Anybody here do Galloway cattle?

[.45Cole]

I would really like to get into cattle, and I have kinda got my heart set on belted Galloways. What is your average hanging weight and yield from butchering? Everybody I know does angus/herefords but they don't know much about Galloways.

[starmac]

Just curious, are you wanting a couple to raise for yourself, or a hobby, or are you getting into cattle with the intention of profiting?

I haven't even thought about Galloways since studying the different breeds in high school, and trucking all over the US, I can only remember seeing 2 herds of them.

[300savage]

got a lot of them down here in texas. quite a few hobby ranchers raise them so they must be a rather tractable breed. there are red and black from what i see. cant help you any on the carcass quality though.

[bayjoe]

Belted cattle are just like any other bovine. Their grade and yield is still based on basic dam and sire genetics and how they are fed.
They do tend to keep very long hair and do not handle hot weather to well.

[Boz330]

I remember talking to somebody years ago about them and he wasn't very impressed with the yield. Designer cattle. I always kept Angus when I fooled with cattle, they seemed to be the least troublesome.

Bob

[Just Duke]

Where looking at doing Longhorns and Angus.

[Bret4207]

FWIW- there's an article on Galloways, not Belties, in this months "Countryside" mag. There's a breed association of 2 out there. There breed is supposed to have a real good conversion rate and, in the north anyway, the heavy hair coat isn't a problem.

If you want to make money, that's another thing. Raise what everyone else near you is raising.

[BeeMan]

Bret, it's good to see you around again.

[.45Cole]

I thought that the red belties were really interesting looking. I figured if I could cover the cost of raising them, and slaughter, from the sale of 3/4 of the beef it would be worth it. Up here around the subaru crowd everyone likes beef from small operations. Everyone up here does angus, herefords, or a cross. I don't have any plans on the burner, just saw a real deal on a heifer. I have ties with one of the guys up here doing solid Galloways for access to a bull.

[.45Cole]

bayjoe-where in CO do you call south central? FOCO here, dealin' with the subarus

[starmac]

You might be on to something selling to the greenies. An exotic, organic raised belted galloway, should be worth double to the greenie crowd. lol

[Just Duke]

I would really like to get into cattle, and I have kinda got my heart set on belted Galloways. What is your average hanging weight and yield from butchering? Everybody I know does angus/herefords but they don't know much about Galloways.


PM sent as I'm not sure what the longevity of this thread might be.
PM sent.

[sparkz]

Dad raised a few I believe years ago, and if I recall you lose about 50% clean and packed from on the hove,
I can recall we talked about this but again was years ago, since dads passed on so

I can tell you this, It aint easy,, and you dont get days off or holidays or sick days, YOU MUST be there for the beef
so its something ya have to commit to


Patrick

[oneokie]

I would really like to get into cattle, and I have kinda got my heart set on belted Galloways. What is your average hanging weight and yield from butchering? Everybody I know does angus/herefords but they don't know much about Galloways.

Hanging weight runs from 45% to 55% of live weight, depending on age and how they were fed.

Last 5 head I have had butchered averaged 32.5% of live weight. But, I have most of my cuts boned out.
These were Angus cross cattle.

[.45Cole]

My father and all of my cousins have been doing cattle, mainly hobby (less than 50 or so), but all are the old cowboy type. Only angus, hereford, or crosses. They usually get 60% or so hanging and lose about 30% of hanging weight when cut. Galloways were neat being that they were smaller, bred to finish on grass, and had longer coats. The belties were crossed with dairy cattle for ? but I thought that might lead to better milk production to start a calf off better...IF you could keep the dairy genes for milk production prevalent. But I'm just browsing right now.

[300savage]

dont mean to put a damper on your dream but the reality is that unless you just want to raise your own meat you will be lucky if you dont lose money on your venture.

there is break point where when you average out all of your expenses and death loss and labor, and about another %15 on top of that for unexpected costs that things finally will start to pencil a profit.
i am pretty sure that point is a higher number of critters than you want to take on.
i run 300 head of brangus cows year round, with the occassional steer deal of up to 500 additional critters on good years.
my fathers ranches in az run several thousand head and i have been doing this stuff all of my life.
i dont mean to pee on your parade but this stuff aint never as easy as it seems.
one other option is this, look into the ag exempt requirements for your state and what it takes to qualify, perhaps you do and can make running a few cows reduce your prop taxes by a bunch.

[Just Duke]

dont mean to put a damper on your dream but the reality is that unless you just want to raise your own meat you will be lucky if you dont lose money on your venture.

there is break point where when you average out all of your expenses and death loss and labor, and about another %15 on top of that for unexpected costs that things finally will start to pencil a profit.
i am pretty sure that point is a higher number of critters than you want to take on.
i run 300 head of brangus cows year round, with the occassional steer deal of up to 500 additional critters on good years.
my fathers ranches in az run several thousand head and i have been doing this stuff all of my life.
i dont mean to pee on your parade but this stuff aint never as easy as it seems.
one other option is this, look into the ag exempt requirements for your state and what it takes to qualify, perhaps you do and can make running a few cows reduce your prop taxes by a bunch.

