Ardesa Deerhunter .45 caliber

[iwottopq]

Hello to all.
Anyone use this rifle?
This gun is no much expensive in Italy (about 200 euros) so I would like to purchase.
How it shoot???
What is the best minie stile boolit to use in it??? (possibly by Lee moulds!!!)
Can you suggest me some charge of BP???
Sorri for this many questions but I am new in the muzzleloading word.
Thanks in advance.
Nino

[Dan Cash]

Welcome to the forum iwottopq. I don't know your rifle by Ardesa. A picture would be nice. The charge of black powder will depend upon caliber/size of bore and bullet weight. If the rifling pitch is not too fast, I would recommend a patched round ball. It will have more velocity, shoot flatter and use less lead = cheaper to shoot. If you buy the gun, best of luck to you with it.
Dan

[fouronesix]

Info about that brand is sketchy here in the US. I suppose it is somewhat like many of the basic half stock models that have been made since the 70s. It may very well have a 48" twist bore- but you'll need to check.

There is one common 45 cal Minié mold available from Lee. I have never been able to get the Lee 45 cal Minié to shoot well in any rifle. Lee also makes a 45 cal solid base conical called the REAL. Some shooters have luck with the solid base REAL.

Or if you can find one, I'd suggest trying a Maxiball- another style of solid base conical. Lyman makes a 45 cal Maxiball mold.

Also, it may shoot a patched roundball very well. I'd start with a .440" roundball with pillow ticking patch.

A rule of thumb about starting loads is one grain blackpowder per caliber. So about 40-45 grains blackpowder would be a good staring point.

"error corrected"

[dondiego]

I'd start with a 0.440 round ball and 45 grains of gunpowder.

[725]

fouronesix's advice is spot on, however I think he misspoke in advising ".490" ball. For the .45 use the .440 ball. Other than that, follow what he said and you'll do well. By the way, the .45 Maxi-ball boolit he suggested is a great boolit. Can't say which is better a round ball or conical. Both are very good and performance will vary based on rifling twist and powder used. Round balls tend to like slow twists and conicals tend to like faster twists. Not knowing your rifle, I can not comment. Best of luck & welcome aboard. Lots of good guys here with lots of experience.

[fouronesix]

Yah! :mrgreen: That's what I get for posting without a first cup of morning coffee! Doh! Should have been a .440" roundball instead of .490" for a 45 cal !!! Thanks for the catch and original post corrected.

[mooman76]

I looked this gun up on line. Yours probably has the same 1/66 twist rate but this isn't always the case. Roundballs will probably work best with this twist. Like others said start with a .440 patched roundball and 45 grains of powder. Work up in 5 grain increments until you find what shoots best.

[fouronesix]

I found just the opposite with a search. Ardesa/Traditions half stock Deerhunter models usually have a 48" twist in 50 and 45 cals. Possibly the longrifle/"Kentucky" models would be more likely to have the slower twist.
No matter, the only way to know would be to measure it.

[fa38]

I see everyone has recommended the .440 round ball and not .445.
Does the .445 round ball not usually work as well?

[mooman76]

I see everyone has recommended the .440 round ball and not .445.
Does the .445 round ball not usually work as well?

It really depends on the fit. If the ball is too tight, you have to go with a thin patch and it may not hold up. .445 can be better in a slightly larger bore or even a rifle that has seen some ware, where it would fit better. Just another variable in shooting. It's easier to go with a slightly smaller ball where you can always go with a thicker patch but you can only go so thin.

[fouronesix]

Hard to say but usually the .440 works better and is somewhat more universal and forgiving in the "average" 45 cal bore. That doesn't mean the .445 won't work or in some case be more accurate, but in my experience the .440 is the one to start with- if for no other reasons than ease of loading and practicality. If the .440 is a little loose then no problem getting some slightly thicker patch material. If on the other hand the .445 is a bit too tight then it can become problematic in finding thinner suitable patch material.

On the flip side, sometimes the very last wee bit of accuracy comes with a fatter ball, thinner patch and much tighter fit. But it may come at a price of harder starting (even up to requiring a mallet) and maybe more frequent cleaning or swabbing.

[badgeredd]

In my H&A Under-hammer, a .440 is too tight. I use a .437 RB with normal (for me) patching. I tried some linen patches (as it is thinner) with the .440 RB and it was still too tight. My normal load is 55-70 grains of 3F, depending on the purpose of the load.

Edd

[waksupi]

I have a .45 here, waiting for DeanD to pick up. It takes a .429 ball to be happy. The barrel was made by the guy who taught Bill Large how to build barrels.

Foreign made barrels generally need larger diameter balls. I've noticed the same thing with .54 barrels. Many custom barrels seem to like .526, while imports tend to use .530-.535.

Ho un .45 qui, in attesa di deand per pick up. Ci vuole una palla 0,429 per essere felice. La canna è stata fatta dal ragazzo che ha insegnato Bill Large come costruire barili.

Barili Esteri fatta in genere bisogno grandi palle di diametro. Ho notato la stessa cosa con 0,54 barili. Molti barili personalizzati sembrano apprezzare 0,526, mentre le importazioni tendono ad usare 0,530-,535.

[fouronesix]

Sorry, I don't read or speak Italian. From the various posts almost sounds like the standard European bore diameter is different from nominal. Does that mean if you buy or have a European 45 cal whatever, it is more like a 44 caliber?

The only one that seemed to fit that definition across the board was the old Western Arms 54 cal Santa Fe Hawken (made by Uberti) that turned out to be a true 53 cal bore and required .520 roundballs.... to the point that Lyman actually made a .520 roundball mold for a while for that specific purpose.

For iwottopq, the best answer to your OP would be to slug the bore of your 45 cal then make a judgment on best roundball size to start with. Just take a pure lead slug that is a little larger... maybe a 50 +/- cal. Lube bore and drive the slug in a little ways. Pull slug back out with a screw type ball puller. Measure.