FFL form 1 Homemade 22 suppressor questions

[cheese1566]

PLEASE NOTE: I fully intend on doing this legally!

I would like to embark on the project of making my own suppressor on my lathe.
Yes, this will be a legal unit with getting the proper federal stamp first, then proceeding to build.
I have the ambition to make a 22 cal suppressor mostly for 22LR rifles and handguns. I have read a lot on the silencer-talk forum but am not a member.

I do have some questions if there is an experienced builder here or one who has gone through the FFL application process for a homemade unit.

My criteria so far:
1/2"-28 threads
Tool steel end caps- threaded for disassmbly
Aluminum K style baffles (easier for me to machine)
1" interior SST or Tool steel exterior tube
maybe 6" long
Primarily for 22LR, but may build havier for AR15 to be versatile

Any one with build and application experience?

Looking for a good set of plans that work. Mostly what I see on the net and silencer-talk forum is guys who made them, but no reference to dimensional specs.

[Nobade]

Check out how a Silencerco Sparrow is made. IMHO those are the slickest 22LR cans out there. Always easy to take apart, no matter how much fouling builds up. Dimensions are up to you, just make it however big you want to.

As for a .223 can, if it were me I would pony up for a Thunderbeast welded titanium one. They're way nicer than anything I would manage to make and aren't THAT expensive in the end.

-Nobade

[NoZombies]

I would build separate cans for .22 and .223. There are several reasons for this; The .22 can can be built to weigh only a few ounces, and still be quite effective, the .223 can will by necessity weigh considerably more in order to be both effective and durable. A .22 can should be either serviceable, or built from materials that would allow "the dip" to be used. a .223 can requires less cleaning (unless you're running a lot of lead through it). And lastly, the baffle designs for .22 and .223 should be different in order to achieve the best suppression on either platform.

For the .22 can, K-baffles are simple enough to make. I helped a friend complete his F1 can a few years ago. The thing to remember about the baffles is that you cannot make any extras, and cannot legally replace them yourself if something goes wrong.

What machining methods and equipment do you have available? Many folks are building Mono-core cans these days because they are easier to make, easier to take apart, and generally just as effective as baffled cans. If you have access to a CNC mill, I think that's the way I would go. Heck, even with just a manual mill, it might still be the way to go. Specific dimensions are a little hard because a lot of that will depend on the materials and methods you're using. As a rule, the baffles or core should be at least .005" smaller than the inside of the tube. More than that is advisable in the case of an aluminum baffle stack and a steel tube, as the aluminum will expand more than the steel when hot.

[Artful]

Are you looking for how to or ?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BNOrKj494Wc
http://grabcad.com/library/22lr-k-baffles-suppressor-aac-element-2-like-baffles
https://d2t1xqejof9utc.cloudfront.net/screenshots/pics/a80eecab20e70a57139d1dcd606d24f7/medium.jpg
http://www.practicalmachinist.com/vb/gunsmithing/supressor-baffles-question-207819/
http://www.hunt101.com/data/500/medium/KBaffle.jpg
http://www.hunt101.com/data/500/medium/Group1-9_150_.jpg
http://www.hunt101.com/data/500/medium/Group10-19_150_.jpg
http://bbs.homeshopmachinist.net/threads/35021-How-I-made-my-Integral-10-22
You might seek out members who have made their own cans and politely ask them if they are willing to help you. - Remember the Form 1 must be approved before any construction starts (or even buying materials in some cases)

[cheese1566]

Yep on the form 1. Thats why I am inquiring now before any starting of production. I would like to get some tried and true methods before dropping the $200 for tax and waiting. Material cost wont bother me as it will be a tinkering-stress releiver project away from the world.

I thought about a single mono bloc inner column design, but I only have a lathe (Grizzly G0602) and no mill. I do have a small milling attachment and a crappy drill press. I think a long bored out hole in a 6" monobloc inner tube wont be for me. I'll have better luck keeping the bore hole the best using K type baffles.

I checked on the website you listed above. he made a pretty cool integral unit for his Ruger 10/22.

[Artful]

Quick search of the sight gives you some places to start

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?217088-Integrally-Suppressed-User-Servicable-Cast-Boolit-Shooting-Savage&highlight=suppressor

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?206808-The-Cast-Boolit-Suppressed-93-Suppressed-Mauser-Project&highlight=suppressor

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?152612-Oil-Filter-Silencer&highlight=suppressor

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?35400-Suppressors-and-subsonic-Boolits&highlight=suppressor

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?96552-Cast-Boolit-safe-suppressor&highlight=suppressor

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?141272-New-Suppressor-Design&highlight=suppressor

[jmorris]

I have both mono core and K baffle .22 lr cans. The mono core would require a mill and the K makes less noise but is harder to clean.

I used aluminum tube and machined a grade 8 bolt that is an insert that forms a blast baffle and the attachment threads, then K's, OD is 1".

Forget about the same can for .223 unless you want a big heavy can for your .22.