Respectfully sir if one looked at a business venture as a failed rolled of the dice out of the gate one would have already defeated themselves.
Also depend on location. Your AO receives annual precipitation of 30 inches. My proposed AO is 42. Soil content has a lot to do with food quality and quantity.
"i dont mean to pee on your parade but this stuff aint never as easy as it seems." This comes across as your saying I'm the only one that can do this and an attempt to dissuade others from persueing this vocation. Also take in to fact that your cattle business is pretty new on this continent as far as history goes. The aboriginal peoples of Africa have done fairly well for the last 10,000 years running cattle. Also taking into fact that the bovine is not indigenous to our continent so I'll add that into the time line.

"i dont mean to pee on your parade but this stuff aint never as easy as it seems." I watch others get married and have big families and no one tells them this.
I have contacted the OP here via PM as I admire one that sets off on a venture especially seeing this greatly benefits the peoples of the United States.
I personally hope the best for the fella and would like to see him end up with more cows than he know what to do with.
Folks being in the Real Estate business for many years and my searches in multiple states most times out of curiosity, find this scenario on 90% of my contacts.
Bert and Gertrude are 85 years old and have passed or close to passing.
Biff and Buffy now own or soon will own the farm/ranch and want NOTHING! to do with it other than sell it and continue to work their cushy cubicle job eating donuts and drive their Volvo station wagon to happy hour and retire early from the proceeds.
12 months ago we received email every Monday and in the body of the emails was 1800 new farms for sale and that was just in MO.
Well here. this is just one website. http://www.landandfarm.com/
Alabama6,922
Alaska573
Arizona8,766
Arkansas6,132
California15,648
Colorado11,321
Connecticut2,885
Delaware773
District of Columbia7
Florida18,418
Georgia10,473
Hawaii621
Idaho7,621
Illinois8,162
Indiana6,838
Iowa2,408
Kansas2,923
Kentucky6,543
Louisiana1,046
Maine1,629
Maryland6,676
Massachusetts1,227
Michigan17,182
Minnesota7,462
Mississippi5,647
Missouri10,405
Montana4,401
Nebraska990
Nevada2,788
New Hampshire5,777
New Jersey3,600
New Mexico7,012
New York13,259
North Carolina26,964
North Dakota249
Ohio6,509
Oklahoma7,760
Oregon6,805
Pennsylvania11,519
Rhode Island721
South Carolina13,376
South Dakota537
Tennessee21,018
Texas35,555
Utah2,097
Vermont4,291
Virginia16,306
Washington4,760
West Virginia5,425
Wisconsin14,599
Wyoming1,373

I just noticed that TX went from 23,000 to 35,555 over the last 6 months.
I have someone tell me that they want to go farm or ranch I shake their hand, pat them on the back, and wish them the best of luck.
Kinda like 3 Astronauts climbing into spacecraft in the 60's.
"i dont mean to pee on your parade but this stuff aint never as easy as it seems." I find this arrogant and an unbecoming phrase to tell someone that intends to feed a nation that's running out of food.
As far as myself, there's nothing I do or have done that anyone here couldn't do.

[ballistim]

22 years ago I returned to the area where I was born and raised & shortly thereafter remarried. We made a decision to try to fit homesteading into our lives which included full time jobs and mine with mandatory OT knowing and being warned of the difficulties involved in our life as planned. Several older farmers and locals in the rural area that we moved to embraced our efforts and offered advice and hands on help to help us succeed in our endeavors. Saturdays were spent at the local livestock auction where we bought a dozen Plymouth Rock pullets and later a Jersey dairy cow, goats, sheep, and hogs. I also planted an acre garden and canning became part of our lives. Most of you probably know that to keep a dairy cow "fresh" breeding is required, so my friend that I purchased her from would breed her to a small frame Angus and we raised our own beef. Milking a cow in sub-zero weather at 5:00am before driving to the city to work 12 to 16 hour days required determination, not to mention everything else required on the homestead. I would never try to talk someone out of doing something their heart desires and I will never regret the life I lived during that time nor the lessons learned along the way, but I would be remiss in not trying to explain the difficulties as well as the rewards in painting a complete picture of life on the homestead while maintaining other employment. However, I have no experience in full time farming, ranching, or homesteading so I'm not qualified to speak on what would be required to begin a venture in that way of life or the chances of success. Reward without risk involved is not something that I'm accustomed to, and I admire and respect anyone who takes a chance and follows that up with the effort and dedication to success that is as necessary as the initial desire to follow your dreams and begin a new venture. JMHO and "your mileage may vary" as others on this forum have advised before.

