96% Tin , 4% silver solder ??

[gray wolf]

I got to talking to a plumber the other day and long story short,
he gave me about 36" of Silver solder, 96 Tin 4% Silver 1/8" a round.
This is new to me so I need to learn something.
I know I can add it to my WW but I am not sure what it will do to the mix. I was thinking about a 6" piece to a Lee 20 pound pot. I don't think the Lee pot acually holds 20 pounds of WW, seems more like 17 or 18 pounds. What say you all ?

[Wayne Smith]

Save it for casting rifle booits. It will harden your mix significantly.

[chboats]

Treat is like pure tin. The amount of silver will be insignificant. A quarter pound of tin in 20 pounds of lead is 1 percent. The amount of silver would be .04 percent.

Carl

[bangerjim]

Use this:

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?105952-Lead-alloy-calculators&highlight=lead+alloy+calculator

bangerjim

[gray wolf]

I thank you all for the comments and the help.

[Newboy]

The silver content will not be high enough to kill a werewolf, but it will make him sick.

[Rick Hodges]

6" of 1/8" round 96% solder will not be noticeable in a 20 lb. pot of alloy. What does it weigh? Maybe a 1/4 ounce? .08%???

[MtGun44]

It is VERY confusing that this plumbing low temperature solder with a tiny dab
of silver is being called "silver solder". The term "silver solder" has been properly
used for decades to denote a high temp and high strength BRAZING process.
And "silver soldering" a front sight on took about 1000F, not the much lower
temps for this plumbing solder. This adds confusion to the whole discussion.

I agree that this should be treated as pure tin, the silver is just there to add
cost and does nothing much to the final alloy.

Bill

[375RUGER]

I'd have to disagree about the proper use of terminology. The term silver soldering has been used improperly for decades. It is actually silver brazing as evidenced by MtGun44's own description of the process occurring at/above 1000*F. It has come to be accepted even though it is wrong.
Brazing is a process that requires the filler metal to have a liquidus above 840*F. The liquidus for soldering filler metal is below 840*F.
Why do we not have brass solder, only brass brazing material? The most unfortunate thing about calling silver braze "solder" is that when someone who doesn't know any better uses actually silver bearing solder in an application that really needs a braze.
It's like a lot of other terminology that we have all come to accept as common/proper whether it is or not. Why some people think of stick welding as arc welding but MIG is not arc. Primers or caps? Wheels or rims?

[Zymurgy50]

While the silver will have little hardening effect on a lead alloy, the silver allows the molten alloy to fill out the mold cavity better.
The 96/4 tin/silver (actually 95.5 tin, 3.9 silver, 0.6 copper) is becoming the standard for electronic soldering as well.
While I wouldnt call this "silver solder" I do call this "silver bearing solder". I do not cast boolits (I swage), but I do spend a bit of time every year casting fishing jigs. A quarter pound of this silver bearing solder in a 20 pound pot helps to fill out the mold completely.

[dragon813gt]

It is VERY confusing that this plumbing low temperature solder with a tiny dab
of silver is being called "silver solder".

Not really. I was using silver solder for years before I switched to Viega fittings. The term solder is the key word. Brazing rods are brazing rods and are not sold as solder. And you definitely know what you're buying when you pay the bill. The brazing wire that you buy by the troy ounce always leads to an expensive bill :laugh:

I'm sure it depends on where you live. But soldering and brazing are called two different things here and taught as such.

[Tatume]

This morning I cut off 6" of 1/8" solder and weighed it; 200 grains. While my solder is not the same composition as the OP, it will give a good idea of how much to use in bullet alloy. To make 20:1 alloy will require about 17.5 feet (not inches) of 1/8" pure tin solder (one pound) and 19 pounds of lead.

Just reread the OP's post; 36" of solder will weigh about 2-3/4 ounce. I recommend putting all of it in a pot of WW metal and don't worry about it. It should add about 1% tin if combined with 17 pounds of WW metal.

[41mag]

I got almost 16 rolls of it from a friend at work who used to install water piping in hospital and medical buildings close to where we work.

I usually only add in about 4" to a full pot of alloy and it really kicks straight WW in the rear for fill out. I'm not really using it for much more than that. I blended up some alloy with it when I first got it, but then I managed to get a couple of deals on some pure tin and I use that now instead. It's just easier to use the big chunks of pure rather than to roll off enough of the solder to do a big batch of alloy.

Hope this helps.

[Tatume]

I have my doubts how much effect 4" of solder has on a pot full of alloy, other than perhaps psychological. That is about 0.3 ounce in a nominal 320 ounce pot (20 pounds). It amounts to less than one tenth of one percent. That's assuming the solder is 100% tin.

[Mal Paso]

The OP is Solder, 96% Tin 4% Silver, with a melt point of 430F.

The Silver "Solder" I use for gun repair is actually silver brazing rod. 56% Silver, 22% Cu, 17% Zn, 5% Tin, with a melt point of 1145F. 56% is the highest Silver content Brazing Alloy I have found and has the lowest melt point of the Silver Brazing Alloys.

I looked it up and learned. Thought I'd post.

[MT Chambers]

What the op has is actually the replacement(lead free) for lead solder, and can be treated as pure tin, actual silver solder would not melt in his pot along with tin/lead.

[MtGun44]

While I agree that the "silver solder" which has been used for probably a century or more,
is actually brazing, it is still the term in wide use in industry. Suddenly calling the nearly
pure tin low temp solder "silver solder" is a PITA because it is using a previously well
established industrial term for something entirely different.

Bill

[gray wolf]

Wow, I never new there was so much you could learn about a roll of solder.
I look the name up for the solder the plumber gave me and it says that it's used in places that are for drinking water and food. ( as in none toxic )
So like many of you have said it is not a true Silver solder. I guess they replaced the Antimony with a trace of Silver.
I do like knowing these things, but It seems like it should be treated like just tin.
Then again he gave me so little of it that I wont worry about it, I will just put it in a full pot of WW and call it good.

[Echo]

I weighed out some 1/8" diameter lead-free solder, and found that 21" = 1 oz. So 6" would be about .28 oz. In 320 ozs of alloy, 6" would be something less than .1%, and I would think that would be trivial.

[bangerjim]

The OP is Solder, 96% Tin 4% Silver, with a melt point of 430F.

The Silver "Solder" I use for gun repair is actually silver brazing rod. 56% Silver, 22% Cu, 17% Zn, 5% Tin, with a melt point of 1145F. 56% is the highest Silver content Brazing Alloy I have found and has the lowest melt point of the Silver Brazing Alloys.

I looked it up and learned. Thought I'd post.

AGREE!

REAL silver brazing metal that I use comes in rods and sheets.....not would on a spool! It is very stiff and melts at high brazing temps, not soldering temps.

There is another product used a lot in the HVAC industry that is called Sil-Flo which is a very stiff fine wire that also melt at high temps and works miracles when you need to really attach something. I have a 12" roll of that stuff that weight almost 24#. It works great for brazing brass to brass.

bangerjim

[dkf]

Silver brazing alloy is steeppriced stuff. I had to use about 5 troy oz in a recent job and the cost adds up quick. And I could get by with the cheaper stuff.