38 special crimp die

[grrifles]

I am getting a dillon 550. I want to use the lee die set I have but from what I have read it to seat and crimp in two different stations. So what is the best crimp die for the 38. I am loading lee 158 TL.


Thanks
Chris

[Lizard333]

Your lee set will work in the 550 fine if that's what you like. If seating and crimping in one step is working for you, don't change anything. Dillon uses for stations. The first is your resize, de prime and then reprime. Next is powder. Third is normally just a seat die, this where your lee seat/crimp die will be. The fourth station is where dillon crimps, this station will be empty. No big deal.

Enjoy your press. You won't be disappointed.

[grrifles]

Right now the way I load is I ajust die out and seat them then ajust die to crimp them. I like doing it in two different steps. That is why I asked about a separate crimp die.

Thanks
Chris

[Wayne Smith]

Most anyone will make a crimp die for the 38/357. There is no real difference between them, it is a well known standard die. Or just go on eBay and pick up a spare seat die, remove the seat stem, and use it as a crimp die. Will do the same thing.

[grrifles]

Sounds good.

Thanks
Chris

[Echo]

Most anyone will make a crimp die for the 38/357. There is no real difference between them, it is a well known standard die. Or just go on eBay and pick up a spare seat die, remove the seat stem, and use it as a crimp die. Will do the same thing.

Solid +1

[runfiverun]

just about everybody sells thier dies separatly not just in the sets.
on my dillons i run a mish mash of dies from lee to rcbs and wells/bonanza to redding.
i might even have a couple of dillon dies in the mix.

[Rockchucker]

I also have a mix of different mfg dies in my tool heads but prefer to use Dillon crimp dies for their ease of cleaning. most all my tool head have these in the forth station.
http://www.dillonprecision.com/#/content/p/9/pid/24483/catid/4/Dillon_Crimp_Dies

[rainy191]

either purchase a seperate crimp/seater like mentioned above or get a crimp die. crimpd dies are available from dillion or lee has a facteory crimp die that alot of people really like. myself i have dillion die sets for my 650

[Crusty Deary Ol'Coot]

Ya know, I have loaded for the .38 Special and the .357 for years, among others, and other then your just wanting to do the seating & crimping in two steps, very seldom like almost never will anything be gained other then meeting your desire to do it in two steps.

Yes, I read and hear the comments about brass all needing to be the same length but my loads already shoot way better then I do, and truely in the many years I have loaded these cartridges, whatever very minor amount of case length difference might be there has just made no detectable difference.

The three die set from what ever manufacture you choose will do all that needs to be done, except meet your need to complicate the process.

I even bought a profile crimp die to help with my .44mag hunting loads when doing load development with my scoped .44 and after seeing ZERO change or improvement in my already good results, that Redding die now just keeps it's nice little green box from moving around on my bench. In short, it was a waste of my money and the money would have been better spent on powder or primers.

There have been millions of rounds loaded and fired after processing through a simple 3 die set and millions more will follow providing the obamanation doesn't mess things up, and in most cases, the only positive result which came from a 4th die was just the filling of loaders desire to use the extra die.

So, save your money or do what floats your boat, it is after all your choice.

Crusty Deary Ol'Coot

[C.F.Plinker]

It sounds like you are tumble lubing. My suggestion would be to keep your present crimp-seater and use it, without the seating stem, as your crimper and get the Dillon seating die. The reason for this is that if you overlube with LLA it can build up in the seater. The Dillon is very easy to disassemble (in fact, you don't even have to remove it from the press) without losing your seating adjustment and clean.

[Shiloh]

I have LEE, Dillon, and another unidentified crimp die.
As stated, they are all about the same. I prefer to seat and crimp in separate operations.
Does anyone roll crimp .38's?? Mine are taper crimp.

SHiloh

[engineer401]

I use separate seater and crimp dies in my 550B because of case bulging when I did both at once. I have 38 and 357 roll crimp dies. My auto dies are taper crimp. Most of my crimp dies are Dillon. Dillon advertises the crimper can be removed and cleaned of built up bullet lube without removing the die body from the tool head. Therefore, your crimp die will remain properly adjusted when you reassemble the die after cleaning. The Lee carbide die will do the same. I far prefer the Dillon crimp dies over my one remaining Lee crimp die that I needed to remove the carbide ring from.

[gefiltephish]

Because I'm truly lazy, I have separate die sets for 38 and 357 for use in the LNL progressive. I use a spare Lee seater to crimp the 38's and a Redding Profile crimp for 357. For non canelured plated bullets I use a Lee taper crimp (not the FCD). While the Redding surely is a handsome tool and makes an equally handsome uniform crimp, I'm fairly certain it impresses me more than the ammo, gun or target.

I did have a 38/357 fcd but buggered it up while trying to punch out the carbide. Not sure what I did wrong since I was previously successful with two others. Oh well, no big loss.

I also have a 3rd set I use for working up loads on the LCT. This is an old RCBS set, and the only situation I seat/crimp in one step 'cause there's only four holes. It works well, I just prefer to do it separately.