[Artful]

Actually a few people have built mono core with just a drill press and lathe - the trick as I under stand it was to start with boring a smaller hole then enlarging to correct size and using the hole to center off of, then doing the outside round so the outer tube just slip fit - then doing the threading then going back and drilling the baffles but not on a tangent to the curve of the cylinder.

[Artful]

Just to pump your creative juices - monocores
http://i.imgur.com/Ykomo.jpg
SRT sealed - revamped as monocore

http://www.silencertalk.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=10&t=82912

http://i35.tinypic.com/jt51qd.jpg

http://www.5bears.com/pics/hgs04.jpg

http://i44.tinypic.com/r1lvya.jpg
http://i44.tinypic.com/35b813c.jpg
One made with drill press.
http://i54.photobucket.com/albums/g119/hossor/4.jpg
http://i54.photobucket.com/albums/g119/hossor/5.jpg
http://i54.photobucket.com/albums/g119/hossor/7.jpg
http://i54.photobucket.com/albums/g119/hossor/12.jpg

monocores for 22LR can be very effective and easier to clean.

Only down side of monocore can be First Round Pop - FRP will be a function of initial blast chamber volume.

[tomme boy]

How long would the aluminum cored ones last?

[Artful]

for 22 LR only - a long time - some I know of are 25 years old and still doing fine - that provided you can clean the junk out.

[cheese1566]

I considered a monocore and using my drill press. But my press is a cheapy and I have wobbly bits.The other thing is I have poor skills when it cones to boring longer holes with my lathe.
My challenge at the moment is convincing the "warden" of letting me let spend $200 for the stamp.

[koehlerrk]

If I can ever convince the wife to move out of this communist state (NY) and get back to 'Merica, I'd get me a suppressor. A suppressed 22 is about as much fun as you can have... just not in NY.

[NoZombies]

It's well worth it if you like shooting without hearing protection. I sometimes screw the can onto a 16" contender .22 barrel, and with subsonic ammo, it's quieter than a daisy red ryder BB-gun.

http://iownguns.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/10/tender.jpg

[Artful]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=seIy5om8kcY

[jmorris]

http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o213/jmorrismetal/can/DSC02201.jpg

[John Taylor]

Every one wants a quiet rifle and I found one that does not require a $200 fee. I have a 22lr with a barrel that is 29" long. Using standard velocity target ammo it is quieter than an air rifle. Makes a loud noise if the bullet hit anything hard.

[Artful]

Yep, that's true - I used T22 shorts in my Savage 24D for years to plink garden pests. CCI Quiet was made for that exact purpose.

[Hackleback]

Google oil can suppressor and look at the YouTube vids. Can't much easier than that. Your mileage may verry, and abide by all laws!

[cheese1566]

I saw that one.
Too bad though that the oil filter is a part of the suppressor and cannot be legally replaced by the owner. It has to be sent back to Econocan for replacement since they are the manufacturer.

I see lots of "other" products that are marketed as "solvent trap adapters" that are sold as threaded adapters so one can "safely" catch oils and bore solvents in an oil filter threaded to the end of your muzzle. What a joke but way too easy to make. Just need a 3/4"NPT by 1/4"FPT pipe bushing that is bored out and rethreaded to 1/2"-28 threads.

Not worth my LE career, retirment, life, family, and freedom to think bout it.

[tomme boy]

I had a chance to get behind some YHM cans today. Now if my state would make them legal I would have a few! The ones I had a chance to see were owned by a class 3 manufacturer. Someday I hope. 6.5 Creedmoor and a 308 win sounded like a 22 mag.

[Hackleback]

I was under the impression that you needed a tax stamp for the adapter.


I saw that one.
Too bad though that the oil filter is a part of the suppressor and cannot be legally replaced by the owner. It has to be sent back to Econocan for replacement since they are the manufacturer.

I see lots of "other" products that are marketed as "solvent trap adapters" that are sold as threaded adapters so one can "safely" catch oils and bore solvents in an oil filter threaded to the end of your muzzle. What a joke but way too easy to make. Just need a 3/4"NPT by 1/4"FPT pipe bushing that is bored out and rethreaded to 1/2"-28 threads.

Not worth my LE career, retirment, life, family, and freedom to think bout it.

[cheese1566]

The ones marketed from Econocan as a suppressor you do. They will sell you a serial numbered adapter and filter in one package. When the filter is burned up and exhausted, you legally have to return it to them and have them replace it. I think they offer that service for another $40 a rotation. unsure if the filetr is serial numbered as well.


The other "fly by nights" and Amazon traders that sell the "solvent trap adapters" do not since they say their purpose is for gun cleaning.

Buyer and installer beware!

[Hackleback]

Good information to keep us all on the right side of the law.

[HotGuns]

I've got a tutorial on a .22 can that I made that is simple and it works well if you want to look at it for some ideas.
http://bobbailey1959.wordpress.com/

Scroll down till you see it.

[cheese1566]

Thanks to others here in the Swappin' Section, I have enough to to cover the tax. Will be sending off my Form 1 packet to the ATF this afternoon.
Now the long wait...:coffee:

I guess it will be plenty of time now to follow up on more research and figuring how I want to do it. Plus accumulate any special tooling and raw materials.