[Just Duke]

22 years ago I returned to the area where I was born and raised & shortly thereafter remarried. We made a decision to try to fit homesteading into our lives which included full time jobs and mine with mandatory OT knowing and being warned of the difficulties involved in our life as planned. Several older farmers and locals in the rural area that we moved to embraced our efforts and offered advice and hands on help to help us succeed in our endeavors. Saturdays were spent at the local livestock auction where we bought a dozen Plymouth Rock pullets and later a Jersey dairy cow, goats, sheep, and hogs. I also planted an acre garden and canning became part of our lives. Most of you probably know that to keep a dairy cow "fresh" breeding is required, so my friend that I purchased her from would breed her to a small frame Angus and we raised our own beef. Milking a cow in sub-zero weather at 5:00am before driving to the city to work 12 to 16 hour days required determination, not to mention everything else required on the homestead. I would never try to talk someone out of doing something their heart desires and I will never regret the life I lived during that time nor the lessons learned along the way, but I would be remiss in not trying to explain the difficulties as well as the rewards in painting a complete picture of life on the homestead while maintaining other employment. However, I have no experience in full time farming, ranching, or homesteading so I'm not qualified to speak on what would be required to begin a venture in that way of life or the chances of success. Reward without risk involved is not something that I'm accustomed to, and I admire and respect anyone who takes a chance and follows that up with the effort and dedication to success that is as necessary as the initial desire to follow your dreams and begin a new venture. JMHO and "your mileage may vary" as others on this forum have advised before.


Where's my two thumbs up smilie when I need it.

[Just Duke]

Tennessee just hit 21,018

[ballistim]

Hey Duke, I know you & I have discussed these things but wanted to chime in with my two cents worth on the subject. Stick to your guns (pun intended) and full steam ahead for any of you planning for taking on a new venture. Hats off to you!

[Just Duke]

Hey Duke, I know you & I have discussed these things but wanted to chime in with my two cents worth on the subject. Stick to your guns (pun intended) and full steam ahead for any of you planning for taking on a new venture. Hats off to you!

Thank you sir. Hopefully others will step up to the plate also and we can put this great nation back where it was in the 40's and 50's and before.

[ballistim]

Thank you sir. Hopefully others will step up to the plate also and we can put this great nation back where it was in the 40's and 50's and before.

Amen brother!

[300savage]

dam duke that must feel better.. i'm just glad i aint the one who ran over your dog !

i dont have time to get very deep into this right now so i will simply say you missed my intention by a mile, or perhaps i did not explain it well.
the OP does not need smoke blown up his skirt, if he is entertaining the idea of trying to turn a profit with cattle he needs the truth, the pitfalls, the break points, the risks, liabilities and an understanding of "all" that is involved. not to scare him off by any means, but if the truth does scare him then he aint got the sand to make it work anyway and will just end up another of your statistics.
i dont know it all for sure , but i make cattle make money for my living every single day.
do you ?

there is a smart way to go about this and in all honesty the first thing he needs to do is research his state property tax laws and see if by rsising some cattle.he can qualify for ag exempt status.
that alone can make the whole deal make him money.
after that there is research to be done, what toxic plants he has, what minerals he needs for his area ,,etc.

[starmac]

300 savage is just telling it like it is, if making money with cattle is the goal there is a lot to it. I have been to many, many forclosure auctions where even guys that had been in business for years, finally went under, farmers and ranchers alike. It can be done but rarely on a small scale does one actually turn a profit, however you do know what is in your freezer.

[bayjoe]

You can make money at anything if you go at it with the right attitude. I made a lot of money raising feedlot bucket calves. Made enough to buy heifers, get em bred, calve em out and then sell them as 3 year old bred cow with calf at side. My wife and I didn't do more than 3 or 4 at a time but made good money.
Butchered our own steers too.
So to Duke and the OP guy, GO FOR IT!!!!

[shdwlkr]

Well I will jump in to this discussion
I am old enough to know better and will be much older when I am able to have a place of my own in the country. It will have some livestock, think around 50-100 head, will I make money maybe maybe not see I am old enough I don't care. I am at the age when most folks like to sit and watch the tv or play games and sit in the warm house in winter and the air conditioned house in summer.

Why then do I want to have a place where I have to work in the fields, tend animals and have a large garden? It is really quite simple I want to die working the land that to me is so precious and also it is so much nicer to see nature up close and personal.

In this life we have choices and we are allowed to make the ones that make the most sense for us and we are also allowed to change our minds as time moves on.

My land in the country I have seen, have walked it and next year with luck I will begin building ponds on it and on the rest of the ranch that a friend has and wants to get back up and running so when he retires he can go back to the land also. My place will be small but I can use what I need of his to handle my excess. The topsoil is two feet deep in some places. It is out in the country and the view from my future home is all I could ask for. Now if I can only get the big feed lot down the road a few miles to just go away I would be very happy. Think less traffic down near the feed lot. I like the owners so no real big deal just teasing really.

I am in my 60's will be in my 70's when I get my place in the country but I will have it maybe for a year or a few who knows as life doesn't give us a warning bell when we are close to leaving it.

