Mihec vs Lee molds

[bbs70]

While looking for a mold for my 45 acp, I noticed Mihec, Lee, & H&G all had 200gr swc molds.
The bullets from these molds all look identical.
So I did some research on line and got the impression that not all bullets were the same even if they look the same.
Evidently from what I gathered the 200swc bullets from Mihec shot better than the other 2.
Am I right or is there a difference.
Inquiring minds want to know.

REFERENCE.
http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?127077-MiHec-H-amp-G-68-4-Cavity-Brass-452-200gr-SWC-results
REPLY #8

[USAFrox]

:popcorn:

[EDK]

Mihec makes a superior quality item. H&G is now Ballisti-Cast...great moulds but they ain't cheap! Lee is entry level equipment. I have all three makes and Mihec is my choice for the reasons listed. The H&G 68 is a great design for 45 auto-loaders. I have a 6 cavity H&G from the 1970s tucked away.

[mold maker]

EDK summed it up correctly.While I haven't shot them against each other, I have HG, Mihec and LEE. The quality of casts from HG and Mihec are comparable, but the Mihec is a 4 c mold while my HG is a single. I cast with the LEE 6c, for plinking fodder to save wear and tear on the others.

[youngda9]

I personally would not spend for anything beyond a Lee mold for shooting 45acp...you're just flinging lead at close range targets most likely. Get the 6 banger to crank em out. Very cost effective over the others for your likely intended purpose.

For precision rifle or something more custom I do spend for the better molds, they are awesome...but quite pricy ($100 plus).

[btroj]

I have the Lee and the Mihec. I shoot the Mihec as it gives ME better results. More accurate and less tendency to lead.

The Lee is a very good, inexpensive mould. It can, in a 6 cav, also make a heap of bullets in a hurry. The Mihec is just a nicer piece of equipment. The Lee is also much lighter and easier to handle because of that.

[Tatume]

:popcorn:

Now THAT'S funny!

[fredj338]

I personally would not spend for anything beyond a Lee mold for shooting 45acp...you're just flinging lead at close range targets most likely. Get the 6 banger to crank em out. Very cost effective over the others for your likely intended purpose.

For precision rifle or something more custom I do spend for the better molds, they are awesome...but quite pricy ($100 plus).

That is making quite an assumption. I am sure the 50yd BE guys are as picky about there bullets as the 300yd BR rifle guys?
As to one bullet shooting better than another, the slight design diff probably isn't the factor. It would depend on if you were shooting as cast or sized. I suspect the Mihec molds are throwing a rounder bullet than the Lee molds. What do you really expect for the Lee cost? Still, all sized round, they will shoot very, very close to the same.

[Tatume]

I like the Lee 452-200-RF. It casts very nice bullets that work well in my 45 ACP revolvers and automatics, and also shoots to point of aim in my 45 Colt US Firearms Rodeo (this gun shoots high with any bullet heavier than 200 grains). The Lee six-cavity mold is MUCH lighter than a Lyman four-cavity mold, that that makes a big difference when casting large numbers of bullets.

[freebullet]

45acp I would reccomend the mp 200 rcbs Cramer hp mold. It makes deep round hp standard penta hp & flatnose kinda covers all bases. For volume plinking mold I'd say lee 6 cav 200 rn give piles of boolits that feed easy.

[Echd]

The Lee 452 200 SWC tumble lube is super great. I don't even size mine, just lube em up and good to go... for blasting ammo.

[GARD72977]

for me casting is a hobby of its own. Im broke like a lot of the guys on here. I do not enjoy my lee molds. I just use them because I cant afford all good molds. Money is the driving factor. When I can afford to I would buy Mihec

[youngda9]

[QUOTE=fredj338;2382357]That is making quite an assumption.[QUOTE]
Not really (I did say "most likely) since the vast majority of people aren't into bullseye or competition shooting where such minor differences matter.

[dragon813gt]

I replaced all my Lee molds w/ one from Mihec. Lee is like training wheels when it comes to molds. Don't get me wrong they do cast quality bullets. But once you cast w/ one from any of the custom makers you will kick yourself for not doing it earlier.