[MikeS]

For crimping with a roll crimp if you have an extra die lock ring laying around, I would just buy a lee seating die body as a replacement part, rather than buying a complete seating die. You can buy the body only from Factory Sales (fsreloading.com) for about $11.00 which is about $5.00 cheaper than the complete die, and is the only part needed (other than a lock ring) to use it as a roll crimping die.

I do this with most cartridges that use a roll crimp, and use separate taper crimp dies when loading autoloading cartridges.

[GL49]

I only use a taper crimp on my 38's, when I load 357 I change to the roll crimp. I crimp on the 4th station of my 550. Somehow I ended up with two 9mm taper crimp dies, that's what I use when I crimp my 38's.

[MikeS]

I would stay away from the Lee Carbide Factory Crimp Die, (there are many threads here that explain why it's not good for lead boolits), but to get a fairly cheap dedicated roll crimping die, I would either buy a Lee seating die alone, or if like many reloaders you have extra die locking rings laying around, you can buy just the Lee seating die body as a spare part for around $12.00 or so.

Of course after saying that, depending on the load you're shooting (hot or mild) you might not really need a crimp, and could use the seating die to seat the boolit, and iron out the flare in one operation. Also depending on the boolit design you might be able to do a roll crimp while seating, as an example if using a true Keith design that has a large well tapered crimp groove. As you're using a TL design you might be able to get away with using a 3 die setup if your crimp isn't very deep. The only way to know for sure is to try it.

[Crusty Deary Ol'Coot]

Yep, as Mike indicates,

The three die set will do most every thing you need for the .38/.357 and any other effort is just wasted along with money spent to buy extra dies.

Been there and done that since the 60s or early 70s and the .38/.357 is still the same.

Now, if your into and good enough to be in high levels of competition you just might be able to really realise an advantage with the extra cost and effort.

Other then that, there is nothing to gain over, a properly adjusted three die set.

If you desire to use them, well whatever floats your boat, just know that you'll seldom if ever see the difference on the target.

CDOC

[GL49]

Crusty,
I agree 100%. Where I've run into trouble is shooting mixed lots of brass that are different lengths. I haven't had trouble with the 38/357 much, except with bullets rather than boolits, but in rifle calibers, specifically the 30-30, crimping and seating at the same time used to give me fits. Now that I keep my brass sorted by headstamp and # of firings, and trimmed to the same length... problem gone. I've just changed to a separate crimping operation and stayed with it in all my calibers since I had a fourth station available on my 550. I've never had a problem with 38's, but all I shoot is lead in those.

[Crusty Deary Ol'Coot]

GL49,

Yep, agree with trimming rifle or bottle neck cartridges as needed, but to the best of my old recaller, can never once remember trimming a handgun case - .38/.357 or .44.

100% agree as to sorting bottle neck/rifle brass by times fired and brand.

However, I also hope to keep it done as to lot numbers.

Back 20 or so years, I was developing loads for a son's 30/06. The range was 45 - 60 minutes drive so tried to make the trips pay when we went. Way before $4.00 gas!

Ran out of brass for the test loads from the batch of Remington brass being used, so went to the brass bucket and picked out the needed number of Rem. cases, making sure they all had the same Head Stamp Style.

As it turned out, these "odd" cases were used in the upper level loads in the test series, the loads for the last two and highest loads, and the pressures went nuts!

One case which I saved streached beyond the "needs to be trimmed length" in one firing (cases were trimmed to the "trim" length before loading) and the case head and primer showed HIGH pressure!!!!! There 2 or three of the odd cases in each of the last to groups of 5, and the odd cases not olny showed pressures, but also threw fliers out of the groups.

Today, with the digital scale, weighing the cases should prevent this, but the point is, even within a single brand of brass, there can be great differences in case thickness.

Best to also sort by brass lot numbers as well as brand and times fired.

Later,

Crusty Deary Ol'Coot

[GL49]

Trim handgun cases? Only once about 30 years ago. I bought a new lot of 250 cases from an unnamed manufacturer and the mouths weren't square. Cleaned them up and never purchased that brand again. Interesting note on the lot #'s, I'd never thought of that.

[Crusty Deary Ol'Coot]

Yes, GL49,

It is interesting on the cases in lot numbers.

When I began to load back in the 60s, I never gave it a thought. Most of the brass came from factory fodder or 20round boxes of new brass.

However, that one time really pointed out to me that there can be a huge and possibly dangerious difference in lot to lot brass thickness within ONE BRAND of brass.

I really doubt that there were dangerious pressures in the factory ammo loaded in those Remington cases. They would of as a matter of course, adjusted powder amounts or type to the brass they were loading from any one manufacturing lot number, there by avoiding any such problems.

Seems if a person is wanting to use mixed lot brass from ONE MANUFACTURE, it would be very wise to weight out a batch from EACH lot on a digital or balance beam scale to do two things, check on consistancy of weight and make sure you haven't ended up with some overly thick brass.

Likely best just to not mix manufacturing lots of rifle brass and never mix brands.

Talking hunting level loads here, and not what I shoot through my handguns, which in the cast of my .38brass is a total mix up as per brands.

Of course, the loads are operating at MUCH lower pressures.

Crusty Deary Ol'Coot