Surplus 'Persian' 8mm??

[mikeym1a]

This may not be the correct forum for this question, but, here goes, anyway. I recently bought some surplus 8X57 ammo:?: for a really good price. The young man who sold it to me told me that he experienced hangfires and misfires. I bought it for the brass. It is supposed to be of "Persian" manufacture. It's good looking ammo, no corrosion. He was trying to shoot through an old Yugo mod 24. I suspect he has either a slightly short firing pin, or a weak firing pin spring. The size of the indent in the primer of the 5 round that he had fired are very shallow. Does anyone know anything about this 'Persian' ammo? I got it for $7/20rds. Thanks for any replies.

[462]

Figure on it being Berdan primered and corrosive.

[mikeym1a]

Figure on it being Berdan primered and corrosive.
Well, yeah. Goes without saying. What I was looking for was a performance report of anyone who might have used any. I've heard that ammo made in the middle east if generally of poor quality, and I wanted to know if anyone had had any experience, good or bad, with it.:smile:

[jonp]

I have used a great deal of 8x57 surplus from a variety of different countries. Unless is is obviously corroded I would not worry a great deal about it as I did not experience a bunch of misfires myself which is not to say you won't of course. I agree with you that the problem might have been in his gun not the ammo.

[HighHook]

I believe some of the silver tip stuff was designed for the navy. Very hard on the barrel. Not sur what you have.

[Dale in Louisiana]

Years back a lot of stuff was imported from Iran (Persia). Perhaps this is some of that.
$7 for 20? I guess times have changed.

dale in Louisiana

[462]

"Does anyone know anything about this 'Persian' ammo?"

"Well, yeah. Goes without saying."

Just trying to be helpful, man.

[felix]

The Turks are making top notch ammo these days, however. ... felix

[390ish]

Almost all the 24/47 rifles imported had tired firing pin springs. That and some world-class cosmoline in the firing pin channel. Dried. A hot air gun and wolff replacement spring fixed my problems. The Iranian ammo was set up on good machinery, from what I recall.

[dbosman]

The Iranian ammo was set up on good machinery, from what I recall.

I would expect it to be up to Lake City quality equipment considering who probably paid for it. ;-)

[mikeym1a]

Thanks for the replies. I'll just have to give it a try and see what happens. I've heard about this ammo being bad, and that ammo being junk, and wonder. Most of this stuff was originally made for somebodies military, and generally, it's made to fire under the adverse conditions. Unless it's old and degenerated badly, it should go bang. My 8mm is a spanish version. I got it because the guy said it didn't fire half the time. So, I took it apart, found a very weak firing pin. Got a new one from Numrick. I'll see if it makes a proper dint in the primer. Does anyone know what the headstamp on the persian cases look like? I found on illustration earlier, and it doesn't look like what I have. Mysteries, mysteries......

[nvbirdman]

If you believe it is Berdan primed, why did you buy it for the brass?

[RPRNY]

As far as I know, firearms using 8x57js ammo continued in service up through their war with Iraq in the 1980s. This means that your surplus ammo could date from the 1930's through the early Sixties.

[Dutchman]

Word on the net is:


The young man who sold it to me told me that he experienced hangfires and misfires.

Frankly, I'd take him at his word. Crappy old ammo usually hangfires and mis-fires.

Dutch :)

[dondiego]

It might be Egyptian. I bought an 8 mm Hakim semi-auto rifle in the late 80's and it came with a thousand rounds of Egyptian ammo. The ammo was billed as iffy and it was! Still is too.

[Prospector Howard]

Back when all that cheap 8mm ammo was being imported, I bought one 20 round box at a gunshow that was supposed to be "Persian". It had some weird looking marks on the headstamp I remember. Glad I only bought one box. Put 5 rounds in and 3 out of 5 were hangfires. Pulled the slugs from the rest and reloaded them in some good brass to get rid of them and chalked it up to experience. Never had that problem with the Turkey and Yugo stuff.

[mikeym1a]

Strange looking 'arabic' script on the head. Brass looks really good. No corrosion. Primers sealed and crimped. As to being berdan primed, I like a challenge. Several options. If nothing else, I can pull the slug and powder, and sell the brass as scrap. No sense of adventure?