As to the design differences. Every firearm is individual anyway. Just because it shoots well in one does mean it will shoot well in another of the exact same model. Buy whichever one is in your budget.

[John Allen]

I would look at the NOE molds they are still affordable and a very nice mold you can get quickly.

[Oreo]

Molds are tools and should be compared as such, boolit design not withstanding. You can still turn a bolt with a cheap wrench but it nay not fit the bolt as well as a quality wrench. You might have to grind and file on the cheap wrench if its too small where as the quality wrench fits perfect right out of the box. The cheap wrench won't last as long as the quality one. The cheap wrench might round the corners of the bolt but the quality one will leave the bolt perfect. However, the Lee and the Mihec will both make shootable boolits. A poor mechanic blames his tools but an experienced mechanic buys quality tools, usually.

[bbs70]

I like the Lee 452-200-RF. It casts very nice bullets that work well in my 45 ACP revolvers and automatics, and also shoots to point of aim in my 45 Colt US Firearms Rodeo (this gun shoots high with any bullet heavier than 200 grains). The Lee six-cavity mold is MUCH lighter than a Lyman four-cavity mold, that that makes a big difference when casting large numbers of bullets.

Tatume, I also have a U.S. Firearms Rodeo in 45 with a 4 5/8 in barrel.
I've had other single action 45s and this one is by far the best one.
I had Longhunter, in Texas, work on it before I got it.

I usually get the Lee molds because of cost and volume.
I have a Lee 250gr 45 lc mold and have noticed when I size them on my Star that one side has more sizer marks than the other.
Which leads me to believe the cast boolit is not completely round.

[geargnasher]

I have both the Mihec and the Lee 200 SWC moulds. I don't like the way either one shoots in any of my guns. Function of both is fine, both moulds work well (had less trouble with the Lee, actually), but there are better ones for me. Your mileage, and guns, will vary.

Gear

[MtGun44]

Speaking of round nosed 200 HP from MP ( GREAT MOLD and DESIGN) one says
he wants "boolits that feed easy". . . . implying a RN is necessary for that. Not so.

IME, NOTHING feeds one whit better than the marvelous H&G 68 and ACCURATE
reproductions (Lee is fair, not too accurate) and MP is an accurate copy. I have
a 4 cav original H&G 68 mold and have used hundreds of thousands of the
commercial clones. These WILL feed if you set them up properly.

LOA at 1.25 to 1.26, taper crimp as a separate operation to .465 to .470 at case
mouth. Set LOA and TC to match your dismounted bbl as a gauge.

All that said - the MP 200 RN HP is a superb, accurate and reliable design. I
strongly support it - along with the H&G 68 and good clones.

While I have many Lee molds and like them well enough, they are NOT
in the same class as the MP molds, which are finest quality.

Bill

[MT Chambers]

I wouldn't mention Lee and Mihec in the same sentence.

[NoZombies]

I've got a Lee copy, and an original H&G. The differences are subtle, but enough to make a difference in the outcome.

The Lee's nose seems to be a touch longer, something like .015. It's not a lot, but it makes a difference in some of my guns. The H&G works better than the Lee for me. I understand the Mihec is an accurate copy of the H&G. I didn't need one at the time of the buy, so I can't say for sure.

I have some guns that will eat anything without a hiccup, and do so accurately. I have some guns that are more finicky. The finicky guns tend to prefer the Lyman 452488 or the H&G #130, much to my chagrin. I have one gun that likes the Lee 200 RF, but several others that choke on it consistently. Since I don't have any guns that dislike the 452488 or H&G #130, I have started to move towards standardizing them for most of my .45 loads.

[dromia]

The only real way to answer your question about the boolits rather than comparing moulds would be to see if people would send you some boolits from each mould cast in the same alloy and then try them in your gun, the one that shoots best is the mould to buy.

When you are comparing mould quality then it is apples and oranges and the price difference tells you that.

