Fewer Hunters

[jim4065]

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20070902/ap_on_re_us/fewer_hunters;_ylt=Ao5DTiKSp0uE_gNRC5SpEVhH2ocA

This is about the decline of a sport which I think is essential to our future. It's a shame to see this happening, but maybe now we will get some recognition of the fact that it's hunters who pay for wildlife - not PETA or Birdwatchers. I have no complaints with Birdwatchers, etc, but it's nice to begin seeing an acknowledgement of the role that hunters play in maintaining wildlife populations for everyone.

[Onlymenotu]

Umm yea on this note * in Illinois* its always bugged me/ticked me off....... that ALL funds * including all fishing& hunting and deer and turkey tags ect ect* go to the General Fund,,,,,,, then they appropriating money to the conservation department,,,* you * most of the time* only get a small fraction of the acctual money that was raised,,,,, and they spent the rest of it else where

[Bret4207]

Umm yea on this note * in Illinois* its always bugged me/ticked me off....... that ALL funds * including all fishing& hunting and deer and turkey tags ect ect* go to the General Fund,,,,,,, then they appropriating money to the conservation department,,,* you * most of the time* only get a small fraction of the acctual money that was raised,,,,, and they spent the rest of it else where

More to the point- WHY do my school taxes go up year after year when LOTTO was supposed to have paid for it all? Term limits and spending restraint are whats needed.

[44man]

We will continue to lose hunters and the pace will increase faster each year. The reason can be seen wherever you live. More and more people moving away from cities combined with the high birth rate and more from other countries. Every single piece of open land will soon be gone, farms and orchards are melting into macmansions so fast that each week you can see the change.
Finding a place to hunt is just getting too hard. In a lot of states it costs big bucks to hunt ranches. Any public hunting land is swarming with hunters and that only drives the game away until the hunters leave because here in the east, the lands are pretty small. It is discouraging to see an orange coat behind every tree.
Then you have to look at the cost of equipment today. We are getting priced out of the shooting sports, let alone a young person that has a crummy, low paying job. Most also have to drive a long way to hunt and the crowded roads, price of gas, all take a toll.

[Onlymenotu]

More to the point- WHY do my school taxes go up year after year when LOTTO was supposed to have paid for it all? Term limits and spending restraint are whats needed.

He He @ Bret it was just a scam- joke to get the Lotto thing going,,, just like the Casino's..... they claim the lotto money goes to the schools......but they cut-pull the appropriating money *that the so called lotto wasn't funding* is was funding the schools before.... catch 22 back in the hole again... And Like you bret personaly I'm tired of this joke


@44man

this comes straight from the Illinois 2007-2008 hunting rulz


Hunting near Inhabited Dwellings
It is unlawful to hunt or allow a dog to
hunt within 300 yards of an inhabited
dwelling without first obtaining permission
of the owner or tenant of the dwelling.
EXCEPT: While trapping, hunting with bow
and arrow, or hunting with shotgun using
shotshells only, or on licensed game
breeding and hunting preserve areas, on
federally-owned and -managed lands, on
Department- owned, -managed, -leased
or -controlled lands and areas operated
under a Waterfowl Hunting Area permit, a
100-yard restriction shall apply.




And I was at a hunter saftey coarse last year with my daughter..... and the conservation officer made it plan,,,,, you can acctualy own the ground but /and have to ask your neighbor to hunt your own ground,,,,,,, witch is the biggest crock of bs there ever is/was... I have a fair ammount of ground around me that i can hunt * my dad's place.... and have right next door to him the last 17 years and the farm- ruff ground has been bought up and subdivided,,,, right up to us..... and i should have to ask the guy that just bought the house next door * who may or may not have lived there a month* to hunt my own ground.... it's fn@ked up....[smilie=b:

[44man]

I know just what you are saying. It always reminds of my friend that moved to VA 22 years ago. The first year he stopped at over 200 farms to see if he could hunt. He was even threatened to get off of some of their porches, was cussed at and everything in between. Even the farm behind his house was off limits and he was threatened with a court injunction if he was seen on it. He is very pleasant and never gets angry. My take is to stay away from VA. But you should hear the compaints about deer damage that they want the state to do something about or pay for. Another tax payer rip off from the rich horse people.
The horse people put up horse jumps on private fences without permission and ride across private property chasing foxes they release. Killing a fox in some VA countys is against the law. They are mangy and there is no small game left.

