr. Oehler at the NRA show in St. Louis in April, he informed me that they have discontinued manufacturing of this unit. He said the components were getting so expensive, he's worried that a necessary price increase would slow sales to a stand-still. The 35P had the excellent quality of being two chronos in one, lined up in the same plane. For each shot you got two velocities, and if they differed by too much, the computer inside the unit gave you an error code. It would also give you the option of including or excluding the error readings from your averages... VERY nice unit.

For anyone who still needs a chrono, but can't find the Oehler, the CED is my second choice. Like the Oehler, it has a large shooting window (harder to shoot the unit - but still not impossible...) and quite good, sensitivity "eyes". It does NOT have the proof channel (second clock and second start screen) that double checks the accuracy of the reading on each shot, but no other chrono does... The CED also has a nice separate control head, and the largest (easiest to read) digital read-out in the industry.

So, there's my two choices...

[wmitty]

no body mentioned the Oehler model 12... 27 years old and still giving yesses and no's and it's always getting a laugh from someone who's never seen one before.

[armoredman]

I havea Chrony F1. I shot it the sixth round I fired over it, blew off a skyscreen. Just repaired it after it sat for over a year, haven't had t back out yet. Not sure if I'll even keep it.

[JIMinPHX]

I bought the low end Chrony (F1?) about 20 years ago for about $65. It’s had thousands of rounds over it & still works well today. Accuracy still seems quite good. Two of the 6 sky screen pieces turned yellow after about 10 years, but that doesn’t seem to cause it much trouble. In low light conditions, I need to shoot a little close to the sensor to get it to register the shot, like within about 3”. In brighter light, it works just like it’s supposed to. The only down side to this cheap little unit, is that you need to stop after each shot & write down the velocity it just recorded. Some of the higher end models will store strings of shots & do statistical analysis for you. I never felt the need for all that. I can do my own math & record keeping. In the 20 years since I got mine, the price has gone up, but not that much. I think they are a very good value.

[montana_charlie]

Some of the higher end models will store strings of shots & do statistical analysis for you. I never felt the need for all that. I can do my own math & record keeping.
The F1 will do that, too. All it needs is a switch plugged into the little jack on the left side of the box...at the front.

The information it will display is the same stuff the Beta gives you, but only for one string of shots.
CM

[HABCAN]

I have had my PACT for about 15 years, and it has performed beautifully, giving me information I didn't know I needed until I had it, LOL. The fact that I can use it OFF-range as a ballistic calculator to play 'what-if' on is a big plus.

I always set it up at the range so as to fire for group at 100 yards while measuring velocities, thus killing two birds with one shot as it were, ensuring centering on a certain POA. (A friend once put two shots through the front counter when he changed POA, but paid me dearly for doing so!! Canadian Customs had one helluva time figuring out what 'gun' the replacement parts were for, hehe.)

To preclude that happening I put masking tape markers on the front screen support arms, and align that space from the bench firing point with the POA when setting it all up. Take your time setting up and save the big bucks!

You never realize just how useful that gadget is until you have one. Also, set up on the club range, you can make a little money chronoing other guys loads for them. (You really have to trust them to follow instructions before allowing them to fire through the screens!)

Enjoy it when you get it!

[JIMinPHX]

The F1 will do that, too. All it needs is a switch plugged into the little jack on the left side of the box...at the front.

The information it will display is the same stuff the Beta gives you, but only for one string of shots.
CM

I never noticed that little port before. I'll have to try that out sometime.

Thanks,
Jim