XDs .45 OAL

[nitrohuck]

So I knew going into this that I would have to seat bullets below normal OAL's in order to get them to chamber in the tight throated XDs, I saw people were dropping back a few hundredths, but in order for my bullet to fall into the chamber flush when I have the barrel removed I have to seat it all the way to 1.200" does this sound a little much?

I am loading a LEE-TC-230 over 4.2grs Titegroup, and I also know titegroup can be sensitive pressure-wise when seating depth is changed,

so am I good to go at 1.200"?

[44MAG#1]

I have an XDs which is at Springfield because of the recall.
I have chronoed Win White box 230's and they ran 769 fps.
What I would do is I would drop back to 4 gr and work up to close to that velocity and if I got good accuracy I would stop there.
My Micro Compact seems more seating sensitive than my XDs.
I generally use a stock 5 inch Springfield barrel as my gauge for seating bullets.
You want get into trouble dropping to 4 gr or even less since there will not be a big difference in case capacity.

[geargnasher]

4.2 grains under any 230-grain boolit happens to be my pet load for all my .45 autos. I've used both the TL and regular groove TC boolit from Lee and seat them so the angle at the break in the shoulder/body of the boolit is "just" outside the case mouth, by about 5-8 thousandths. That way it feeds in everything including throatless M&Ps and XD/XDMs. If you're having to seat that angle below flush on the brass, you may have a problem. I don't remember what my OAL was, but I'm sure it was more than 1.200. I'm thinking 1.240" was about right, but my memory is poor and I'm not near my records right now.

Gear

[44MAG#1]

I've shot the same bullet but not with that charge. My OAL was 1.180 in Springfield 5 inch gun and I know he can go below 1.200" OAL some but not much.
I tapered crimped on the bearing surface of the bullet also.
The charge weight of powder is the main concern.
I would as I stated above go to 4 gr to start with and gently work up to around to no more than 750 with that bullet.
I maybe would start even as low as 3.8 gr. and work up.
To each his/her own. I take pressure seriously but am not paralyzed with fear of it.
Seat the said bullet till it will easily come out of the barrel when the barrel is used as a guage for OAL fit.
Taper crimp with a good smooth crimp and work up. Maybe .469" taper crimp.

[trixter]

+1 on what 44mag#1 said.

[nitrohuck]

Guess I would need to buy a taper crimp die for that operation,

The base of the cone is fully out of the case mouth, certainly not seated below the case mouth, it is almost flush actually...

Today out of ~50 rounds I only had one or two that needed a little smack with the heel of my hand to get it fully into battery, I am shooting them as cast so they are definitely a tight fit but a fit nonetheless, perhaps I'll get a sizer if it really seems worth it down the line,

[cwheel]

My XDS is also at Springfield for the recall, they must have quite a pile of them to work on. Tight throat was a problem with mine as well. Before I got my XDS, I'd just finished a run of over 9000 45acp's. This run happened on a Dillon 550 and seated all rounds @ 1.250. Boolit is a 225 gr. Lee round nose sits on top of 6gr. of Unique powder. All rounds have a lite taper crimp done in the last station. Wasn't looking forward to having to re-seat all of these for just the XDS. The problem was with the tight throat in the XDS and not my loaded rounds. The answer was simple, just run a throating reamer into the barrel until they headspace properly. Throating reamer is not very expensive, and this problem was going to be a factor on other rounds as well. Didn't want to have a special run of ammo just to work in the XDS, just didn't make sense. Very lightly reaming the chamber step until your reload headspaces even with the back of the barrel hood, just a touch more will do, don't go to far. This reamer doesn't change the headspace, just removes some of the throat. Now if it fits in the mag, it fires and functions if I've done my job with the loads. Wad cutters ( lee 185gr. ) round nose cast, what ever 45 acp rounds I can find fit, headspace, and fire. I don't like the idea of seating the boolit short as this creates a smaller case volume, makes for higher pressure like firing a squib round. I have several different 45 acp pistols, I want my ammo to work in any that I have, saves trouble down the road. This is a very simple job for a gunsmith if you don't want to buy the reamer, should be cheap as well. These pistols come from the factory with tight throats and become a problem for a reloader. Not sure what Springfield is doing for us with the recall, but these barrels should be swapped out as well due to the tight throats. ( I have worked on 3 already, all the same ) Would work fine with 230gr. ball, and that is what they are set up for.
Chris

[oscarflytyer]

Mine is on recall. I have an old Thompson, been around the block - will chamber the H&G #68 clone COAL = 1.250". All my other 45s accept nothing over 1.225" COAL, including the XDs. BUT - this is with the H&G 68 - 200 gr LSWC. I don't cast anything in 230 LRN...

[cwheel]

You know when ball is listed at a OAL = 1.270-1.275" and it chambers, that there can only be one other problem with reloads, the throat. I have a few older Colts that have this problem, the S&W 645 and the Colt 70 series doesn't. You would think that Springfield would have fixed this in barrel production, but because this problem comes up mostly with reloading, I don't think they are that concerned. Worth noting that some SD hollow points also have a problem chambering with this tight throat. The quick give away this is happening is that the slide fails to close fully, stays open just a little, not good. When you go to retract the slide, it seams stuck. Field strip the pistol, try to chamber a loaded round into the barrel. If the back of the case fits well it will come up even with the rear of the barrel hood, the round will be loose and will fall out when the barrel is inverted. If it sticks out past that or is not loose in the chamber, you got a tight throat, and it needs fixing if you intend to reload for it.
Chris

[44MAG#1]

My XDs does not have this problem if I taper crimp to .469 on the case mouth. If your reloads have the bullet seated to the PROPER depth and the loaded rounds mic on the body very close to factory dimensions one should not have those problems.
There are other measurements one needs to make other than the obvious.