If, and it is a big if, you happen to get a Lee mould that works, doesn't keep falling apart, drops boolits freely, isn't out of alignment and casts boolits to spec or to what you require then there is nothing wrong with them and it will be a mould to cherish. However if you are not prepared for the high chances of having to return a faulty mould and having to spend time fettling it to get it to work as advertised then Lee moulds aren't for you. Quality control isn't part of Lee's business model, they get things out at a price point and the customer does the QC'ing as a consequence.

[jonp]

Is this another "are lee good quality dies or are rcbs/redding/lyman better" thread?

[koehlerrk]

When I started casting five years ago, my first mold was a Lee 38 cal 125gr conical. Five years later, I still use that mold a lot for making 38 plinkers for the kids. Lee molds are great for that, and they're inexpensive. But for serious work, meaning hunting or target shooting, I use Saeco or Lyman molds, and now, I'm waiting for an email about my very first Mihec mold.... Yes, it's a progression, as I've gotten more experience, I've gotten better at casting boolits, and I've been upgrading to better tools as my abilities improve. Now I think I'm ready for some high-end molds. Like I said, have a Mihec on order, and I'm looking at NOE for a couple of the Ranch Dog designs.

But for a novice who isn't sure about their new hobby, or for making high-volume plinking ammo, Lee molds are tough to beat.

[Mike Hughes]

If the Mihec 200 RN HP is available, I would pay the extra money, it is the best casting mold that I have (I have about 25 different molds). I wear welding gloves and open the blocks, give the pins a little push, and the boolits fall out effortlessly. I can cast faster with this mold than any of my 6 cav. Accuracy is as good or better than any I've shot. Also, if you don't like the mold, you can post it in the S & S section and will sell for probably 90% of your investment (I seriously doubt you will want to part with it)

[cbrick]

Is this another "are lee good quality dies or are rcbs/redding/lyman better" thread?

Huh? Where in this thread were dies mentioned?


I wouldn't mention Lee and Mihec in the same sentence.

No kidding! That's like comparing a Yugo with a Rolls Royce. There is a fair chance the Yugo will (maybe) get you to the grocery store but that's where the similarity ends.

Rick

[gefiltephish]

As someone pointed out above, the lee 200swc has a longer nose. It does not feed consistently in either of my RIA's. I bought a 5 cav H&G 68 clone from Accurate which casts extremely well, shoots just as well if not better than the lee and most importantly in this case, feeds flawlessly. The only thing that would make me happier would be if it had 6 cavs.

[44man]

Usually any boolit design will shoot good. Most is how you load and what you use.
Cost is a huge factor so I do have a lot of lee molds and have made many molds myself. I have hundreds of molds that I would not have if I had to pay a lot.
No matter how cheap the mold, even the dead soft aluminum Lee uses will not wear out.

[45-70 Chevroner]

I wouldn't mention Lee and Mihec in the same sentence.

You just did.[smilie=s:

[45-70 Chevroner]

Usually any boolit design will shoot good. Most is how you load and what you use.
Cost is a huge factor so I do have a lot of lee molds and have made many molds myself. I have hundreds of molds that I would not have if I had to pay a lot.
No matter how cheap the mold, even the dead soft aluminum Lee uses will not wear out.
Here, Here. Good post.

[JonB_in_Glencoe]

While looking for a mold for my 45 acp, I noticed Mihec, Lee, & H&G all had 200gr swc molds.
The bullets from these molds all look identical.
So I did some research on line and got the impression that not all bullets were the same even if they look the same...
...Am I right or is there a difference.
Inquiring minds want to know.

There is a difference.
I have a similar SWC made by Lyman, I didn't like it, it wouldn't feed reliabily in my gun and I sold it. I have a Saeco, looks the same, feeds like it should, shoots good. BUT with all that said, I prefer 230 RN for 45acp.



Evidently from what I gathered the 200swc bullets from Mihec shot better than the other 2.

Maybe ?

[dudel]

I think the Lee molds are fine for those starting out. It's easy for a newb to accidently damage a mold. Less tears if it's a Lee that gets damaged..

For plinking boolits, it's hard to beat a Lee for price performance and amount of boolits that can be produced from a 6cav.

