Heavy Cast Boolits for 38 Super ?

[Hardcast]

A few months ago there was an article by John Taffin in the American Handgunner about loading for 38 Super. In that article he said he had good results using 158 grain 38/357 cast bullets. Does anyone on the forum use heavy cast bullets (AKA boolits) in 38 Super?

[fredj338]

I don't see why not, you can work up a load for anything. One of the guys that shoots IDPA w/ me uses a 158gr in his 9mm, so should be easy in the longer 38super.

[mstarling]

Have used 140, 150 and 160 gr cast boolits in 1911 based single or double column Supers fitted w Nowlin and Clark barrels. My guns require a max OAL of 1.260" The 140s and 160s are RNs.

[noylj]

It works better than trying to cram such a long and heavy bullet in 9x19.
I still find that 121-125gn bullets are the most accurate, but some 158gn .38 L-SWCs certainly perform just fine in my .38 Supers and 147gn XTPs can be real tack-drivers if you find the right load.

[MtGun44]

I loaded 147 to 160 gr boolits in my .38 Super at about 1200 fps for years. Absolute max
load, but brass lasted forever - unless it was WW of any type, which would blow or bulge
severely when Midway, Starline or Rem would be just fine for 25 reloads.

Bill

[Kraschenbirn]

I don't, at this time, own a .38 Super but, when I did, I obtained good accuracy with 147 gr TCs loaded just 'warm' enough make IPSC 'Major'. Recently, though, I cast some Lee 358-150 RNs (148 gr from 50/50 WW/range scrap) for a buddy to try in his 9x23 and they must've worked okay for 'cause he called last night and asked if I could run him up another 500 or so.

Bill

[Hardcast]

Recently I bought one those Talo Colt lightweight 38 Super Commanders. My idea was to shoot cast 158 gr semi-wadcutters at 1150 to 1200 fps , which is close to .357 mag velocities with an equal length barrel. And, this is a flat, easy carrying lightweight gun that holds 10 or 11 rounds. So far, I have had the chamber throat reamed out so it will chamber more than round nose ammo. But, even after that, to chamber 140 gr XTPs(.357"), I have to deep seat them to not much over 9mm overall length. I also bought a couple boxes of 147 gr XTPs, but they are .355" diameter and my barrel slugs at .356", so I don't expect much from them. Have fired a few, not for accuracy or chronographed them either. Most loading manuals show AA9 as the best powder to get the velocity I want, but with the heavy boolits, the powder has to be compressed, and I mean a lot. I am looking for a better power. Hodgdon Lil'gun looks like a good possibility, but I don't have any of that to try. I also need to resize my .358 semi-wadcutters to .356 to see if they will work. There is much work to do to find good loads that will feed well and shoot good too. I was looking for others experiences in developing loads for their guns. Thanks for the replies, and I welcome any additional comments.

[2 dogs]

I loaded 160 grain bullets and shot many thousands of them out my 38 supers back in the day. We used WW 540 powder at the time but HS-6 in the equivelent.

[leftiye]

Anybody loaded the Lyman 358311?

[MtGun44]

I have loaded a few commercial equivalents of 311. No problems.\ THE powder if you
want max velocity safely is W571/HS7 - unfortunately no longer available.

Bill

[Hardcast]

I have loaded a few commercial equivalents of 311. No problems.\ THE powder if you
want max velocity safely is W571/HS7 - unfortunately no longer available.

Bill

I still have a full can of Winchester 571. Thanks.

[HangFireW8]

I also bought a couple boxes of 147 gr XTPs, but they are .355" diameter and my barrel slugs at .356", so I don't expect much from them. Have fired a few, not for accuracy or chronographed them either. Most loading manuals show AA9 as the best powder to get the velocity I want, but with the heavy boolits, the powder has to be compressed, and I mean a lot. I am looking for a better power. Hodgdon Lil'gun looks lie a good possibility, but I don't have any of that to try. I also need to resize my .358 semi-wadcutters to .356 to see if they will work. There is much work to do to find good loads that will feed well and shoot good too. I was looking for others experiences in developing loads for their guns. Thanks for the replies, and I welcome any additional comments.

I wouldn't give up on the 147gr XTP's until you've tried them, I've tried them in my Colt's 38 Super Commander and they are quite accurate. Jacketed bullets are often not as sensitive to being undersized.

