any actual heavy boolit kills with 300aac

[nekshot]

My search here has given nothing. Does any one know of specific 200gr plus boolit kills with this cartridge. What speed, alloy and boolit type. I here a lot of chatter but cannot find actual I took this animal with this sub sonic heavy boolit information. I know the lighter loads will work, but I am not sold on this real slow heavy stuff until I find proven info. I patiently await to be enlightened!
nekshot

[Jupiter7]

Ask and ye shall receive. This thread is the reason I started casting.

http://www.300blktalk.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=145&t=81647

[quilbilly]

A 220 gr boolit of soft lead has a lot of momentum for penetration and expansion. My personal rule for a boolit of soft lead of that diam and shape would be a minimum terminal velocity of about 775 fps. A subsonic boolit like that should still have that retained velocity at about 75 yards but the shot better be well placed. I don't know, however, if your gun will like a soft lead boolit. Before I would hunt with it, I would do the wet phone book terminal ballistics test at about 40 yards ( soak a stack of soaked phone books about 18" thick and see what the boolit does).

[nekshot]

jupiter, I saw that article awhile back and I was hoping he would say the distance but I never caught if he did. I have done more than my share of experimenting with wet books, wet and soft anything I could think of imitating a carcass. I used to work in a butcher shop as a kid and I butchered alot of deer shot with everything imaginable but I am intrigued with this heavy boolit. The heaviest I have is lee 200 and I will be shooting after I am back on my feet from surgery. I simply am trying to get as much info on heavy slow 30 cal kills hopefully alittle further than 30 yards.

[Jupiter7]

I'm not shooting supressed nor do I really need sub-sonic velocity. I loaded mine a little warmer. Currently with accurate 31-240e(245gr), I run them plain based, .309, tumble lubed at 1245fps avg. Much quieter than the light supers and still enough weight and velocity for expansion(I hope). I did try straight mixed WW water quenched in 5 milk jugs at about 10yds, complete pass through and no signs of expansion, no bullet recovery. I've since been air cooling with softer alloy.

[Hamish]

Ask and ye shall receive. This thread is the reason I started casting.

http://www.300blktalk.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=145&t=81647

Several varieties and flavors of bias, ignorance, and failed mythology touched on in that thread, not to mention the interesting picture by the site admin.

[rosst]

Hi, tried 210s in 30 caliber at sub speed, 1025fps . . . ended up going to 170 lead WW boolits designed for the 30/30, just as good penetration wise.

77698

picture shows target shot when i arrived after traveling to where i hunt to check zero - animal was shot the next day at 191.5 yards, down hill at 37 degree angle, funny how things can work out. boolit broke spine then thru ribs on the way out, instant drop. had just shot a hind ( 85 yards ) around the hill not long before.

rifle is a brno, scope TMR mk4

cheers

[nekshot]

Jupiter do you know how far you can shoot and hold a decent groub?

rosst that is impressive! What speed was that boolit traveling?
I read a chap saying the heavy boolits or bullets with out suppressor sub sonic sound about like a 9mm pistol. I am not to concerned about sound but I don't want to spend alot of money on heavy molds chasing wishful ideas. I know it doesn't take much to kill a deer with a well placed shot but I am interested how far these slow heavies stay reasonably together. I read of bullets tumbling and softball size exit holes in deer but I am from missouri so "show Me".

[rosst]

just a quick reply sorry nekshot, get back later with more info . . . boolit would be going about 900fps on impact approx at 200. rifle groups around moa for 5 shots off the bench, one bag under my right hand, nothing behind, i dont use bipods. i practice out to 200 yards most range sessions with my .22lr and the .308 subs with the occassional 325 yards, usually stays within 1.5moa
never seen the dreaded tumbling thing, sounds more imagination than fact to me, but i could be wrong. yaw is a better word for the occurance but that does'nt sound dramatic enough for some . . . cheers R

[Jupiter7]

I've never shot the 31-240e at paper for groups past 100yds. The 2x times I have shot at 100 on paper, 1.5" was best I've done from a rest with rear bags. But again, that's been with a 10" AR pistol, not the most steady of platforms and I'm not a bench rest type of shooter. At 50yds with earplugs, you can hear it hit the cardboard backer.

[richhodg66]

Will those super heavies designed for the Blackout stabilize in a standard 1 in 10" twist of a .30-06?

