After three years casting my own boolits I finally broke down and changed my .....???

[milsurpaddict]

Melting and mold process. I went from the old Coleman white gas stove and ladle to pour my Boolits to buying a Lee PRO 4 20LB melter. Man oh man the bottom pour feature and the consistent temperature has made casting fun again. No more poorly filled molds due to the ladle of the temp. Man I should have done this years ago.

[el34]

Much better, no doubt. Consistent temp? Dunno about that one. Got a thermometer?
(Don't get me wrong, I love my Lee 4-20. And I'm adding a PID controller for perfect temp consistency.)

[VHoward]

Probably more consistant than the camp stove.

[milsurpaddict]

Probably more consistant than the camp stove.

That is what I meant thank you

[bangerjim]

The electric melters are definitely better than a camp stove! Can't imagine using anything else.

I have a 4# melter and a 20# bottom pour. I have found out over time, the temp is really not as critical as many here say. Definitely not critical enough for a microprocessor-based temp controller. I have found for most molds, the setting between 6 and 7 works perfectly. ( my .309 rifle and 12ga slug molds needs a setting of 8 due to cavity size) My boolits drop totally filled out and perfectly formed on the 1st pour.......every time. I guess I just hold my mouth right!

HA.....ha.

But I personally see no need for a PID controller and thermocouple and all the wiring and clutter associated with them. And I sell them in my engineering company!!!!

bangerjim

[el34]

Probably more consistant than the camp stove.

Absolutely. Apologies to the OP for sounding negative, any big improvement is a good thing.

[el34]

Definitely not critical enough for a microprocessor-based temp controller.

You're right, a casting pot has no requirement to hold temp +/- 0.2 degrees.

I get aggravated at my Lee 4-20 because of the 100 deg swingss between adding new ingots to when the heater finally backs off. I try to maintain 650 +/- 25 deg and find myself watching the thermometer as much as everything else so I can keep tweaking the control. Adding the PID, gross overkill as it is, will eliminate all that. I have a light that tells me when the pot is within my defined range of 'temp good'. And being a true thermostat it will pump up the power when new ingots are added, back off when temp is reached. It just rocks.

[DxieLandMan]

That is what I started with and what I currently use. It is great and fun to use.

[el34]

That is what I started with and what I currently use. It is great and fun to use.

What's that? The Coleman? The PID?
Idea: PID-controlled Coleman camp stove. It could happen.

[taco650]

My wife sold the Coleman camp stove, a propane unit, when we moved. Haven't been able to afford a "real" pot yet. Looked at a 900watt electric burner at Walmart and a stainless pot combo (~$32+tax) but just couldn't bring myself to buy them. The local thrift store has been a bust for usable stuff. I'm cheap and hate to buy single-purpose items unless I know I'm going to use them enough to justify the expense. I realize the Lee bottom pour 10 & 20lb bottom pours are a good value but...

[Muddydogs]

I also don't have a problem with my Lee 20 pound pot and the temp control. After using it a couple times and finding just how much to turn the dial I can control the temp to within 50 degrees.

The trick to adding lead to the pot is when you are getting close to needing lead turn up the pot and slow down your casting. Once the pot gets 100 or so degrees hotter, some experimenting is needed as the temp will vary depending on how much lead you are adding, add your lead, crank up the pot temp and speed up casting to maintain mold temp. As the pot temp starts to raise start turning the temp back down to where it needs to be. This is basically all a PID does and it’s very easy to accomplish with a thermometer in the post and knowing about what the numbers on the pot temp control mean. One way to keep from having to add lead all the time to the pot is return the sprue to the pot each time one is cut, this way there is a continuous flow of lead back into the pot.

[dragon813gt]

The temp of the pot will vary greatly depending on how much lead is in the pot. Temp setting 7 doesn't meant it will be at say 725 from full to empty. If you have a thermometer you will see the very large swings from just using the pot and draining the contents. And temp does matter when using tin in an alloy. W/ the cost of it you don't want to lose any to oxidization. Is a PID needed? Absolutely not. But I find that I cast a greater quantity of bullets per hour because I no longer have to monitor the thermometer and adjust the rheostat. It also insures that I never make the melt to hot to lose any tin. If you set the knob to the highest setting you can shoot well over 850.

[USAFrox]

Congratulations on the upgrade! I second (third? fourth? fifth?) the recommendation of getting a PID. So much better! Just wait - we'll make you broke yet, by helping you save so much money casting!

[jethunter]

You're right, a casting pot has no requirement to hold temp +/- 0.2 degrees.

I get aggravated at my Lee 4-20 because of the 100 deg swingss between adding new ingots to when the heater finally backs off. I try to maintain 650 +/- 25 deg and find myself watching the thermometer as much as everything else so I can keep tweaking the control. Adding the PID, gross overkill as it is, will eliminate all that. I have a light that tells me when the pot is within my defined range of 'temp good'. And being a true thermostat it will pump up the power when new ingots are added, back off when temp is reached. It just rocks.