Back in the day 38Super users used Vihtavuori N105 to make Major with 115's and 124's. Site handloads.com lists 1475fps with a 124gr. Once you factor in barrel length, this is real factory load 357 Mag duplication! I've played with it and its a real handful. The idea was to make a lot of gas to feed the compensator. I don't have a comp on mine, so I moved on.

Whatever you load, make sure you use your Shok-bufs.

HF

[geargnasher]

For what it's worth, I've had excellent results from the Lee .358-150-RN in .38 Super loaded warm with a worked-up charge of Power Pistol. The chamber wasn't throated for SWCs.

Gear

[MtGun44]

If you want to load hot loads in .38 Super with W571, the published max in one of
Hodgdon's little manuals years ago was 7.1 under a 150 gr or so, IIRC.

THIS LOAD IS ABSOLUTELY NOT SAFE IN WINCHESTER BRASS!

It is fine in Midway, Rem +P, Starline and PMC +P brass, in my gun. This would
chrono 1220-1230 fps reliably in my Wilson LE Comp gun, with unsupported
chamber.

Start low and work up. Unless you really need to run at absolute full throttle ( I
was making IPSC major under the old power factor numbers) I would stay down
around 6.8 or so.

Bill

[dangerranger]

Ive loaded both 147 and 158 gr into 9mm Largo brass for years. At close to 900fps they hit at poi in all three of my Spanish pistols. I load a little slower for the Astra 400 , but they all shoot well. DR

[Hardcast]

If you want to load hot loads in .38 Super with W571, the published max in one of
Hodgdon's little manuals years ago was 7.1 under a 150 gr or so, IIRC.

THIS LOAD IS ABSOLUTELY NOT SAFE IN WINCHESTER BRASS!

It is fine in Midway, Rem +P, Starline and PMC +P brass, in my gun. This would
chrono 1220-1230 fps reliably in my Wilson LE Comp gun, with unsupported
chamber.

Start low and work up. Unless you really need to run at absolute full throttle ( I
was making IPSC major under the old power factor numbers) I would stay down
around 6.8 or so.

Bill

Right now I'm using new Starline 38 Super Comp brass, which Starline states is the same internally as their 38 Super +P brass. Thanks everyone for the additional info. :)

[Hardcast]

I have loaded a few commercial equivalents of 311. No problems.\ THE powder if you
want max velocity safely is W571/HS7 - unfortunately no longer available.

Bill

Bill,

Can HS7 data be used for 571?

Thanks

[MtGun44]

They are the same powder. The only difference is lot to lot variation. Made
by St. Marks in Fla. Some was sold to Winchester, some was sold to Hodgdon.

HP38=W231
HS6=W540
HS7=W571
H110=W296

Bill

[Hardcast]

They are the same powder. The only difference is lot to lot variation. Made
by St. Marks in Fla. Some was sold to Winchester, some was sold to Hodgdon.

HP38=W231
HS6=W540
HS7=W571
H110=W296

Bill

Thanks Bill. I resized my .358s, which had grown to .359" over the years, to .356". They will now chamber at a reasonable OAL. I'm going to load some the 150 gr. RCBS and some of the NEI 170's with W571. The quest goes on......

[JIMinPHX]

I fooled with heavy slugs in a 9-large several years ago. The problem that I ran into was that my SB brass was tapered on the inside & the longer slug seated too far down inside the brass & caused a bulge in the OD of the loaded cartridge. I don't know if that is an issue with the .38 super or not. The two cartridges are almost dimensionally identical, but not quite.

[casterofboolits]

I used the Magma 38S-160-RNBB over Blue Dot to make major in IPSC in a standard Colt Barrel. No problems at all. I later switched to a Wilson designed SWC in Saeco moulds. It was supposed to be a 154 grain boolit, but dropped 158 grains with my alloy. Whats odd is the Saeco 38S-145-SWCBB and the 38S-145-RNBB drop exactly 144/145 with the same alloy!

The 158 grain SWC was my standard IPSC load for five years in a supported barrel. Never bulged or blew a case with BlueDot. You did not want to use this load in a non comped pistol tho!!!!

I had a casting business for twenty three years and when the Super was coming up, I sold over a 200,000 358311s to guys loading it in the Super.

Now I shoot/plink using the Saeco 38S-145-SWCBB with a reduced charge of BlueDot.

I had to quit IPSC due to "Uncle Arther" and never switched to the light jacketed boolits.