[Just Duke]

300 savage is just telling it like it is, if making money with cattle is the goal there is a lot to it. I have been to many, many forclosure auctions where even guys that had been in business for years, finally went under, farmers and ranchers alike. It can be done but rarely on a small scale does one actually turn a profit, however you do know what is in your freezer.

If you pay cash then there's not that problem. Remember not everyone finances their purchases.

[300savage]

duke you are not dealing in reality, unfortunately the cash still has to come from somewhere.
i actually applaud your enthusiasm to get people raising livestock, but goats/sheep/chickens/ etc.. are one thing, even "a" cow..
but cowz,, are a different story entirely.
this gentleman can probably handle it.
he probably does not need cattle handling equipment like a strong corral and a squeeze or some way to immobilize a 1000 pound critter that just aint fer it ..
he can probably do most of his own vet work ,vaccinations, cadtrations, calf pullin, sewing prolapsed uteruses back in, you get the idea .
he probably can, or has a few oil wells on his place so that expense is no issue.
or he just has the balls to bail in and get his hands dirty and learn the ropes of raising cow"z".

at over a grand each stupid hurts.

i hope he follows through, i hope he contacts his local county ag extension agent and tells him what he has in mind.
he can start there with learning what kind of weeds he may have on hs place that cause abortion, when to put out magnesium to prevent grass tetany in the spring, does he need to supplement iodine? what is the protien content of his forage? with as much rain as you say he gets will he need to mow his pasture? i have seen cows starvn to death in belly deep grass because someone did not know that past ten inches from the ground there was no nutritional value.

do you know these things duke? apparently not.
he can have a successful experiance with cattle or he can just have an experiance.

if we would like to see him still raisn cows ten years from now he needs to learn a few things.

[Just Duke]

duke you are not dealing in reality, unfortunately the cash still has to come from somewhere.
i actually applaud your enthusiasm to get people raising livestock, but goats/sheep/chickens/ etc.. are one thing, even "a" cow..
but cowz,, are a different story entirely.
this gentleman can probably handle it.
he probably does not need cattle handling equipment like a strong corral and a squeeze or some way to immobilize a 1000 pound critter that just aint fer it ..
he can probably do most of his own vet work ,vaccinations, cadtrations, calf pullin, sewing prolapsed uteruses back in, you get the idea .
he probably can, or has a few oil wells on his place so that expense is no issue.
or he just has the balls to bail in and get his hands dirty and learn the ropes of raising cow"z".

at over a grand each stupid hurts.

i hope he follows through, i hope he contacts his local county ag extension agent and tells him what he has in mind.
he can start there with learning what kind of weeds he may have on hs place that cause abortion, when to put out magnesium to prevent grass tetany in the spring, does he need to supplement iodine? what is the protien content of his forage? with as much rain as you say he gets will he need to mow his pasture? i have seen cows starvn to death in belly deep grass because someone did not know that past ten inches from the ground there was no nutritional value.

do you know these things duke? apparently not.
he can have a successful experiance with cattle or he can just have an experiance.

if we would like to see him still raisn cows ten years from now he needs to learn a few things.

Very much understood. Sir. I will get a memo out to all the cattlemen in the US and tell them that their ranches/farms "unless they have inherited daddy's ranch/farm" are no longer lucrative and should liquidate all assets because you are the new cattle baron and no one on the planet other than you can raise cattle. I will have the beef industry should contact you for all their future Beef needs. Hopefully this will help augment your finances and you could afford to get the "SHIFT KEY" fixed on your key board sir.
This should also dissuade any and all from competing with you.
I will also sell all my rifles and saddlery and buy golf clubs because you feel, from 1351 miles away via a keyboard with a stuck shift key that you can evaluate my knowledge, education and intelligence quotient. I will hope you will be the spoke person for country that will be doubling in size over the next 10 year that their is not enough more anyone to eat.
Back when I was a religious man, and I was you, I would have promptly contacted the OP and offered any and all help one could as were are all brothers here and are here to help our brother.
P.S. I will also be contacting Texas A&M (an anti gun state, non open carry and only recently a Concealed Carry State as long as your not imprinting) and inform them they they need to close their doors as it will be impossible for anyone in the future other than one that is a present rancher to prosper. :bigsmyl2:

[Just Duke]

MOO -10,000 years ago.
86832

[300savage]

duke i am trying to help him , with the truth.
you, well i am starting to believe there is something else going on in your life your mad about and your spewing it out here

[Just Duke]

duke i am trying to help him , with the truth.
you, well i am starting to believe there is something else going on in your life your mad about and your spewing it out here

Can you tell how many hands I'm holding up right now also?
Uh oh! You made my ignore list. LOL

[300savage]

well now that hurts ..

[.45Cole]

I was planning on keeping it simple, less that 20 head. I figure if I had good enough land and shelter, as well as a field for hay, then it might be worth it. Most people do "hobby" ranching, just like hobby reloading. Takes a lot of knowledge, money, time, and nerves and doesn't pay much except for satisfaction. I will probably get my feet wet, just want to find the right breed. Thanks for the input. I just need land and water!!!