When you add the new ingot, the temperature will still drop the same amount, the only difference is that the PID will kick the heater into full output instead of you having to do it manually.

I warm my pot up 25-30 degrees warmer than it needs to be just before I add the ingot so the temp doesn't drop as low. And I add the ingots as soon as there is room in the pot - adding it when the pot is low makes the temperature drop more drastically. Adding the extra ingot when the pot is still 3/4 full the temp only drops 40-50 degrees and warms back up to temp that much faster. Usually I don't even have to stop casting when I add ingots if i do it like that.

A PID can't think ahead and prewarm the pot for you. It can only react to real time changes.

[el34]

When you add the new ingot, the temperature will still drop the same amount, the only difference is that the PID will kick the heater into full output instead of you having to do it manually.

A PID can't think ahead and prewarm the pot for you. It can only react to real time changes.

I completely agree. But I don't have to manage it, the controller makes it automatic at an affordable price. I recently finished my PID project and added 3 bright lights, one of them lights when the pot is within the temp range I specify. Currently my set point is 650, my 'TEMP OK' light is on if the pot is + or - 15 deg of the set point. All that is easily changed in seconds.

Another light is wired directly to the 110VAC output to the pot and shows me when the pot is heating.

A third light comes on if the temp gets too high, currently set at 20deg above my setpoint but I'll probably increase it. Its purpose is to tell me something's wrong, either a shorted SSR or a faulty controller or I left the manual override on.

All that constantly keeps me aware of what's going on without having to remember to check. If the green light is shining in my face I know I'm good. In my case, that's a good thing.

[Smoke4320]

I have only been casting alloys for about 4 months now (pure lead Muzzleloader bullets for many years .. finally got a PID 2 months ago.. wish I had done it from the start.. takes all the guess work out .. easy to adjust to desired temp . easy to see when pot is up to temp after adding lead
and get very consistent results

[gideons301]

Someone on this board posted some pictures a while back showing one bottom pour pot feeding into another, wherein the ingots were put into the top pot and then fed melted, at temperature alloy into the pot being poured from. Looked pretty slick to me. I finally got my hands on the second pot for such a setup, just need to find the time to put it all together.

[Oreo]

PIDs? Just sell the 4-20 and buy a ProMelt! ;)

[jethunter]

PIDs? Just sell the 4-20 and buy a ProMelt! ;)

Just sell the Promelt and buy six 4-20 and a PID!

[Mike Hughes]

I have been using my Lee pro 20 for about 5 years. I am sure the PID is nice, but I feel like I get by fine without it. I never let the pot run down very far before I add a small ingot. I only add one ingot at a time and that prevents the huge swing with temp. I water drop all my boolits and I will occasionally drop some on a dry towel and (with pliers) inspect under the magnifier. Once you hit the sweet spot, you can crank out good boolits at a fast pace.

[taco650]

I have been using my Lee pro 20 for about 5 years. I am sure the PID is nice, but I feel like I get by fine without it. I never let the pot run down very far before I add a small ingot. I only add one ingot at a time and that prevents the huge swing with temp.

What did you melt your lead with before getting the Lee Pro 20?

[ravyynr1]

How expensive was the pid set up? Any tutorials on setting it up?

[ronaldod]

How expensive was the pid set up? Any tutorials on setting it up?

Take a look at the first sticky in "casting equipment" There is even a complete kit for sale for $130. Just need to add some hands and time to complete the kit.

[500MAG]

PIDs? Just sell the 4-20 and buy a ProMelt! ;)
I have a PID on my 4-20 and my ProMelt.

[taco650]

Does having the PID make it get the lead up to temp quicker when you first start a casting session?

[dragon813gt]

Does having the PID make it get the lead up to temp quicker when you first start a casting session?

Not really. The pot can only come up as fast as it can. With a PID it won't overshoot the target temp. And you don't have to monitor the pot at all.

[John Boy]

PIDs? Just sell the 4-20 and buy a ProMelt!

Why should I buy a Pro-Melt for $347?

The heart of your RCBS Pro-Melt is the accurate, industrial quality thermostat located inside the unit. The placement of the remote sensor, on the bottom surface of the melting pot, senses the actual temperature of the molten alloy
I can achieve an accurate temperature reading at the bottom of the pot, within 2 degrees accuracy, using a digital thermometer with a stainless steel K-type probe in a Lee 20 lb Magnum Melter that costs $58.00. Bring the melt up to temperature, ladle pour and control the temperature so the sprue puddle frosts in 5 seconds and cast 500 plus grain bullets that weigh within 0.5grs variance which I shoot a lot of long distance out to 1000yds. Bullets at this distance with a 1 gr weight variance require a sight change of 4 MOA - reason to shoot 0.5gr weight variance ones