[KYCaster]

I notice that this article has a pretty good plug for the American Hunters and Shooters Association. With every positive mention they get, they gain some credibility with the people who will eventually decide the fate of our hunting and shooting "privledges".

If you're not familiar with these people, go to their website and see what our "friends" are trying to do to our "rights". They're backed by some of the most influential anti-gunners in the country and with every article like this one, they gain some support.

Jerry

[Scrounger]

I don't know about lotteries elsewhere but in California the money definitely got to the schools. They immediately gave everyone a raise, hired another bunch of administrators, and were back begging the next day. So-called "Free education" should be ended and we should adopt the voucher system. There is a voucher for each child's share of the tax money collected for education, and the parent decides which free enterprise school his child goes to. The bloated, inefficient school system as we know it, is kaput.

[9.3X62AL]

Coming from the line element of policing public industry--and having a wife still working in public education as a classroom teacher--I believe the largest problem facing both entities is the top-heavy administrative side required to gather funds to make both efforts run.

It might surprise you to know.......that not dime of property tax funding was used to support the agency I once worked for. 65% of property tax revenues DID go directly to welfare dole, however.

In both venues, a relatively small portion of the monies gathered actually goes to the salaries and physical plants required to operate the enterprises. THAT is the defect we need to correct.

[eka]

44Man, you about have it nailed as to the state of affairs in my area too.

[Harpman]

I aint asking nobody nuttin !.if its mine I do as I please, I'm getting real tired of this law for this law for that cant do this cant do that,...well, this is my world not theirs !:Fire: :Fire: :Fire: :Fire: :Fire: :Fire:

[buck1]

I notice that this article has a pretty good plug for the American Hunters and Shooters Association. With every positive mention they get, they gain some credibility with the people who will eventually decide the fate of our hunting and shooting "privledges".

If you're not familiar with these people, go to their website and see what our "friends" are trying to do to our "rights". They're backed by some of the most influential anti-gunners in the country and with every article like this one, they gain some support.

Jerry
United we stand /divided we play golf. The second amendment is not the right to hunt. Take away the guns and huntings gone too and the antigunners wont mind a bit.
I'll stick with the NRA. American Hunters and Shooters Association are just a step closer to the antigunners goal than the NRA, (path of least resistance). Antigunners have a opsite end goal than I do. So I dont support anyone/thing that has anything to do with them or whatever makes them happy ,whenever I can avoid it anyway.
This is bordering on political so I will end it there. Just my .02 ........Buck

[Marc2]

44 Man said it best. The cost is almost prohibative. In my area you have to lease or be left out. And the leases can run anywhere from $300 to $2000 per year, per hunter. That pretty much rules out alot of guys. Also the liability issues involved with allowing hunters on private land has taken its toll. Hunters with a good set up guard it with their life (I was in a club that would "under no circumstances" allow my two sons to hunt with me). You also really have to be careful with the private clubs. Alot of them are made up guys that hunt 3-4 weeks a year and are looking for someone to share the expense but have very strict size standards and allow only trophy bucks to be harvested, so unless you have alot of time to hunt you'll likely turn up empty and end up funding their good time (I was in another club and was put on probation for shooting an undersized buck) No I;m not kidding.
I know guys that have given it up because of the hoops you have to jump through. Only the hard core are left. Doesnt look good for the future. Enjoy it while you can.
Wow, I've made myself depressed. Wheres my tennis racket?