[starmac]

If you are going to raise a few and peddle them delivered to the packing house, as organic or even just grass fed, you might find a niche where the galloways work for you. If you are planning on running them through a sale barn, I would stay away from them myself. If you go the organic route, do some research on the requirements, if it hasn't changed the land has to not have had any commercial fertilizers or chemicals for three years prior, the same with any thing you feed them, hay and grain.

[bayjoe]

My opinion is to keep your cattle gentle. If they won't come running when you rattle a bucket they need to belong to someone else.
Gentle cattle make life a lot easier.

[oneokie]

I was planning on keeping it simple, less that 20 head. I figure if I had good enough land and shelter, as well as a field for hay, then it might be worth it. Most people do "hobby" ranching, just like hobby reloading. Takes a lot of knowledge, money, time, and nerves and doesn't pay much except for satisfaction. I will probably get my feet wet, just want to find the right breed. Thanks for the input. I just need land and water!!!

You should do some research on how many acres of land you need per momma cow. And if any water rights are attached to the land and how much water is alloted.

[220]

well now that hurts ..

I wouldn't worry to much, having grown up worked on and been around cattle places varying in size from a couple of head to some running 1500+ breeders and trade steers I know exactly where you are coming from.
The old adage about if you want to make a small fortune start with a large one holds true for cattle.
Yes you can make money out of them, you can also easly loose money, in most cases better returns on your investment could be had elsewhere. The decision to raise cattle is as much a lifestyle choice as an investment choice on pure returns it probably doesn't hold up as a stand alone investment but the lifestyle sways it for most people involved.

[starmac]

220, You said a lot, ranching is a lifestyle. There is actually a better return on your money raising poodles, or weiner dogs, but once a cowboy always a cowboy.
I do know of one pretty good size rancher that makes quite a bit of her income raising poodles on the side, but cattle has allowed her to keep the property together.

[300savage]

ah 220 i aint losing much sleep over it all but thanks. it is good to hear from some folks who are screwed on straight

45Cole i wish you all the success in your venture.
there is a lot of information out there if your interested in the organic route. the requirements and options on how to sell the meat either on your own or through an established market in your area, pretty stringent requirements however i must say.
one idea perhaps is to establish a local sales base of people in your area who you could sell not organic to, but just grass fed beef. i would look for someplace that does custom processing.
that is an option between selling through a sale barn and full on organic that could help you maximize your return. i have no experiance with galloways but they might be a not bad choice for that kind of program as they are different enough they may appeal to that kind of market simply on their uniqueness.
again i would seriously look into the ag exempt status and see if you could qualify, depending on your prop values and your tax rate it may well save you some money in other ways.
your local ag extension agent can also help greatly as they will be familiar with your area and should understand stocking rates and what nutrtional rrquirements for your area.
cows need certain levels of mineral supplement such as calcium, potassium, salt and iodine to cycle and breed.

but i got a feeling you are plenty capable of figuring this stuff out on your own.
but if you get hung up i would be glad to help anyway that i can.
i really would like to see you get into cattle, but i would also like to see you stay in..

[Three44s]

I like this!!

Quoted from shdwlkr:

"Why then do I want to have a place where I have to work in the fields, tend animals and have a large garden? It is really quite simple I want to die working the land that to me is so precious and also it is so much nicer to see nature up close and personal.

In this life we have choices and we are allowed to make the ones that make the most sense for us and we are also allowed to change our minds as time moves on."


I am a fourth generation rancher.

I am sure the OP realizes he's got his work cut out ....... I am not going to dump on his dreams.

My family arrived on this pile of rocks with just five bucks in their hands back in 1871.

They had a dream and a lot of work ahead of them ......... If someone dumped on them .... it did not deter them ......... and as others folded ....... they were there and picked up the slack and they grew.

I don't know beans about Galloways. Have friend that has Highlanders. The downside is that if you are caught having to market those Highlanders through conventional channels you are taken to the cleaners compared to selling one on one.

If I was in the OP's situation my breed preference would be Angus and then bring in some Limosen ....... Angus will develop well on grass, about the best of any breed I am aware of. Limousin is great on meat to bone ratio. I like Limousin females even better than Angus as well. Like I say, I don't know spit about Galloway so if there is something compelling with them for a tailored market (one on one) then that may well trump whatever I know about the business.

What I know about one on one is only an animal here and one there but we have sold bunches as Natural beef a number of times. It's not about the breed but what the animals were fed or given.

So I say ....... guys that want to get in the business .......... go knock yourselves out! Some one left me room to grow up in it ............ who am I to rain on your parade? And as far as what breed ...... do it as you please.

And when they lower you into the ground ......... what it all really came down to ......... is the way shdwlker put it ......... ! REALLY!