[cwheel]

A note to 44MAG#1, my reloads measure .466 @ the case mouth, ( measured with a nice Starrett micrometer ) still wouldn't headspace, still had the tight throat. If you are getting your rounds to chamber, bet they had a newer fresh reamer when your barrel went through the production line, think lots of us are going to end up with this problem. Think you got lucky with a fresh reamer used on yours.
Chris

[Cmm_3940]

Yep. Agree with 44MAG#1, I've been seating that boolit at 1.18", TC to .469"-.470", haven't had any problems in my 1911s and XDs. My XDs is also in limbo at Springfield for the recall.

[cwheel]

I guess I have no idea what profile the HG 68 clone is. The difference could also be I'm using a lee 6 banger 90353 round nose 225, and this could be a completely different profile than what you folks are using. Mine is engaging rifling in a un-throated barrel much sooner than the profile you might be using. Mine seated @1.250 before the throating showed rifling marks from touching the rifling. Now after throating, drop fit and no marks. Best of luck on what ever you need to do to get your mold to work. Guess there might be as many profiles of boolits out there as there are different molds. I think for me at least, it is important that the XDS uses the same rounds that the rest of my 45acp handguns use.
Chris

[Cmm_3940]

I believe the boolit the OP was asking about is the Lee 230gr Truncated Cone design:

http://i224.photobucket.com/albums/dd195/cm6259/452-230-TC.jpg (http://s224.photobucket.com/user/cm6259/media/452-230-TC.jpg.html)

As you can see, the boolit profile is quite a bit different than the typical round nose, so the seating depth will be a different as well.

Sorry, BAC loob is sticky and wouldn't wipe off the unloaded one :razz:

[cwheel]

Thanks for the pic, yes night and day difference in the profile of boolits being reloaded. Mine are much closer to GI ball profile, lots of space on the other profile to not engage rifling because of the steep taper. I do agree this will change seating depth quite a bit and have no idea of where that one should be. Mine, because of the shape, follow GI ball closely at 1.250 but can go as long as 1.275 looking at the manual. I guess it comes down to rounds being cast and profile. But it still stands that the throat on the 3 XDS that I've worked on so far had a tight throat that needed some throating to work on fatter boolit profiles. Your pic turned out much nicer than mine.
Chris

[fredj338]

Yes the XD has a tight/short throat. Yes the OAL will be diff for that guns vs another. OAL is ALWAYS gun & bullet specific, so just work it up. You can NOT plug & play when loading beyond midrange, especially with faster powders.

[cwheel]

And I guess what I cured with mine by throating the barrel is that difference. Couldn't have a special run of rounds to fit just one gun. Sure looking forward to getting that thing back so I can get more rounds through it. The few hundred I did get through before the recall showed for the short barrel, it is plenty accurate. Didn't know The XDS was a legal gun to sell in CA, although you might be talking about the larger XD.
Chris

[nitrohuck]

Just to report back on this thread I've fired some 150+ rounds through the XDs with the Lee 230gr TC, all seated to ~1.200"

They all functioned perfectly save for two which were seated a little further out and required some encouragement with the heel of my hand to get into battery.

[44MAG#1]

you haven't sent your in yet after them having the recall?

[nitrohuck]

you haven't sent your in yet after them having the recall?

Figured I would wait until the rush dies down and turn around is on a more agreeable timeframe. It is my only CCW you see,

[Ted]

Just shot the second 100 rounds through my new 5" XD yesterday. The first 50 rounds was my standard load that works fin in my other 45's (Kimber, Colt and SA). The Lee 230g truncated cone boolit. Carnaba Red/sized .452 and seated so that about -1/10" of the boolits full diameter extended past the end of the case. Over 6.7g Russian Unique (aka Salute). Results? The XD was a Jam-O-Matic.

The second batch, 50 rounds or so, were 200g RN (copper plated. Bought from a local store (Berry's Bullets?)). It was all they had. Loaded to whatever the Reloading Manuals recommended for a 200g RN. Results? Even MORE Jam was made. Mostly bullets nose-diving instead of feeding.

This last 100rounds? 100 new cast Lee 230 TC bullets COWW alloy, water dropped 452/Carnaba Red over 6.5-6g of Russian Unique OAL 1.93 +- (as I recall). Bullets were loaded to set the beginning of the taper of the Truncated Cone to the edge of the brass.

Results? 99 perfect feeds-n-go'bangs. In one case, one round (I think it was the last or next to last round out of the mag at the 89/90 or 99/100 round point) leapt out of the magazine and attacked my foot.

I consider that progress, not perfect but a better ending then the start would have predicted.

If I can get 500 rounds or so with out any other problems, I'll be happy. On the other hand I don't know that I'd be too upset with a few more teething problems in the next several hundred (3-500 rounds) as long as it finally straightens out.

On the other hand I shot my Kimber Pro Carry II along side of it. The Kimber is, for now at least, more accurate.

[cwheel]

That is why I decided to get the throating reamer. On a couple old Colts, the round came just a little short of chambering fully and the slide hung up just a little short of being fully closed. Those rounds were getting hammered in by the slide inertia. Retracting the slide by hand told the story, hard to extract unfired and having rifling marks on the base of the boolit right in front of the case rim. Boolit profile, the firearm, seating depth all matter here. Seams like a little reamer that was less than $50 worked wonders on a few pistols so far. Takes less than 5 min to fix now with a few turns of the reamer. Turns out it is a common gunsmith fix.
Chris

[nitrohuck]

Seeing as my 230 TC mold throws a .455" bullet, perhaps I should also size it down to .452" given how tight the chamber is... Still have to "encourage" the slide into battery 1 out of every 5 or so rounds with the heel of my hand,