311041 in a 308

[ValorsMinion]

I've never shot cast boolits in a rifle but I'm about to start. I just got my 311041 in the mail yesterday and got a 100 of them cast up in wcww. I will be using a gas check, pan lubing with Darr lube (cus its what I have, I have some 2500+ on the way but I want to shoot this weekend), and sizing to .309. I want to shoot them in my Reminton 700 in 308. Its barrel twist is 1 in 10".

Right now I would be extremely happy if I can get these to group within 2" at 100 yards but eventually I want to use them to hunt deer and hog out to 200 yards.

I'm kind of at a loss for where to start developing a load for them. I don't have access to a chronograph so I will be in the dark on velocity.
What powders should I try and how far out should I seat the boolits? I have blc2, imr4895, tac, 2230, h335, varget, rl15, unique, titegroup, 2400, red dot, w231, power pistol, h110.

From Lymans book, it looks like they list loads for Unique, 2400, and h335 as well as a load for a 180gr boolit with 4895. I don't have much unique on hand and that load tops out of 1800fps so I think I will not try it.

I think the 2400 load data Lyman gives is probably pretty solid as it goes from 1600-2000fps. From what I've read, this sounds like it might make a decent hunting load if it is accurate towards the high end. I will load some up from min to max in 1gr increments.

Where I start scratching my head is with the H335 load. The h335 load starts at 1850fps with 30gr and goes to 2790fps with 44gr. That max load is more powder and velocity that is listed for similar weight jacketed bullets. I would assume I want to stay well away from the high end that they have listed. How high over 30gr should I try to avoid barrel leading?

Lyman's lists data for imr4895 for the 180gr 311332. I assume this will be safe to use for the 311041 as it is only a few grains lighter. Am I wrong? Its goes from 1900fps to 2370fps so I will stay a couple grains under the max to keep the velocity a bit below that.

Anyone have any suggestions for other loads with the powders I have on hand?

Finally, should I seat the boolit to the crimp groove? This will put a fair bit of the base sticking into the case past the shoulder. If I seat it so the base is not in the case then a lube groove will be outside the case.

[leadman]

The 2400 should work well starting at 18grs and work up. 18grs should be in the 1,500 to 1,600 fps range. The top loads with this powder may or may not do well. If it is not good use the 4895.
If your magazine will allow it load the boolits so they are just off the rifling for hunting. I load just into the rifling for shooting off the bench but the boolit may stick in the bore if you have to unload the gun without firing for some reason.
If the lube outside the case bothers you try it with that groove empty. The 2500 should be hard enough to give you no problems with exposed lube if you keep it clean.

[Lizard333]

What does your mold drop the boolits at? It can very quite a bit. My mold drops that boolit at 183 grains after lube and gas check. My Winchester 94 in 30-30 really does great with the H335. I'm pushing it 2030 FPS with excellent accuracy. If it were me, I'd start with that powder.

[Larry Gibson]

"wcww"? Is that water cooled WWs?

You will get a better alloy if you mix 2% tin with COWWs. I prefer to air cool the cast bullets for 7-10 days for using in most of my .30-.31 cals. I also have found .311 to be the better 'all around" sizing for most all .30 cals including the .308W. If you've a Lee sizer you can hone it out easily or you can get a .311. Make sure the GCs are seated solidly, flat and square on the bullet's shank. The 2500+ will work quite well when you get it.
Seat the 311041s so the front driving band is slightly engraved by the leade. Hopefully the GC or at least the top of it will still be in the case neck.

Neck size your fire formed cases and use a .31 M die if using bullets sized.311. Use a .30 cal M die for bullets sized .309.

I suggest you go with the IMR4895. Start at 26 gr and use a 1/2 gr dacron filler. Work up to 32 gr shooting 10 shot groups at 100 yards. The accuracy going south will tell you when you've used enough powder. You chould get excellent accuracy (2 moa or less) in the 1800 - 1950 fps range. You should be able to shoot these all day long with no leading and the same accuracy w/o cleaning the barrel. That load will also do very nicely for hunting to 150 yards or so.