Best regards

Three 44s

[Bad Water Bill]

Limosen

That is a breed I have not seen since I drove by the property of the founders of Tombstone Pizza several years ago.

[Three44s]

Limosen

That is a breed I have not seen since I drove by the property of the founders of Tombstone Pizza several years ago.

Maybe you need to get "out more"?

I seen a whole pile of them the other day ....... down by the unemployment office ..... seriously!! (The owner of the service cut a deal with an adjacent land owner in town and parks them their ....... ) Real long backed too!! LOL!

Thanks for the hint ..... I cleaned up my French.

Best regards

Three 44s

[Three44s]

Our Brahma crosses are not so great in the winter here. I suppose what part of Colorado the OP hails from would determine how they'd do there.

Also, their (Brahma) lack of a sense of humor turns me off but we don't need so much land for a cow or one that can graze in high range.

A neighbor told me about a Brahma cross cow he bought from the previous operator who got her in a trade for a horse. He was there the day they unloaded her and she plowed through two fences before they got her turned around and back to the squeeze chute for branding. She's in her twenties now and raising her last calf ...... that is far from normal ....... even for her breed but even I have to hand it to them .... they ain't wusses!!

Best regards

Three 44s

[Bad Water Bill]

Our Brahma crosses are not so great in the winter here. I suppose what part of Colorado the OP hails from would determine how they'd do there.

Also, their (Brahma) lack of a sense of humor turns me off.

Best regards

Three 44s

As long as you are on a FAST horse "What difference does it make"?:kidding:

[Three44s]

Sir,

It makes a lot of difference if they catch you off at a gate and your horse runs off ...... LOL!!


Best regards

Three 44s

[300savage]

he for sure needs to stay away from anything with any bramer blood in it. and i mean any.
not only will he get docked for having some ear on his calves if he has to go through the sale in the central to northern states, he is not experianced enough to handle them.
if you know what you are doing they can be as gentle as any cow alive, if you dont they are a train wreck.
plus there is no need whatsoever. brahma is " bos indicus" and the only reason for that blood is for heat tolerance, insect resistance , browsing vs grazing, harder/ better feet for rough ground , or for creating hybrid vigor when crossed with european breeds " bos taurus".
but they.will sull if mishandled, after they wreck your chute knock down a fence or two and run your butt up a post..
they cam also "will" themselves to die if stressed or abused, and anyone who doesnt believe that just hasnt been around enough of them.

he also doesnt need limousene , they are big as a house and require a whole different working strategy to take care doctor/ handle and they also are going to require more forage to sustain that size.
the galloway he originaly inquired about really would not be a bad choice.
medium to small frame, tractable, cold weather tolerant, and unique looking enough that he might could open up his.market a tad by just selling funny colored calves to city folks who have gone country and want a few cows in their back forty, or five..

and 44 ig anyone actually thinks i would try to discourage this gentleman from his dream then you are as foolish as that other prickly fellow.

[bayjoe]

We used to just LOVE !!!! those real gentle Salers. I'm just kidding
I wouldn't wish them on my worst enemy

[Three44s]

"he also doesnt need limousene , they are big as a house and require a whole different working strategy to take care doctor/ handle and they also are going to require more forage to sustain that size."

Must be from an alternate universe! ......... a whole different ........ ? Wait till I tell our girls (cows) about THAT!

When I give someone advice ........ it's from the heart. If I wanted to send him to go play in the street ........ I'd just ignore this thread and move on. I don't see the Galloway or Highland as a viable answer. I may well be wrong but I've sold enough cattle and my family sure as heck has ........ they started here in 1871 ...... that's a 142 years in my universe ....... to know that when you want to sell something ...... you want more buyers ...... not less. That means when you need bucks ......... you take your cattle to town and the buyers FIGHT over them .....

My friend who's down sizing his Highland herd can't do that. He has a good repoire with his customers and he can sell them that way ...... but the downside is that he can't do it on the spot ..... his buyers are on their own time frame.

Maybe being different is fun ........ but I've seen a lot of "in vogue" cattle come and go ......... if these odd breeds were the bees knees ...... they be prevalent in many pastures ........... but they are not and there are some good reasons for that.

What DOES make sense to me is to take a good conventional breed or two or three and do some crossing and run them NATURAL or ORGANIC if you have the stomach for the latter. You've got proven production, you can create a niche market as to how the animals have been fed and cared for ........... and yet, IF you need to sell sooner than your bunch of niche customers are willing to buy ... you have more places to sell rather than less.

With ANGUS you have the marbling and maternal traits.

With Limousin you have the carcass traits and feed to meat efficiency (and our Limo's are good mothers and nice to work with).

Some others have mentioned Herefords. I will never rain on the Herefords. And the cross of all time: Black Baldies ....... Hereford/Angus is certainly a gold standard.

It's just that I think the Limo/Angus is the next gold standard ...... if you have the place for it. I am guessing and it's only a guess but the OP likely has will have more than good enough resources for a Limousin herd and more so for a cross Limo/Angus or about any other critter he wants to come up with.

