question re hunting with 45/70 350GC boolits

[roberto mervicini]

Hi,
I am one older hunter but new to casting....
Two years a go I put together a 45/70 rifle from a Siamese Mauser platform. I ordered a NOA mold 350gr. gas check, melted some wheel weights
and start casting nice boolits, water cool, cooper GC, lube and resize.
Reload using RP case and IMR 3031 powder, nice results, at 50 yds one inch group, average speed 2230 fps.
My questions is: could I hunt with this cartridge, (moose and black bear ) or the boolit is to hard to mushroom properly?

Also I got a second NOA mold similar boolit configuration, in 9.3 cal. 280gr. also GC for my 9.3x62 mauser rifle, also made some boolits using weel weights water cool and gas check, didn't try this yet but probably will exit the barrel also around 2200 fps ! Same question: ok to hunt with or to hard?

Thanks for your input
roberto

[btroj]

Who cares if it mushrooms? At that kind of velocity that bullet will put a serious hurt on anything it hits. Cast it hard enough to give good accuracy but still soft enou to not be frantible on bone. Something like 50/50 WW/lead water dropped would be good.

[NSB]

A 45-70 doesn't have to mushroom. Most bullets fired out of this caliber don't mushroom. I've shot a fair number of deer with different 45 cal guns, including the 45-70, and most of them dropped in their tracks. It's a pretty big hole without mushrooming and I've never recovered a bullet. Millions of buffalo were killed with this caliber and mushrooming wasn't an issue. Most buffalo shot were complete pass throughs.

[olaf455]

A 30cal boolit might expand, but a 45cal boolit most assuredly will not shrink...lol...

[roberto mervicini]

Tanks for the reply, here the picture of the boolit .

[NVScouter]

Have you tried the load from air cooled WW instead of water cooled? It should soften it up a bit.

[44man]

I do not have any idea how 2200 fps would work with a hard boolit.
I use a similar boolit from my 45-70 revolver at 1630 fps and it zips through deer with little internal damage.
I went to Babore's hollow point from oven hardened 50-50 and blew a deer to pieces.
It is not true that just being a big boolit is all you need.
My .500 JRH, 440 gr hard boolit is also a hole punch. No blood trails with deer running as far as 120 yards.
However, I don't know what more velocity will do.
Overlooking CNS hits, I would like to know.
I have bit my lip and been amazed many times over what a big boolit can and cannot do.

[Larry Gibson]

I've had a 45-70 built on a Siamese Mauser since '73. Shot a lot of different cast bullets through it and killed numerous deer and elk with it. A few were on license but most were putting down injured animals as a LO. I also put down several dommestic animals with it including cattle.

Your WQ'd WW bullets may or may not break up when heavy bone is hit. WWs are generally high on antimony content and low on tin. Thus the antimony is not in solution with the lead as weel as it should be. Simply add 2% tin to the COWWs and cast, load as usual. The tin combines with the antimony and makes it go into solution with the lead for a better and more malleable alloy. That alloy also holds together and penetrates amazingly well.....from one end of an elk out the other on several occasions. I've pushed WQ'd 457483s to 2300 fps and Lee's C457-500-FN to 2050 fps out of my 450-400-70 (please allow me my hallucinations....) but I have throated mine long for max case capacity. I've also pushed AC'd 457483's to 200 fps with very good accuracy and excellent terminal ballistics.

Larry Gibson

70526705257052470523

[45-70 Chevroner]

Wheel weight alloy even water dropped will expand on impact and even if it didn't you will have no problem with the size of the game you mentioned. A moose is a really big animal but he is not made of steel. Considering the fire arms you mentioned I would go with the 45-70. One more thing, I know for a fact the a 30 caliber WW boolit will expand, so why wouldn't a 45-70 WW boolit expand.

[Tatume]

I've used a similar bullet at 2500 fps for years. It drops deer in their tracks, and does almost no damage to edible meat. It's a little hard on the hunter though. :-)

Take care, Tom

[roberto mervicini]

.........Your WQ'd WW bullets may or may not break up when heavy bone is hit. WWs are generally high on antimony content and low on tin. Thus the antimony is not in solution with the lead as weel as it should be. Simply add 2% tin to the COWWs and cast, load as usual. The tin combines with the antimony and makes it go into solution with the lead for a better and more malleable alloy.............
Larry Gibson

70526705257052470523

Hi Larry,
Where you normally buy Tin???
When I will find it I need to add to the pot of the wheel weights 2% of is weight in tin and that is it.??
Should I air cool or water cool the boolits ??
Thanks
roberto

[44man]

Good to hear.
My revolver velocity is limited, can't go as fast as a rifle so I have no idea what WW's will do.
Nice rifle Larry.