For strictly hunting I suggest casting the 311041s out of COWs with 2% tin added and then add an equal amount of lead for a 50/50 alloy. Again let the bullets AC 7-10 days before sizing, GCing, lubing and loading. Load over the same load of IMR4895 as above or you can probably pick up another 100 - 150 fps of useable velocity with hunting accuracy to boost the effective range to 200 yards by using a slower powder such as RL19, AA4350, H4831SC or RL22. Use the dacron filler with all of those if load density is less than 80%. You can also maintain the best accuracy with that softer bullet (it will expand very nicely for quicker kills) by cleaning the barrel every 7 - 8 shots. That's ok for hunting as if you've not got the deer in 8 shots you might as well go home anyway........

For the 100 bullets you have sized at .309 I suggest 28 gr IMR4895 with the 1/2 gr dacron filler. That is most often a decent load in 10" twist .30 cals. Go shooting and get your initial zero with it. Have fun.....

Larry Gibson

[blikseme300]

If you have not yet read the sticky in the Cast Boolits area I recommend you do so: http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?158805-Just-a-few-tips-for-new-rifle-casters

Larry's information above is very good but might be overwhelming if you are new to rifle cast reloading. "The destination is just the end of an interesting journey. Anon"

[ValorsMinion]

Thanks for the suggestions everyone.

4895 with 26 grains was the winner by far. It made a 5 shot group just under one inch at 50 yards. I was pretty happy with that and surprised as it was night and day to all the other loads I tried. The other powders were all at least twice as large.

71047

I didn't use any filler with any of the powders as I was worried about pressure. None of the loads I made had any pressure signs at all though.

The 2400 did ok at the lower levels. 19gr seemed to be the best with about 2" groups at 50 yards and opened up above that. H335 shot about 3" at 30gr and above that opened up. At 34 grains it started keyholing and then above that didn't even keep most shots on paper. It also leaded the bore. I guess I should have stopped shooting them...

I loaded the boolits to 2.706" which put them just into the rifling and the gas check in the neck. I used fire formed neck sized brass and flared them with a 30 cal M die. I had to use a light crimp with the Lee FCD to take the flare out and to keep a few of them from moving around. I pulled a couple boolits to make sure it was not reducing the bullet size.

The boolits weigh right at 180 grains with lube and gas check. I actually have a .311 lee sizer but my boolits were not perfectly round and came out oblong. They are .309 by .311 so I sized them to .309. Is this possibly an issue with the die, the alloy, water dropping, and/or my technique? I have a lee c309-200-r on the way so I will have another mould to play with. Maybe it will let me size larger.

I think I am gonna try to get some tin and cast up some more boolits then air cool them. Then I'm gonna load up a couple ladders, one with filler and one without, using 4895 with smaller steps.

Again, thanks for the suggestions. I'm encouraged by my initial results and I'm looking forward to more rifle boolit makin.

[Larry Gibson]

Love it when the plan starts coming together.........

The out of round is most probably from the lack of tin in the WWs. Adding tin and casting with the alloy at 725 +/- should improve the quality of the bullets.

Larry Gibson

[rintinglen]

Love it when the plan starts coming together.........

The out of round is most probably from the lack of tin in the WWs. Adding tin and casting with the alloy at 725 +/- should improve the quality of the bullets.Larry Gibson


Words of wisdom that can not be too often repeated. Especially with wheelweights, a little bit 'O tin and a bit of heat can go a long ways towards improving fill out. Too many times, in our effort to avoid "burning out the tin", we run our temps too low. If you don't have a PID controller, trying to run your pot at "50 degrees over liquidus" means that half the time you will be >50 degrees, half the time < 50 degrees, and almost never at 50 +.

[Doc Highwall]

That is why I like my bullets with a little frosting, good mould fill out.