[geargnasher]

Is this another "are lee good quality dies or are rcbs/redding/lyman better" thread?

Uh, no, and let's keep it that way.

In the OP's referenced thread, look at post #8 and some very subtle but important differences will be obvious. Now for my opinions, which may be somewhat unique and are only opinions: I don't know who decided that the MiHec mould should have such shallow draft on the front shoulder, but they are not on my favorites list. The nose radius on the H&G is a larger diameter which means that it gets a lot less of a ding in it when it hits the top of the chamber during feeding than either the MiHec or the Lee. The Lee boolit's meplat is too small, causing a different feeding angle even though the nose is longer. The point at which the boolit nose contacts the top of the chamber and turns the cartridge parallel with the bore during feeding is very important to reliability, and not all designs take that into account.

Will they all work? Heck yes they will, if loaded correctly, sized correctly, and crimped correctly. If you're picky about extreme accuracy in your automatic, buy one chambered in .38 Super.

Gear

[Moonie]

As someone pointed out above, the lee 200swc has a longer nose. It does not feed consistently in either of my RIA's. I bought a 5 cav H&G 68 clone from Accurate which casts extremely well, shoots just as well if not better than the lee and most importantly in this case, feeds flawlessly. The only thing that would make me happier would be if it had 6 cavs.

That is very interesting, while I love Miha's work and have his 200gr HP mold, the 3 RIA's in the family run the 200gr SWC non-TL lee perfectly, even the 1 compact. Perhaps you have not found the correct length.

[mistermog]

Just wanted to chime in I had the lee version, it would NOT feed for me in a RIA 1911 whatsoever. Traded it out for a Trunc-Cone lee mold and no problems feeding. The H&G mold fed marvelously... so as it was said the Lee is not a direct copy.

[DLCTEX]

I have 6 cav moulds in 200 gr. 68 clones from Mihec and Lee. I don't see much difference in how they feed/shoot for me, my sons, and friends.The Lee has a bevel base and as such is a pain to size/lube in my lubesizer.

[Tatume]

I have 6 cav moulds in 200 gr. 68 clones from Mihec and Lee. I don't see much difference in how they feed/shoot for me, my sons, and friends.The Lee has a bevel base and as such is a pain to size/lube in my lubesizer.

Have you tried on of the nose punches from Accurate Molds? It is a simple post with a flat end, and the nose of the bullet does not go inside the punch. I suspect it may push your bevel-base bullets straight down into the die without any tipping.

Take care, Tom

[44man]

True about boolit selections. Lee does have a sad selection. Other custom makers standardize mold designs sent to them. Factories keep changing stuff. I look over the choices and might see two in a whole lineup or a caliber only has one or two choices.
Years ago I bought an NEI mold that was so out of round it was useless. I sent it back and instead of replacing it, they opened it up. To even get the boolit to chamber I had to size it so much the GG's were eliminated. Same can happen with an over size Lee TL. I hate BB boolits.
Yet most molds make good boolits.
I am a ladle man and like two cavity blocks. I am lazy and don't want anything fussy about temperatures.
I tried a friends new Lee mold and it is fussy, needs to run hotter then the old ones and cools faster. Yet cavities are beautiful.
I always said I use all my molds the same, true, but I have been running into those fussy ones lately. I wondered what all of you were saying.

[gefiltephish]

That is very interesting, while I love Miha's work and have his 200gr HP mold, the 3 RIA's in the family run the 200gr SWC non-TL lee perfectly, even the 1 compact. Perhaps you have not found the correct length.

I worked with that same lee bullet for 3 years, tried many lengths. Even had the ramps in my FS polished while it was back at the distributor for repair. I have several different brands of mags and none made any difference. They fed even worse in my brothers Kimber, but as he's 10hrs away I didn't have much time for tweaking. Switching to the Accurate bullet made the problem instantly disappear. I always hated the lee's bevel base anyway (in a Lyman luber). BTW, I also have the MP 200hp and it feeds and shoots great in both RIA's.