[jonp]

Come to think of it most 8mm I fired was yugo but some from other places. I cant remember a misfire myself. I do remember paying about $60 for a spam can and had several at the time. Nice round and easy on the shoulder

[mikeym1a]

I have found a few places that offer 'assorted' 8mm for around $80/200. Plus shipping, of course. I'll have to give my mystery ammo a try, just to see if it is going to fire. I'll use the 'pre-dented' models, first. :-P

[mikeym1a]

well, the test went poorly. The 'pre-dented' models did nothing. So, I tried one of the 'un-dented' models. load, click, bang. In that order. almost a full second between the fall of the firing pin and the report. And a mighty report it was. Case looked normal, no primer flattening, or firing pin cratering. Just a delayed ignition. Still, the firing pin indent from this old spanish mauser doesn't look very deep. Seems it should be deeper.78324

[mikeym1a]

HHHMMM> doesn't look that big in real life. :p

[390ish]

I am going to say it is a firing pin spring issue. Milsurp Crazy Eight, with the exception of the Romaninan and German tends to have extremely tough primers. Have you tried any 50's Yugo with that Spanish rifle? If so, how did it do?

[mikeym1a]

No. Almost brand new to me. I did replace the firing pin spring shortly after I got it. The previous owner complained of hang fires. This spring looked a lot better than the one I replaced. I'm not sure if it was a new spring or a used one. Guess I'll have to look around and find a new one. Going the economy route only works so often. Thanks. :-)

[mroliver77]

I went with new spring from Wolfe. Solved my dud and hang fires with Yugo ammo.

[mongoosesnipe]

samco sells the Persian 8mm by the case http://www.samcoglobal.com/Ammo-8mm.html i still have a bunch of portuguese 8mm from when i got my Persian Mauser (which is an exquisite gun) i saw the Persian ammo for sale a while back but when i saw corrosive and berdan i lost interest the price isnt that great anyway

[Dale in Louisiana]

You might want to disassemble that bolt again and check to see if you have hardened grease/crud packed in the forward end if teh bolt bore. This is not unusual. It cushions the firing pin and also makes it short-stroke, neither of them a good idea.

dale in Louisiana
(Expert at degunking old guns)

[Dale in Louisiana]

You might want to disassemble that bolt again and check to see if you have hardened grease/crud packed in the forward end if teh bolt bore. This is not unusual. It cushions the firing pin and also makes it short-stroke, neither of them a good idea.

dale in Louisiana
(Expert at degunking old guns)

[mikeym1a]

You might want to disassemble that bolt again and check to see if you have hardened grease/crud packed in the forward end if teh bolt bore. This is not unusual. It cushions the firing pin and also makes it short-stroke, neither of them a good idea.

dale in Louisiana
(Expert at degunking old guns)

I'll have to give that a try. I did 'look' through it, by didn't clean it, since I could see 'light!' through the firing pin hole. BTW, most of my guns give a centered firing pin impression. This one is off center. Is that an issue? Thanks!

[Shiloh]

Figure on it being Berdan primered and corrosive.

Bank on it.

Shiloh

[Shiloh]

Almost all the 24/47 rifles imported had tired firing pin springs. That and some world-class cosmoline in the firing pin channel. Dried. A hot air gun and wolff replacement spring fixed my problems. The Iranian ammo was set up on good machinery, from what I recall.

Had a Yugo M-48 like that. after it was warmed up, you could pull the trigger and watch in slow motion as the firing pin moved. Lock time measured in phases of the moon.

Shiloh

[mikeym1a]

I'll have to give that a try. I did 'look' through it, by didn't clean it, since I could see 'light!' through the firing pin hole. BTW, most of my guns give a centered firing pin impression. This one is off center. Is that an issue? Thanks!

Ordered a Wolff spring kit for the gun. It comes with a 22lb FP spring. The reference said the factory is 19lb. Didn't want to go too heavy.

[Dale in Louisiana]

I'll have to give that a try. I did 'look' through it, by didn't clean it, since I could see 'light!' through the firing pin hole. BTW, most of my guns give a centered firing pin impression. This one is off center. Is that an issue? Thanks!

Mikey-

I understand, but what happens sometimes is that dried grease and debris gets packed up forward in the bolt, making a little washer of gunk that shortens the protrusion of the firing pin.

dale in Louisiana

[mikeym1a]

Mikey-

I understand, but what happens sometimes is that dried grease and debris gets packed up forward in the bolt, making a little washer of gunk that shortens the protrusion of the firing pin.

dale in Louisiana

Okay, I'll definitely look into that. I'll dismount the housing, take it outside with some brakekleen, and a strong light. thanks....

[mikeym1a]

Just took the bolt apart, and couldn't see any gunk in the body. I'll still clean it with brakeklean tomorrow.

[jonp]

nothing wrong with corrosive ammo. Just clean the gun afterwards like you are using a muzzleloader. Not a big deal at all.