I base this on the fact that I have never seen a small start up ......... on sparse range!

Three 44s

[220]

"). And the cross of all time: Black Baldies ....... Hereford/Angus is certainly a gold standard.

Same here in Aus, some of it is silly really but the buyers pay a premium for anything black.
For a while I had an black Angus bull that must have been carrying a red gene, over Herefords he would throw the occasional red baldy, exactly the same genetics and meat & carcase traits in what I was sending to market but the buyers would pay 5c/kg live weight more for the blacks.

[300savage]

44 have a nice day.

45 cole the most important thing is cattle that you can handle with your setup and experiance level. keeping everyone alive and healthy is of the utmost concern. your going to want your own bull as well i would imagine, unless you can lease one for a few months every spring which is not a bad idea if possible in your area.
again another question to ask the ag extension agent.
if not you want as gentle and tractable a breed as possible.
your going to need to have him semen checked, i check all of mine every year before i turn them on cows. and every year a few fail the test.
you dont want to figure that out the other way especially when you are only running one.and never turn your back on your bull i dont care how gentle he is. always remember this about bulls, its the gentle ones that kill people. the snorty one people take no chances with, but old ferdinand is the one that will lull you into trusting jim too much.
never fall into that trap. treat all cattle especially bulls of any breed with respect. they can all hurt you.

220 what part are you from if i might ask? i spent a fair bit of time in your country.
all on the east coast, queensland down through victoria and made a lot of friends i dearly miss.
boys with the bark still on, wild days and nights..
i was teaching horsemanship, roping, and cattle handling, but mostly i was single and lovn the life.
if i had less commitments here i would have moved there long ago.
we might know some of the same blokes, fairly tight world down under i felt , though i am sure it has changed .

if the name hornnery or lillyman ring a bell we could tell some tales i am sure.

[220]

SE NSW now days just on the edge of the high country, can't beat 40"+ rainfall for making farming easier not that I'm doing much now days, only looking after about 50 breeders on my parents little block.
Haven't worked much outside NSW but did spend a bit of time in the north west of the state where rainfall is around 12"
Good advice on the bulls but like you said you don't want to take any cattle for granted, most of the blokes I know who have been busted up bad it was cows that got them.
One place I worked on we used land cruisers to bring the bulls in. 30 bulls don't take long to work out a pecking order and stake their claim to a little patch of the paddock, pair up with a few mates and settle down to await the next time they get to visit the girls but start moving them about and all hell breaks loose.
If a 1 ton bull wants to argue over the direction he wants to go a bike or even a good horse aren't really going to change his mind. Different story if he wants to argue with a 2 ton 4wd.
It still amazes my just how agile and quick such a large animal can be when the mood takes them.
One thing that might be worth looking at for the OP if he is only running a few head is AI. Saves the troubles a bull and gives you access to a much bigger genetic pool.

[Bret4207]

I'm just gonna offer this part of the equation up- marketing. I don't know how it is everywhere else, but we're shipping pretty much anything outside of replacement dairy heifers 2-300 miles to find a decent market. I'm not in beef right now, I'm in sheep, but the problem is the same for the beef producers in my area. So whatever gets the nod in the end, make sure you research the marketing end of things. And do not for one single second believe a word your state or ag college experts or the magazine experts say about direct marketing your product. It's impossible for one person to raise it, take care of it and the land AND do the marketing to individuals. You either find an organization or some other way to do it. IME people will not, ever, beat a path to your door for any product that isn't absolutely dirt cheap or free.

[Three44s]

Same here in Aus, some of it is silly really but the buyers pay a premium for anything black.
For a while I had an black Angus bull that must have been carrying a red gene, over Herefords he would throw the occasional red baldy, exactly the same genetics and meat & carcase traits in what I was sending to market but the buyers would pay 5c/kg live weight more for the blacks.

With respect to the premium paid for black hided cattle, this started with exports to Japan. It then was discovered here in the States that the Angus cattle would marble sooner in the feedlots ....... Cattle Feeders that we sell to tell me that as a truck is loading to go to the packing plant ...... if they are running short of cattle that they deem ready ...... they can go out with confidence and sort black cattle out of pens destined to go out later and still hit the Choice Grade.

Now, for a 5 cent premium over 1 kilogram ........ that equates to just a hair over 2 cents on a pound. What you also have to factor in is that on balance Angus cattle are smaller framed ......... you are selling less pounds ....... so there is a counter balance to the price premium paid for Angus.

Breeders have done a very good job to narrow that gap but just any bull may or not have that genetics.

AI breeding would be an option to both attain better genetics and save having a bull to contend with at a somewhat lower price .......... but there is the downside of the extra work and other costs.

Bret's point about marketing is spot on!

If your product doesn't sell ........ you will wither away! And it's getting more complicated everyday!!