[nekshot]

jupiter that sure sounds like you are getting something right. I cannot hunt anywhere at my present hunting ground that depending on which spot I look I can shoot 200 yards. So I am concerned with 200 yard accuracy. 40 years ago I was trying to turn my 30-06 into a 300 mag with 180 grainers and now I am turning to rainbow trajectory. I hope this isn't that second childhood thing you hear about!!!
nekshot

[leeggen]

To help search there is a "Google search cast boolits", it was designed by one of the members so it would be easier to find things in cast boolits. That might help
CD

[pipehand]

Will those super heavies designed for the Blackout stabilize in a standard 1 in 10" twist of a .30-06?

I loaded up a bunch of the Lee 311-230's in a Ruger 77 MKII chambered for 7.62.39 with a 1:10" twist. 11.5 grains of IMR 4227 took them to 1200+ fps, and they were stable and accurate at 50 yards. Haven't gotten to check them slower or farther, but if they work in a small cartridge with a 1:10" I'd imagine they'd do well in an '06. I tried them in the same gun with a very small charge of Red Dot, unchronographed, but obviously way subsonic, and got full profile sideways boolit holes at 50 yards.

[rosst]

77740

same trip 120 yards shooting uphill . .. bangflop.

load is 170 RCBS FP cast .311 thru RCBS sizer with beeswax/lithium grease lube, no sizing over 7.0grns unique with filler, winchester case, WLR primer, using Forster neck pushing bump die with Lyman bushing seater, boolit engages rifling on chambering. this an accurate consistant load.

i am using a smartphone app ( strelok ) to work out firing solutions and a rangefinder, a backup drop chart is a good idea.
barrel is 18'' used to have an overbarrel suppressor now using a lighter can type which has similar performance . . .

i have pritty much finnished with .30 cal subsonics, moving onto .45LC subs with heavier boolits, they do a better job by a very wide margin

cheers R.

[richhodg66]

I loaded up a bunch of the Lee 311-230's in a Ruger 77 MKII chambered for 7.62.39 with a 1:10" twist. 11.5 grains of IMR 4227 took them to 1200+ fps, and they were stable and accurate at 50 yards. Haven't gotten to check them slower or farther, but if they work in a small cartridge with a 1:10" I'd imagine they'd do well in an '06. I tried them in the same gun with a very small charge of Red Dot, unchronographed, but obviously way subsonic, and got full profile sideways boolit holes at 50 yards.

Thanks. I hadn't thought about the 7.62x39, but I have a good rifle in that chambering too.

[nekshot]

thanks rosst for that info. I can understand where you are coming from with the heavier caliber. By the end of august I will be able to speak with more authority on this 30 cal slow boolit thing Lord willing. I am trying to keep an open mind to it but I think the yardage and accuracy some folk talk is fantasy with those 230 and heavier boolits. I notice a number actually use the lighter boolits as you did for hunting.

[nekshot]

ok, I cast some boolits 30 cal,rcbs180 and lee200 mixture was 1/2 ww and1/2 pure lead . I shot them in a 30-30 sub-sonic into a wet phone book pak(I keep one wet for crazy ideas) and found something maybe interesting. Sized and lubed I shot a lee200 ww first followed with a 180 rcbs(ww-pure lead) and a lee 200 same mixture. The ww lee went straight thru to back and stopped. The others stopped about 3 inches short of back. I than took rcbs and the lee boolits and hollow pointed them and presto things turned around(really). Once I got a deep enough hollow point they both expanded(the lee to .460 , rcbs to .490) as pretty as you want but both ended up backwards. Only about 1\2 the penetration of the non hollowpoint but way plenty for deer. Kinda like what I learned!

[nekshot]

after final testing for me here is what i got. Hollow point either 3/32 diam by 1/4 inch deep or 1/8 diam by 3/16 deep. Keep speed sub-sonic and smile, they work. Filing a flat on lee200 helped it alot over round nose. Any deeper hollow point and they had a tendency to lose some of the mushroom on one side. These will do damage.

[303Guy]

Will those super heavies designed for the Blackout stabilize in a standard 1 in 10" twist of a .30-06?Not so much at subsonic velocities. Supersonic yes. I've shot 245gr with my Brit which is 1-in-10.