My form 1 lists 6" and 22LR for specs.

[DanWalker]

I'm submitting form 1's for 308 and 45 acp cans I will be building. Using pieces of 1 5/8" chainlink fence post for outer body and steel 1 1/2" freeze plugs for baffles. Will drill holes through body and plug weld the freeze plugs in place. Plan to shoot through each baffle after it is welded into place. This will establish the center hole. Each baffle will also have a small hole drilled off center near the edge, for gas passage. Attachment points will be made from AR flash hiders, welded to an appropriately sized washer. Not too worried about weight, since they are going on rifles.

[jmorris]

Be sure to post pics of your build, a video of the "boring shot" might be worth setting up for too.

[xacex]

It is about time I join this club. For about a year now I have been bouncing around filling out a form 1, or just purchasing my first one. There is a ton of information I have been pouring through on silencer talk. The freeze plug silencer someone did over there with the cone shaping of the plugs was considered. I have stainless steel welding equipment in tig, and mig, along with argon to make a all stainless model. I cant decide if I want to do that for a 300 blackout can, or do an aluminum mono core I can do with a lathe and drill press for a .22 first. I guess I can draw them up and submit my forms just to get stamps for now, and hold onto them until I am ready to build.

[jmorris]

Being vague is always good,as you can't start until you are approved.

This is one I made for a 458 socom that I wanted short so I made the blast chamber telescope back over the barrel.

http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o213/jmorrismetal/can/458socom/ecusxsxs.jpg


http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o213/jmorrismetal/can/458socom/weld1.jpg


http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o213/jmorrismetal/can/458socom/excmon.jpg


http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o213/jmorrismetal/can/458socom/parts.jpg


http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o213/jmorrismetal/can/458socom/weld.jpg



http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o213/jmorrismetal/can/458socom/endcap.jpg

[jmorris]

Makes for a good hog thumper.


http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o213/jmorrismetal/can/458socom/excham.jpg

http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o213/jmorrismetal/can/DSC02435.jpg

[375RUGER]

Plan to shoot through each baffle after it is welded into place. This will establish the center hole.

I'd like to see video of that too.

[xacex]

Makes for a good hog thumper.




I like that style. How it it working for you? That would be a good way to do a suppressor for the 50 Beowulf I put together. Don't know what I would use it on up here, but fun to sling a 500+ grain boolit quietly. Not many hogs out here yet to justify a silenced big bore.

Btw, very nice welds!

So, I take it that that is a non-serviceable can? looks like it was welded at both ends, and one spot weld in the center? Aluminium K-baffles? What do you use to dip clean?

[jmorris]

Yeah, it has to be cleaned the same way my "factory" centerfire rifle cans. I have shied away from cast bullets with it, coating them instead. As narrow as the welds are I could always part them off and reweld but never had the need.

[DanWalker]

So, the baffles are in front of the blast chamber, correct? is the blast baffle vented, or do gases just expand in the chamber, then flow back through the flash hider and through the baffle stack? I'd love to hear how quiet this design is.

[jmorris]

It goes together like this.

http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o213/jmorrismetal/can/458socom/layout.jpg


The "flash hider" I machined makes up the first blast chamber by the small hole in the end.
http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o213/jmorrismetal/can/458socom/weld1.jpg

The large volume would have likely done the job but I also added another 4041 sort of baffle after that, then 3 K's to let it out slower.

It makes less noise than any of my AAC centerfire cans but it does have a large volume advantage.

[Nobade]

Very nice. I had wondered what is the best way to make a telescoping can and I applaud your rather elegant solution to it.

-Nobade

[cheese1566]

I think I have my ideas, plans, and materials sorted out for what I want to use (at the moment...anything can change in the months ahead while waiting for my stamp).

Anyways, where the heck can I buy some 7075 aluminum tubing in 1"OD x 0.87"ID ?

hard stuff to find, but a lot of silencer makers use it.

I may just settle for 6061.

[Nobade]

Sold by the foot....

http://www.aircraftspruce.com/catalog/mepages/alumtube_6061t6.php?clickkey=4561

I get a lot of tube and things from these guys, great to deal with.

Oops - you wanted 7075. Well, they do have 2024 that is about as strong.

-Nobade

[jmorris]

The link above and wicks aircraft both are great places to buy tubing by the foot. Not just aluminum but chromoly as well.

[Artful]

http://www.silencertalk.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=10&t=79895

[cheese1566]

Just got my form 1 back in the mail! Woo- hoo!! Happy 4th of
July to me!

Sent it in on November 5, check processed on Nov 21. Very happy to get it now, I was expecting this coming fall or winter and it would be too cold to work in the garage. Plus, I was expecting to maybe fix an error on the forms.

Now just to finalize my materials and get them ordered.

[Artful]

Congrat's

FYI
http://i1090.photobucket.com/albums/i379/thegman1763/AK%20stuff/updated-eps-processing-times_original.png