Our livestock auction barns have also thinned out. In our case it probably helps us since we have a very active one about 45 minutes away. It's shifted our selling from direct feed yard sales TO that auction. We never used to sell our "crop" at auction .... only bought there. We only sold cull cows and bulls at auction prior to that. And even then we would rather "rail" them when that option was more accessible.

But with less sales barns our local yard gets buyers and cattle in from a larger geographic area than ever before. The owners of that auction work at getting buyers cued in when cattle they are looking for are coming in .... and facilitating the producer to help his or her cattle to arrive then.

Marketing sheep is much more problematic than selling cattle ......... I have friends that raise them on a large scale ........ few do that today ....... and they are regularily sending their lambs across two State lines to get paid.

In the OP's case, I see direct marketing to the consumer as a venue. My friend with Highlanders certainly does ........ he's cutting back due to pasture and feed constraints not lack of buyers. The connectiveness of today's society adds to ones tools to communicate with individual buyers.

The perpetual downside is that folks are in short supply who can all at once buy an entire animal or even split one with another friend. Which brings me to this point:

There certainly are many instances of successful direct to consumer marketing. But I feel it's wise to consider a mainstream breed or cross so that if and when you are short of buyers ...... you can still get a decent price for your cattle through other marketing channels.

I am not convinced that Galloways would not fall into the same trap that Highlands fall at a sales barn.

Best regards

Three 44s

[300savage]

i have to admit that is good advice ^

again AI while having some strong points is a really tough way to go. i am AI and preg check certified and i long ago got tired of it all for the limited return in a commercial operation.

220 ,do you know ian and netta wharton in gunneda NSW ? they run the equine dentistry school and also the AU team roping assoc.

[220]

And do not for one single second believe a word your state or ag college experts or the magazine experts say about direct marketing your product. It's impossible for one person to raise it, take care of it and the land AND do the marketing to individuals. You either find an organization or some other way to do it. IME people will not, ever, beat a path to your door for any product that isn't absolutely dirt cheap or free.

There is a reason very few people are direct marketing, I wouldn't say it is impossible but it will be a lot of work and you still need secondary markets for animals that don't make the grade or if your primary market falls over. This is where the less popular breeds suffer in that selling through sales etc you wont get the $ you would for the more conventional breeds.
Have my brother currently looking at selling direct to restaurants in Sydney. We have about 5 acres of hazelnuts for which the market is almost non existant. There has been a little bit of work done by others on supplementary feeding hazelnuts to cattle, the volume and time needed for it to influence flavour etc. It is doable and looks like it will offer a big price premium over grass feed cattle but is obviously only a small market selling direct to restaurants and will be seasonal depending of hazelnut supply. Looks like a couple are willing to give it a go running it as a specialty product on their menus.



Now, for a 5 cent premium over 1 kilogram ........ that equates to just a hair over 2 cents on a pound. What you also have to factor in is that on balance Angus cattle are smaller framed ......... you are selling less pounds ....... so there is a counter balance to the price premium paid for Angus.

The point I was trying to make was that once the market decides something is worth a premium they seem to run with it to the extreme.
The price difference I mentioned was for Angus/Hereford, same bull same line of cows just the odd one would throw red instead of black, I would be 100% certain that hanging on a hook you wouldn't see a difference but alive they weren't black and the buyers have decided for the reasons you outlined that they will pay a premium for black.

While they may not be as big in the frame if their feed conversion rate is the same as larger cattle then you can run more head so your still in front.
A lot of work going into improving feed conversion rates to increase production which has to be the way forward, the more grass or grain you can convert into beef then the more profit you will make.

300savage I know of them but don't know them, not really into the horse scene.
Your right in that AI probably isn't viable to produce stock for slaughter I was thinking that if you were running something like Galloways or highland then you would probably be producing replacement heifers so might be viable option.
Haven't had a lot to do with AI although it is popular in the dairy and stud industries over here.
Have done a bit of AI with goats and also embryo transfer when parents were involved in importing angoras from South Africa in the early 90's.

[Three44s]

Here's a new twist on premiums:

Wolf Friendly Beef

Had an Enviro try to pitch that to a fellow cattleman around my parts ........

According to him, Wolf Friendly Beef was beef that was raised around introduced wolves while the producer used non-lethal proceedures for mitigation of predation.

Some days I think it just isn't worth it! ......You know, working your tail off to feed such worthless excuses for human beings!

Best regards all!

Three 44s

[starmac]

Whackos, there is just nolimit to their imagination. geesh.

[Three44s]

The best guess of the rancher that this wacko approached ....... and I could come up with was scat ............

Wolf Friendly Beef is wolf scat after they've eaten your cows! Sell the dim whits wolf scat said to include "used" beef!

Three 44s

[220]

Bit like the story that did the rounds here about an environmentalist who at a dingo/wild dog control meeting preposed that sterilization would be the best solution.
Farmer stood up and replied they are killing his livestock not #*!king them to death.

[bayjoe]

Dingo's on the little blue sex pill. Be sure to video !!!