Marc

[Freightman]

In this part of the country the Dallas FW lawers/Doctors are buying up all the land putting 10' fences around them and they have a private canned hunt. There are some Amarillo Doctors/Lawers doing the same.
There was a ranch around Turkey that sold to a group of dr/lawers 81,000 acres, another 50,000 acres in Donley county and the total goes on. Where you going to hunt? in your back yard, better have some understanding neighbors. I still am not going to get rid of one gun even if all I do with them is get them out and clean them once a month.
When I get all my brass loaded I will be out of lead and be like Silas Marner sit and count the ammo I have.
Who has to hunt! I might do it with my camera if I have no place to shoot the game. They ain't gona beat me and I am not going to make my self un-happy because of them.

[44man]

Isn't it disgusting how the rich don't know what hunting really is? Just to brag about killing a huge animal in a fenced area where the animals are fed and bred for huge racks and they tell you which one to harvest makes me sick.
It is amazing that just as this post appeared, the news said the game departments were concerned with the loss of money from less hunters. They listed the same reasons I did.
Watch the hunting shows and see how many places are free for you and me to hunt. Look at the ones called fair chase, private property that none of us can afford to go near. Here is what the news said;

New figures from the U.S. Fish and Wildlife Service show that the number of hunters 16 and older declined by 10 percent between 1996 and 2006 - from 14 million to about 12.5 million. The drop was most acute in New England, the Rocky Mountains, and the Pacific states, which lost 400,000 hunters in that span.

The primary reasons, experts say, are the loss of hunting land to urbanization plus a perception by many families that they can't afford the time or costs that hunting entails.

"To recruit new hunters, it takes hunting families," said Gregg Patterson of Ducks Unlimited. "I was introduced to it by my father, he was introduced to it by his father. When you have boys and girls without a hunter in the household, it's tough to give them the experience."

Some animal-welfare activists welcome the trend, noting that it coincides with a 13 percent increase in wildlife watching since 1996. But hunters and state wildlife agencies, as they prepare for the fall hunting season, say the drop is worrisome.

"It's hunters who are the most willing to give their own dollar for wildlife conservation," Patterson said.

Compounding the problem, the number of Americans who fish also has dropped sharply - down 15 percent, from 35.2 million in 1996 to 30 million in 2006, according to the latest version of a national survey that the Fish and Wildlife Service conducts every five years.

Of the 50 state wildlife agencies, most rely on hunting and fishing license fees for the bulk of their revenue, and only a handful receive significant infusions from their state's general fund.

"They're trying to take care of all wildlife and all habitats on a shoestring budget," said Rachel Brittin of the Washington-based Association of Fish and Wildlife Agencies.

In New Hampshire, only multiple fee increases - which produced numerous complaints - have enabled the Fish and Game Department to keep revenues robust. Its ranks of registered hunters has dropped from 83,292 in 1996 to 61,076 last year, according to department spokeswoman Judy Stokes.

"We hear concerns about land access," Stokes said. "People grew up hunting - you went out with your family, your uncle. And now you go back, and there's a shopping plaza or a housing development. Some of your favorite places just aren't available anymore."

National hunting expert Mark Damian Duda, executive director of Virginia-based research firm Responsive Management, says America's increasingly urban and suburban culture makes it less friendly toward the pastime.

"You don't just get up and go hunting one day - your father or father-type figure has to have hunted," Duda said. "In a rural environment, where your friends and family hunt, you feel comfortable with guns, you feel comfortable with killing an animal."

Indeed, hunting remains vibrant in many rural states - 19 percent of residents 16 and older hunted last year in Montana and 17 percent in North Dakota, compared with 1 percent in California, Connecticut, Massachusetts and New Jersey. Nationally, 5 percent of the 16-and-over population hunted in 2006, down from 7 percent in 1996.

As their ranks dwindle, hunters are far from unified. The often big-spending, wide-traveling trophy hunters of Safari Club International, for example, have different priorities from duck hunters frequenting close-to-home wetlands.