[rosst]

I am trying to keep an open mind to it but I think the yardage and accuracy some folk talk is fantasy with those 230 and heavier boolits.

i am not sure how far they can shoot accurately either but i bet its a way further than most people would think . .. take this as an example
77883
this is my .22 sako testing the mk4 at the 300 yard line before i put it on the brno. i was shooting CCI standard velocity ammo, 40grns 1050fps, accuracy was 1.5 to 2.0moa on days when i could cope with the wind which was only slightly larger than the 100 group sizes. so what could a 230grn boolit be capable of thats nearly 5 times the weight and a better BC . . .

look forward to seeing how you go nekshot

cheers R

[popper]

Nekshot interesting results. Thickness of wet stack? Distance shot? Did the solids come apart?

[Hogtamer]

You guys oughta peruse the shotgun threads where we load some REALLY BIG lead (1 oz and bigger) at 1500 fps or so!!! Pretty amazing results even out of smooth bores.

[nekshot]

popper the stack is 15 inches thick. I normally shoot from 80 yards to test(trying to duplicate field velocity) but because I slowed these down so low I shot from 10 feet. The solids never came apart until I started messing with hollow pointing. It was at that point they started to tumble(turn around) and those penetrated 7 inches and when they started turning they really made a mess of things. I totally believe the reports of softball size exit holes I heard of. My thoughts are the mushroom hollow points and slow speed caused the back to pass the front because there was not enough momentum to push straight. I must say on the non hollow point boolits with ww/lead mixture they were swelling alittle bit. The hard ww boolets looked like they could be fired again. I shot a few slightly over the crack of sound and they started breaking up but still went 7-9 inches in. I am set on getting a load around 1050 fps with the rcbs180fn and hollow pointed 3/16 deep. Those really worked well. I mess around with this stuff alot and these rcbs boolits looked like the nosler/horn 165 jacket bullets I cut off noses to about 140 gr, a little hollow point in tip and fill with silicon to make it ok against primers and shot at 2000fps the mushroom is spectacular. They retain almost all their weight. I like that kind of perfomance. This was the first I saw cast (for me) look this nice.

[BK7saum]

No pics but have one kill with the NOE 247 whisper boolit hollowpointed. Alloy was 50/50 wheelweight /pure lead with a little tin added. Air cooled and gaschecked. Muzzle velocity approximately 1050.

Entrance was to rear of right shoulder and on a rib. Clipped aorta and vessels from top of heart. Continued through offside left shoulder. I found a dime size or little smaller semi-flat piece of boolit from the expanded hollowpoint but expansion might not have been complete until contact with offside shoulder.

Doe was approximately 85 pounds field-dressed. Shot was also about 105 yards. Rifle is a boltaction 700 chambered in 300 whisper.

Brad

[nekshot]

I sure wish I had that 247 mold. Till than I wil make do with what I have. Here is a pic of these boolits. The one on left is a 165 nosler cut down to 140 gr( found how these work when trying to get bullets to function in sav 340) next is the rcbs 180fn hollow pointed, the others are lee 200 rn which need to be filed flat to mushroom like the rcbs. I hunt right against posted property so I MUST drop my deer. Barnes work perfect put the nosler/hornady flat nosed and hollow pointed work as well. I never was able to keep wwboolits together and to expand the way I felt would drop deer at 150 yards. However I will trust this rcbs in my 300 this fall.
77971

[303Guy]

nekshot, have you tried the hammer test on those boolits? I made a tough copper/tin/antimony alloy that resisted edge cracking and wouldn't flatten quite as thin as 2 coins together. I don't know how much copper but the tin was quite a bit higher than antimony, I think.

[rosst]

read an interesting theory about bullet speed and what point you got tissue tearing or mearly tissue being pushed out of the way in the temporary cavity . . . did make me wonder if the effort of lookin for a reliable mushrooming bullet at sub speed was worth the effort. a solid that went thru the animal destroyng lungs/heart in a as reliable a fashion as one could get under field conditions might not be a better idea . . . no doubt not all will agree with this approach.

R.

[Adam10mm]

Several varieties and flavors of bias, ignorance, and failed mythology touched on in that thread, not to mention the interesting picture by the site admin.
Rob is one of those guys that is so smart he's naive. MIT grad and head of AAC's R&D department. Guy knows his stuff. He's just a genius trapped in the jacketed bullet world.