Neighbor with a new ML

[koehlerrk]

My next door neighbor and hunting buddy just got his first front-stuffer. It's a CVA 50 cal inline, not sure exactly which model, but it has 1:28 twist.

So, my neighbor has been asking me what he should use. He wants to use pellets because they're simple and easy, but he about chocked on the cost of saboted bullets and powerbelts. Sooo, he asked me what would make a good cast boolit for this. Right now it's down to either the Lee REAL or the modern minie. Now, I've heard some talk about how the modern minie doesn't do as well due to the skirt getting blown by higher pressures. So should he get the REAL instead?

Anyone have a definite answer for me, one way or the other?

Much appreciated.

Rick

[Nobade]

Tell him to read the stickys here regarding paper patching for muzzle loaders. Idahoron's favorite Lee 440gr. sized down and patched shoots awesome out of every 50 cal. fast twist rifle I have tried it in.

I also have very good luck with the RCBS 500 S&W boolit if he wants a grease groove design, but then you have to carry them in the field without getting dirt into the lube. (same problem as minies and REAL designs as well.)

BTW, if the rifling doesn't go all the way to the muzzle it may not shoot too well with anything but sabots unless it is cut and crowned.

[newton]

If he is just going to shoot 50 yards or so anything will work good. I've got a 50 cal CVA inline with that twist. It shoots REAL's nice at 50 yards.

I second Nobade. If he is wanting to get the best accuracy he is going to have to go customized or you could cast him .44/.45 boolits and have him buy just the plastic sabot online. You can get 50 sabots for under 10 bucks.

[Underclocked]

Tell him to check pricing on bulk (metallic reloading - pistol bullets) bullets at Graf & Sons. They also have good prices for Harvester sabots. It's one heckuva lot cheaper to buy bullets by the 100 and sabots in the 50 count packages. Just make sure he properly matches sabot and bullet. The LEE R.E.A.L. isn't a bad bullet but there are much better choices. See also http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?181857-Need-some-help-and-suggestions-casting-for-in-line .

[koehlerrk]

Thanks folks, that gives me some direction to point him in.

A little background, he's a good guy, but had ZERO guns around him growing up. He's 30 now, and making up for lost time.

I've got lots more experience with rifles shooting j-words, but in the last couple years I'm starting to understand the "mystery" of using good old lead bullets. My only experience with MLs is old stuff shooting patched round balls, and I haven't done that in about 15 years. All this new stuff with in-lines, fast-twists, and sabots is new to me too, but I figured someone here would be able to give me some good advice.

Thanks guys, and hopefully I'll have some good news to report once we can get to the range.

[GREENCOUNTYPETE]

most fast twists do shoot patched round ball well to at least 50 yards , it isn't a bad place to start , but if he wants to use pellets cause their easy , has he been told what he has to do to clean the muzzle loader yet , ML are not hard but a lot more work than the average J-bullet shooter is up for.

powder isn't hard , and doesn't come with quite the sticker shock of pellets subs

[Sergeant Earthworm]

all good answers, just want to add a couple things.

The .50 caliber 320 grain REAL comes highly recommended by a lot of folks but doesn't shoot worth a darn in my 1:48 TC Hawken. Why? Who knows. Yesterday with the same gun I put three 370 grain Maxi-balls into about an inch at 50 yards off the bench.

My point? I suggest your friend should spend as much time at the range as possible to find out which powder/projectile combination works in his rifle.

A thought about sabots. My dad uses a cast .452 caliber 255 grain semi-wadcutter with a sabot in his Knight inline. Very accurate, and more than enough for a deer size critter. The sabots themselves are cheap, doesn't really matter what you put in the sabot as long as it works. Obviously you have to have the correct size sabot for the projectile.

I would also suggest using powder rather than pellets. Powder offers more possibilities for adjusting the load, and most of the time more is not necessarily better.

[koehlerrk]

Well, I'm now looking at a front-stuffer myself. It's been... a long time since I've used one, like back shooting with my dad as a teenager before I went to college, got a job, got married, had kids, etc...

My local shop has a TC New Englander that has caught my eye. 50 cal 1:48 twist, double set triggers, very similar to my dads' rig from so many summers ago. I was thinking about ordering the Lee combo mold so I'd have 490 balls and 320 REAL bullets. Add in the Modern Minie and it gives me a decent set of boolits to work with.

Anywho, since I live in the NY Finger Lakes, well, Ye Holy Black is just about impossible to get here. So a couple more questions:

What subs work reliably in a sidelock?
Will Blackhorn 209 ignite in a sidelock?
If I get the Mag Spark kit to replace the nipple and use a 209 primer will it work?

I'm asking all this because I really don't want an inline.

Thanks again,

Rick

[Sergeant Earthworm]

Anywho, since I live in the NY Finger Lakes, well, Ye Holy Black is just about impossible to get here. So a couple more questions:


Rick, you might try finding out if there are any French and Indian, Revolutionary, or Civil War reenactors nearby, they might be able to tell you where you can get BP. I know for certain there are some in the Schenectady/Albany area and pretty sure there are some in the Geneva area too. Reenactors use BP almost exclusively.

[7of7]

Anywho, since I live in the NY Finger Lakes, well, Ye Holy Black is just about impossible to get here. So a couple more questions:



Rick,
For holy black... you can try http://www.powderinc.com/catalog/order.htm I am in Washington State, and it took 7 days for my order to get to me.
They also have caps which they will ship together with the powder. The really nice aspect, is that the powder price you see, is the delivered price. The only drawback, is one must order 5, 10, 25, or 50 lbs at a time.

[koehlerrk]

Sergent Earthworm, I will do some digging and see what I can find in Geneva... that's about 45 minutes away from home, but it'c closer than the one place I've found so far that does carry BP... that one is over an hour and a half each way. Sometimes living in the middle of nowhere sucks... Thanks for the tip!

7of7, thank you for that link, if nothing else works out, I'll be making an order. My guess is 5 pounds will do me for a couple years, but that just means I won't have to worry about it for a while.

That said, I've only ever used Goex, but I've heard a lot of good things about Swiss BP. If I can't find a distributor locally and wind up ordering, I may very well get some Swiss. Will Powder inc split an order of say 3lbs Goex and 2lbs Swiss? Or should I just get 5 lbs of swiss and be happy?

[Nobade]

They will split the order, but you might want to look at his KIK powder. Much better than Goex, 95% as nice as Swiss, and cheaper than either.

He also has Diamondback - it works, but isn't nearly as fast as the others. Great for cowboy shooting and plinking though.

[koehlerrk]

OK, looks like I'm looking to get a 10 lb order of Swiss. Sorry Nobade, but cost is less of an issue for me than overall performance, and Swiss BP has always been the standard others are judged against. So, what size should I get for a 50 cal? I hear Swiss burns hotter than Goex, so should I go to 1.5F, or stick with FF?