First Post/Newb questions on casting

[dccd]

Been lurking for awhile and have been interested in learning more about casting. However, it appears that I have assumed some things that are not exactly correct. I'm hoping you guys can point me in the right direction.

Keep in mind that I have not cast any boolits yet. I just purchased some lead last week and ordered my Lee melter, which has not delivered yet. My main intention is to cast for my 9mm handgun and .223 only, and then for target practice only.

My question is about casting for .223. It sounds like there is a problem with firing cast boolits at velocities over 1500fps or so. I've read that casting for my 9mm won't be a problem because of its relatively low velocity, but casting for an AR15 is a problem with WW lead.

Can you guys help with:


Verify that no special steps are needed to cast for handgun loads in 9mm.
Verify that firing cast boolits at rates higher than 1500fps or so can cause the boolit to "disentegrate" in the barrel (Probably not actuall "disinegrate", but you know what I mean).
Will copper plating help with .223
Should I copper plate my 9mm?
If I do experience leading, I assume it's easy to identify. What's the best way to remove it.
What velocity is recommended to limit leading in handguns?


I'm assuming that my questions are sensible and probably why it appears that 9mm molds are easy to find, while .223 molds are being more of a challenge.

Sorry for the newb questions, but everyone has to learn sometime. Thanks for any help.

[Wolfer]

I don't cast for 9mm or 223 so I shouldn't be posting here. I do cast a lot of other stuff though.
I don't think you need to do anything special for 9mm and WW except maybe add 2% tin. No more! The easiest place for me to get tin is lead free solder.
223 may need to be quenched if you want to shoot much above 2000 ? Fps. It will also need a gas check.
I don't think the problems with 223 comes from shooting them but it's a little harder to cast those small boolits when your first starting out.
You don't say what your gun is. An AR type may have operating issues.
Cast boolits can far exceed 1500 fps, very far!

[Larry Gibson]

dccd

Been lurking for awhile and have been interested in learning more about casting. However, it appears that I have assumed some things that are not exactly correct. I'm hoping you guys can point me in the right direction.

The 1st direction I'm going to point you is to study a bit more and get some reference material. I know "going paperless" is "the thing" these days but there is nothing like a good cast bullet reloading manual as a best source to answer many of your questions and provide loading data and other information. The best manual and an excellent primer to learn casting bullets is the Lyman #3 Cast bullet Handbook. It is out of print but can be found at used book stores and probably Amazon. Lyman's #4 Cast Bullet Handbook is still available at most all gun and bookstores. It is pretty good but not quite as good information upfront for the beginner. Best you learn the basics as we all did. There is no quick internet fix to casting good bullets, loading them properly or shooting them, especially in a cartridge such as the .223 which can and does have some eccentricies to it.

Keep in mind that I have not cast any boolits yet. I just purchased some lead last week and ordered my Lee melter, which has not delivered yet. My main intention is to cast for my 9mm handgun and .223 only, and then for target practice only.

Exactly why you shold get one or both of the Lyman manuals and study up. You can learn the hard way but it is the hard way; takes time and is frustrating and many quit because of the frustration.

My question is about casting for .223. It sounds like there is a problem with firing cast boolits at velocities over 1500fps or so. I've read that casting for my 9mm won't be a problem because of its relatively low velocity, but casting for an AR15 is a problem with WW lead.

The problem with the .223 is mostly with the various twist rates of the barrels. The faster the twist the harder to get accuracy and reliable functioning. Design of the cast bullet also plays a part as does powder selection, especially for a gas gun.

Add 2% tin to your COWWs as already mentioned (remove the softer stick on WWs from the batch) for better cast bullets with a harder alloy. Allow them to harden for 7-10 days before use.
Can you guys help with:


Verify that no special steps are needed to cast for handgun loads in 9mm.

Cast a 115 - 125 gr bullet intended for the 9mm. Size at .357 or .358 and lube with a quality softer lube such as a NRA 50/50 formula. Load over a starting load of 3 gr Bulls eye and work up (the Lyman manual will tell you how to "work up") to 4 gr of Bullseye to start with. Once success is had and you have some knowledge and experience you can experiment with othe powders or loads if you want.

Verify that firing cast boolits at rates higher than 1500fps or so can cause the boolit to "disentegrate" in the barrel (Probably not actuall "disinegrate", but you know what I mean).

Cast bullets can be driven to reletively high velocity (2500+ fps) before accuracy gets so bad it's hard to keep them on target and they do not "disintegrate " in the barrel or in flight. In faster twists the bllets can disintegrate due to excessive RPM above 2900 fps or so depending on alloy.

Will copper plating help with .223
Should I copper plate my 9mm?

No real need to copper plate either.

If I do experience leading, I assume it's easy to identify. What's the best way to remove it.

It's easy to identify and there are numerous methods to remove it depending on how bad the leading is.

What velocity is recommended to limit leading in handguns?

Cast bullets can easily be driven to the maxmum safe velocity for the bullet weight in the 9mm if properly cast, sized, lubed and loaded.


I'm assuming that my questions are sensible and probably why it appears that 9mm molds are easy to find, while .223 molds are being more of a challenge.

What kind of 223 rifle are you talking about? What is the twist rate of the barrel?

Sorry for the newb questions, but everyone has to learn sometime. Thanks for any help.

No problem on the newb questions. you can get lots of good information here but it's best you learn the basics via the Lyman manuals as then the answers to your questions will make a lot more sense that way. It will be less frustrating to you and to us who answer.

Larry Gibson

[mdi]

Oh darn, Mr. Gibson beat me to it...[smilie=1:

[cbrick]

dccd, welcome to CastBoolits.

Larry is 110% correct, while there is a huge amount of info on this forum it is certainly best to gain a sound understanding of the basics before jumping in with both feet.

Here is another great source of valuable info on casting and it's free. I highly recommend down loading the pdf version of this book and printing it out. This is a book that as you get more and more into casting you'll refer to it often.

From Ingot To Target by Glen E. Fryxell (http://www.lasc.us/Fryxell_Book_textonly2.pdf)

Rick

[waksupi]

I was shooting my .223 at 2680 fps, getting groups of around 1 5/8" at 100 yards. No leading at all. Fit, barrel condition, lube, and proper alloy hardness are the things you need to learn.
Welcome aboard.

[runfiverun]

you might as well throw in the 40 too.
then you'd have all three of the most problematic rounds there is to cast for.

you are gonna have to read more, pick a cartridge,and work with it one step at a time.
the first step is to learn how to cast.

[turmech]

use the link in post #5.

IMO best place to start. It is free and once you read it you will answer most of your inital question.