[whisler]

I have examples of 200 gr. SWC from Lee, Lyman & Saeco moulds, graciously supplied by a forum member. All 3 feed and function perfectly in my Llama when loaded to 1.25-1.26 OAL and crimped to .470. Accuracy would have to be judged by a better pistolero than me. I could see no difference in my short range shooting, which isn't surprising.

[mongoosesnipe]

based on my experience the lee 6 cavities are a fair bit better than the lee two cavities all my lee 2 cavities have required a little tlc i cast a few bullets then put a screw into the back of one of the bullets and coat it with 40 micron diamond lapping paste and use a drill to hone the cavity a little bit the six cavities drop perfectly with out modification also i like the lever cutting of the lee 6 cavities

[Petrol & Powder]

I don't claim to have a great deal of knowledge with bullet casting and molds but I've been around the block a few times in pursuit of other endeavors. What we're talking about here is the dichotomy of price vs. quality OR:
Perfection is the enemy of adequate vs. When you buy quality you only cry once.

Lets look at Perfection is the enemy of adequate. This phrase is often attributed to Voltaire and has been used to describe the concept of diminishing returns. At what point are you just spending more in the pursuit of the unobtainable, or unnecessary perfection? For me, I purchase quality when it matters (and I can afford it!) and spend as little as possible when adequate will suffice.
For example; I purchased a RCBS mold for the quality but use a sawed off maul handle as my mold mallet. The mold will hopefully last a lifetime and the stick used to whack the spure plate doesn't need to be special.


Now let's look at, "When you buy quality you only cry once"
I do not tolerate equipment failure very well so I attempt to avoid failures by spending money in pursuit of quality. In contrast, my father is possibly the most frugal man on earth and hates to spend money. So, I'll own a tool that was expensive but works and my father will own 4 examples of the same type of tool (3 of which are always broken) that cumulatively cost the same as my one tool. I say he's wasting money and buying frustration and he says I'm spending money like a drunken sailor. :razz:

I think it comes down to: 1. Being able to determine when quality is important to you. 2. Being able to differentiate between high quality and just high price.

[geargnasher]

I may have mistook it, but I thought the topic of question was about the relevant differences in actual boolit design between the manufacturers, not comparing mould quality/price point.

Gear

[jmort]

"I thought the topic of question was about the relevant differences in actual boolit design between the manufacturers..."

Any other intention by the O/P would be idiotic.

[Dave C.]

I've got a Lee copy, and an original H&G. The differences are subtle, but enough to make a difference in the outcome.

The Lee's nose seems to be a touch longer, something like .015. It's not a lot, but it makes a difference in some of my guns. The H&G works better than the Lee for me. I understand the Mihec is an accurate copy of the H&G. I didn't need one at the time of the buy, so I can't say for sure.

I have some guns that will eat anything without a hiccup, and do so accurately. I have some guns that are more finicky. The finicky guns tend to prefer the Lyman 452488 or the H&G #130, much to my chagrin. I have one gun that likes the Lee 200 RF, but several others that choke on it consistently. Since I don't have any guns that dislike the 452488 or H&G #130, I have started to move towards standardizing them for most of my .45 loads.

Every time I read about a "copy of the H&G#68" I laugh!!
I own and use two H&G#68 eight cavity molds that are not the same bullet!! They are close but not the same. They both shoot well but they are visably different.

Good health and good shooting.
Dave C.

[bangerjim]

I am sorry, but a hole in a hunk of metal.......is just a hole in a hunk of metal, irregardless of who's name is on it. All this "accuracy" deviation of molds everybody talks about is a great deal to do with the accuracy of the loader/shooter, not the hunk of metal the hunk of metal is cast in.

I have checked the size, concentricity, and shapes of my Lee molds to design specs and they are dead on. Of the 14 Lee molds I have, all but ONE (1) drop boolits that don't even need to be sized. I ES PC everything so I size them after coating.

Aluminum dissipates heat better and I feel is a superior metal to brass or steel for molds. You cannot slam them around, as Al is softer and will get a ding or two if your are not careful. But any quality tool should be treated with care anyway.