One rift involves hunters disenchanted with the National Rifle Association, which runs major hunting programs and lobbies vigorously against gun control. A Maryland hunter, Ray Schoenke, has formed a new group, the American Hunters and Shooters Association, primarily as a home for hunters who would support some restrictions on gun and ammunition sales.

"The NRA's extreme positions have hurt the hunting movement," Schoenke said. "Soccer moms now believe hunters have made things more dangerous."

Political support for hunting remains strong, though, with several states recently enshrining the right to hunt and fish in their constitutions.

Last month, President Bush (javascript:;) ordered all federal agencies that manage public lands to look for more room for hunting. In the 2004 presidential campaign, both Bush and Democratic rival John Kerry (javascript:;) courted hunters' and gun owners' votes. A camouflage-jacketed Kerry even toted a shotgun during a goose hunt.

Among the 2008 candidates, Democrat (javascript:;) Bill Richardson aired a TV ad showing him hunting, while Republican (javascript:;) Mitt Romney (javascript:;) was derided for calling himself a lifelong hunter even though he never had state hunting licenses.

Public support for hunting also is high, in part because huge deer populations have become a nuisance in many areas. Duda's surveys indicate less than 25 percent of Americans oppose hunting, although groups such as People for the Ethical Treatment of Animals denounce it as cruel.

Most major animal-welfare and conservation groups don't campaign to end hunting, but some lobby against specific practices such as bear hunting or "canned" hunts in which game is confined in fenced areas and shot by hunters who pay large sums for the opportunity.

"As a matter of principle, we should not condone the killing of any animal in the interest of sport," said Andrew Page of the Humane Society of the United States. "But as a matter of pragmatism, we target those practices that even hunters would agree are egregious."

The Humane Society welcomed the new federal data showing a surging number of birdwatchers, wildlife photographers and other wildlife watchers. They increased from 62.8 million in 1996 to 71.1 million in 2006, spending $45 billion on their activities compared to $75 billion spent by hunters and anglers.

"The American attitude regarding wildlife is changing," Page said. "I suspect the day will come when a presidential candidate goes to a local humane society to adopt a homeless animal, rather than go the field and pose as hunter with a gun."

However, hunting groups and state wildlife agencies are striving to reverse the decline by recruiting new hunters. Vermont's Game and Wildlife Department, for example, sponsors thrice-annual youth hunting weekends, offers low-cost youth licenses and teaches firearms safety and outdoor skills each summer at youth conservation camps.

Another initiative is Families Afield, sponsored by three national hunting groups; it aims to ease state restrictions on youth hunting. At least 12 states have obliged, enabling thousands of youths to sample hunting before taking required hunter education courses.

Other programs seek to attract more women, though few promote racial diversity. More than 90 percent of U.S. hunters are male; roughly 96 percent are white.

Rob Sexton, a vice president of the U.S. Sportsmen's Alliance, said one upside of the shrinking numbers is that hunting groups are more motivated to seek remedies, such as access to more land and less burdensome regulations.

"There are still a lot of us," he said. "Hunting is a great passion for our people."

[Freightman]

" Different agenda" we had better get on the same page and stick together Black rifle shooters to 410 SG shooters "stick together or hang separatly"

[TAWILDCATT]

Ray Schoenke and(John Rosenthall)started american hunters--Rosenthal is head/was/ head of HANDGUN CONTROL IN BOSTON AT #6 **** ST.[DAMN MEMORY].THEY ARE "TROLLS AND ANY ONE JOINING THEM ARE STUPID.
I'm from Mass and I have seen him on tv.and his wife.
no wonder we lose.
----:coffee: -----:Fire: ------:Fire: -----:coffee:

[44man]

I was disgusted to read some of it. Back door gun control. I will stay with the NRA!

[Old Ironsights]

Access access access. When Hunting completely goes back to being the "Sport of Kings" it's time to lop off a few "Royal Heads" and start over.