No gas check

[abunaitoo]

I've been playing with the BobS load and was wondering if anyone has tried to shoot the bullets without a gas check.
My thinking is the filler would protect the base of the bullet, so a gas check would be just redundant.

[RobS]

Maybe......the base of the boolit could need the GC for the lauch; as the boolit journeys and exits the muzzle. It may have nothing to do with protecting the base of the bullet at all. Shooting will tell the tale.

[abunaitoo]

I'm going to try it this weekend.
I was hoping someone would have tried it.

[fcvan]

I have shot a number of boolits, including gas check design boolits without checks, using corn meal as a filler. The corn meal seals and protects the base of to boolit quite well.

The load was the Lee C452-300 RF through my Vaquero in .45 Colt with 8.5 grains of Unique, and enough corn meal so that the load was barely compressed. The 8.5 gr load shot about like a 10 grain load of unique.

One other thing I noticed was the lack of smoke or at least a noticeable reduction of smoke. Shooting corn meal loads was almost like shooting jacketed with regard to smoke. I think because the gasses aren't contacting the lube directly as the boolit is greasing the skids so to speak has something to do with it. The bore is scrubbed by the corn meal so the only think I've seen was a light coat of lube and very little soot. Frank

[zuke]

I use gas checked boolit's with paper patch's and have never had a problem.

[blackthorn]

Why put a gas check on a PP bullet? My understanding is the paper does the same service as a check ----so? I do not PP (at least not yet) so inquiring minds want to know.

[geargnasher]

Why put a gas check on a PP bullet? My understanding is the paper does the same service as a check ----so? I do not PP (at least not yet) so inquiring minds want to know.

I think he meant "gas-check design", without the check. I do the same thing, makes the tail easier to twist.

Gear

[zuke]

I think he meant "gas-check design", without the check. I do the same thing, makes the tail easier to twist.

Gear

Yes it does, and easier to seat.

[44man]

A boolit needs no base protection at all. The purpose of the check is to halt skid at the base. Filler will not do that. Filler might pack up and reduce leakage but the check does that too. How long down the bore will filler prevent gas leakage?
If a boolit does not skid, many can be shot well without a check. What will count then is drive length to twist because you shorten it when you leave the check off.
Bases do not melt. If it skids and makes rifling marks larger at the base then the rifling, gas will erode the sides of the boolit. Some fillers will block the marks. The filler needs to keep them blocked until boolit exit.
PP does work because it really toughens the boolit sides. Strange paper can do that!

[blackthorn]

Thanks! I guess the use of the word "checked" boolits confused me a bit. Funny how the addition of 2 letters (ed) can make one see things in a different light.

[jdgabbard]

I've never had a problem shooting a gas check design without a gas check, provided I wasn't trying to hot rod it.

[abunaitoo]

Tried it today.
Disaster
Couldn't hit the side of a barn.
I guess with the load I'm using, it need the gas check.

[lwknight]

Did you try the same bullet with the same load plus the gas check?
It really makes no sense regarding accuracy.
There should be no difference till your bore leads up or something like that.

[abunaitoo]

Same load, same bullet, same case, same rifle, same powder, different day.
I shot the load with the gas check first two weeks ago. Thought I'd try without the gas check.
Thought maybe the filler would act as a gas check.
Didn't work for me.

[lwknight]

Same load, same bullet, same case, same rifle, same powder, different day.
I shot the load with the gas check first two weeks ago. Thought I'd try without the gas check.
Thought maybe the filler would act as a gas check.
Didn't work for me.

I'm thinking that the filler is the problem.
I have tried several GC design bullets without the checks and there is no difference except the extra 4 or more cents per shot.
Granted I'm not pushing the bullet hard enough to skid and thats really all the GC does is rotate easily so that it does not open up a gas port like a skidded rifling would.

[Maven]

abunaitoo, Take a look at this thread, especially C.E. Harris' reply: http://www.castbulletassoc.org/forum/view_topic.php?id=8838&forum_id=63

[chboats]

Sometimes it works and sometimes it doesn't. Was shooting a TC Encore 30-30 with a Saeco 315, with checks, over 15 gr of 2400. Was getting 1 1/2"at 100 yds. Tried it with out the checks and the groups opened up to 1 3/4". In an 03A3 same boolit over 18gr of 5744 when I did my part I world get 2" groups. The velocity was less the 1400fs. Tired them with out the checks. Bad news. Couldn't keep them in 12" at 100 yds and they left a lot of lead in the barrel.

You just have to try it and see what happens.

Carl

[44man]

Tried it today.
Disaster
Couldn't hit the side of a barn.
I guess with the load I'm using, it need the gas check.
You need to change the velocity. You have changed the boolit. It will not work with the same load.
Go back to square one and work loads with the check off. It might work but it is just my guess.

[abunaitoo]

I kind of had a feeling I would have to lower the powder load.
This is the BobS load for the M1 Garand.
37.0 of IMR4350.
Being it's a low charge already, I don't really want to go all that much lower.

[44man]

I kind of had a feeling I would have to lower the powder load.
This is the BobS load for the M1 Garand.
37.0 of IMR4350.
Being it's a low charge already, I don't really want to go all that much lower.
Some just will not work, had the trouble with a 30-30 boolit. I could hit pennies at 100 yards but ran out of checks. Leaving them off had every boolit hit full sideways at 50 yards. :holysheep

[MT Chambers]

Most everyone who's anyone has tried gas check designs, without the gas check, and have not had good results over about 1200fps, maybe less.

[wmitty]

If you will take the time to learn paper patching, you can leave the gas checks off for sure!