That is why I use Lee molds.....not the price.....the material. I am not "broke" and can afford and buy anything I want. I just like Lee molds....for their construction, availability, and, at least for me, accuracy. I do not have time or patience to wait for YEARS for a MiHeck mold.

NOE makes good molds in aluminum also. A bit more pricy, but they have boolit designs that Lee does not offer. Slug design (223's) is the only reason I would ever buy a mold that costs more than $40.

I make that 200gn 45 SWC slug, along with the 230, 255 and 300 grain 45's. All are dead on accurate right out of the Lee molds and shoot without any leading in my several 45 pistols and rifles after ES PC'ing. I use no greasy witch's brew lubes anymore.

But the choice is up to you................and your wallet. Try the Lee. If you don't like it, you are out only a few dollars and they do re-sell well!

That's my story and I'm stickin' to it.

bangerjim

[Wally]

I am sorry, but a hole in a hunk of metal.......is just a hole in a hunk of metal, irregardless of who's name is on it. All this "accuracy" deviation of molds everybody talks about is a great deal to do with the accuracy of the loader/shooter, not the hunk of metal the hunk of metal is cast in.

I have checked the size, concentricity, and shapes of my Lee molds to design specs and they are dead on. Of the 14 Lee molds I have, all but ONE (1) drop boolits that don't even need to be sized. I ES PC everything so I size them after coating.

Aluminum dissipates heat better and I feel is a superior metal to brass or steel for molds. You cannot slam them around, as Al is softer and will get a ding or two if your are not careful. But any quality tool should be treated with care anyway.

That is why I use Lee molds.....not the price.....the material. I am not "broke" and can afford and buy anything I want. I just like Lee molds....for their construction, availability, and, at least for me, accuracy. I do not have time or patience to wait for YEARS for a MiHeck mold.

NOE makes good molds in aluminum also. A bit more pricy, but they have boolit designs that Lee does not offer. Slug design (223's) is the only reason I would ever buy a mold that costs more than $40.

I make that 200gn 45 SWC slug, along with the 230, 255 and 300 grain 45's. All are dead on accurate right out of the Lee molds and shoot without any leading in my several 45 pistols and rifles after ES PC'ing. I use no greasy witch's brew lubes anymore.

But the choice is up to you................and your wallet. Try the Lee. If you don't like it, you are out only a few dollars and they do re-sell well!

That's my story and I'm stickin' to it.

bangerjim

I sure agree with you---I have many bullet molds--Lee, Lyman, RCBS, & one Saeco. Frankly I enjoy casting with the Lee molds the most of all. They have a better balance and make bullets that shoot just as good as the other "premium" brands. I am thankful that Lee makes molds as the low cost has allowed me to buy many..those that I don't like, I sell or trade.

[MtGun44]

Strongly disagree - there are HUGE differences in those "hunks of metal" in my experience. I
have many more Lee molds than MP, and most of the Lee molds work well enough to do the
job. There is absolutely zero comparison in the quality and consistency of the molds. Does this
mean I will only have MP molds? Of course not, but I can sure tell the difference.

Bill

[ballistim]

That is very interesting, while I love Miha's work and have his 200gr HP mold, the 3 RIA's in the family run the 200gr SWC non-TL lee perfectly, even the 1 compact. Perhaps you have not found the correct length.

This is of interest as I'm looking into buying a RIA and have decided to try to get this mold for it if I can find one or if there's a re-run. I'm curious - do you use one set OAL for all three guns and if so, what is it?

[Moonie]

This is of interest as I'm looking into buying a RIA and have decided to try to get this mold for it if I can find one or if there's a re-run. I'm curious - do you use one set OAL for all three guns and if so, what is it?

I have a spare barrel out of one of the RIA's (one of my sons replaced his barrel with a compensated one) and do the plunk test to set the length of all my 45 acp ammo. If it will fit in that barrel it fits in all of the 1911's in the family, even the non-RIA ones.

[ballistim]

Do you know what that OAL is? If it works for all your guns it might be a good starting point for me.