Ever had to actually draw a firearm on someone?

[DSL1138]

I was surfing the Internet today and came across this video:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Einih5fXQmE&feature=player_embedded#!

And it got me thinking: Has anyone here ever had to draw a gun on somebody? People always talk about what they would do if they ever had to take their gun out of their holster, about the fateful day when someone crosses the line and forces us to draw. But has anybody here actually had that adrenaline-pumping day come already? I'm curious to see yall's responses.

[Jim]

I wasn't forced to, I made the decision to. The guy was illegally repoing my wife car and I convinced him his plan was a bad one.

[Trey45]

Once, didn't much care for it, wouldn't bother me one bit if I never had to do it again.

[Goatwhiskers]

16 yrs working law enforcement. Only had 3 times, all were escalating situations, when I felt a lot better with the thing in my hand. By the Lord's favor never even had to raise it to a shooting position. Kinda like kicking butt on some of those street goblins, I'll never say that I didn't want to more than once. Old sheriff I once worked for in Texas once told me that rule #1 is to treat a man like a man, rule #2 is if the sxxx starts you win. I always followed #1, never needed #2. Here endeth the epistle. GW

[MtGun44]

No, but very close twice, both times the aggressor (road rage in traffic) - who had exited their cars,
saw me sitting calmly with my right hand in the console just watching at them, recognized that
I wasn't playing the victim very well, and after 10-20 seconds of reconsideration, got
back in the car and left. My hand was on a loaded 1911.

Bill

[x101airborne]

I have several times. I went to kill a man who pulled a razor knife on me on duty with the SO. My corpral was behind me hiding like a female dog in heat and when I stepped back for distance, I stepped on him. There has been several times since. Trespassers, poachers, 18 wheelers that decide to bust my gate down to turn around. One thing for sure, dont ever BET I wont. And I am not even going into my military career. Uneventful as it was.

[gray wolf]

Yes, more than once,
only had to fire one time.
You better have the mind set for it, and the stomach to go with it.
I don't advocate UN-skinning a firearm to scare someone.
If you pull that weapon you had better be ready to use it.
If you have any---ANY--doubt you couldn't use it to kill another human being.
You have no business carrying it.
If you do have to use it make sure you have absolutely no other choice.
12 of your piers must be able to say
" this person had no other choice" The fear he/she had for there life or the life of another was justified.

[Frank46]

Once, the guy next door was a pervert and was busted for climbing on a house roof to spy on two young girls in in the apartment next to the house. Just got out of the car with a 45 and he ran around to the opposite (passenger side) as I was walking down the driveway to the back door of my house. Saw what was in my hand and figured there was someplace he needed to be other than where he was. Ended up getting sent away to some mental institution for a long time. He did get caught peeping on the girls and a few other women. Last three houses next to the apartment house had no drive way so they were very close together. The girl's dad caught him peeping when the girls screamed and darn near sent him to the hospital. When the police came and arrested him his mom said he was mentally unstable and just a poor boy. Never saw him again after he was arrested. Think everyone in the block breathed a sigh of relief. First and I sincerely hope I never have to do something like that again. But pray the God gives me the wisdom if another situation ever does present itself. This was almost 30 years ago and almost forgot about it until I saw this post. Frank

[9.3X62AL]

I envy any LEO whose area characteristics only obliged him/her to deploy a weapon 3x in 16 years.

How about those Broncos, with Peyton Manning at the helm? :)

[bob208]

both times without a thought. the first time a fool was shooting at me and i made him stop. the second i was setting in my vette and this leans down reaches in grabes me and yells get out of my car. i never said a word. but that single action ruger came out was stuck between his eyes and he could see the h-p as i cocked the hammer. ownership was decided right there and i did not have to pull the trigger.

[Cariboo]

several times never had to fire

[jimkim]

Had a guy break in my store once. For some reason, I was sleeping in the back room that night. When I woke up I saw him, and put one in the wall next to his head. He ducked behind a wall. It had sheetrock on my side and paneling on his. I put five more rounds into what I thought was the small of his back. When I stepped around the corner the front door was closing and he was rounding the corner across the street. There were no holes on his side of the wall. It turns out the building had once been a restaurant and that wall was an old poured cinder block firewall. The only evidence he left was a puddle of some brown goo on my floor and a few scratches on my door-lock. Word got out around town and people came in to see the holes and laugh about the would be burglar.

I was in my living room, someone attacked my daughter in law next door. By son ran in the house and grabbed his 30-30. When I got outside, I took the gun from his hand buttstroked the one closest to us, flipped the rifle around and rested the muzzle on the other one's ribs. I told them to leave and not to so much as let their shadow rest on my property again. They left.

Other than that and the time I was shot at by poachers or dopers that's about it. Never went to see if I hit anything but the shooting stopped.

[mongo]

Wow, What a question, Many times, Mostly on evening and late tours, Roberys, stolen cars, searching buildings for bad guys, Looking for homicide suspects, Very often working in THE BIG CESSPOOL...

[burntpowder]

Hey Goatwhiskers, I spent the same number of years as an LEO and I never even thought about my weapon until the moment I needed it. The Lord blessed me also and I never had to shoot anyone and I can count on one hand the times it came out of the holster going to shoot someone. I guess the bad guys saw it in my eyes cause every situation settled right down. Yep, rule 1 and rule 2. Thank you, Jesus.

[SciFiJim]

I have only had a CCW for four years now. Never had to pull it, be had my hand on it and was ready to pull it once when the situation diffused itself. Hope to God I never have to use it.

Dang, this is a tough post to write. I wrote and erased it twice before deciding on the above statement.

[Sweetpea]

I also wish I hadn't had to, but I pulled my Mak on my brother once... got his attention and I convinced him to stop using drugs!

I am still not sure if he knows that it was unloaded and no magazine... OH WELL!

[Cariboo]

Dang, this is a tough post to write. I wrote and erased it twice before deciding on the above statement.

I gave up trying to write more than I did.

[Gliden07]

I had a couple false alarms.

1) Was a Manager of a Burger King Resturant (21Yrs old) worked closing shift would get home at 3:30AM to 4:00AM. Was still living at home and heard my Mother screaming bloody murder around 7:00AM jumped up loaded my 9MM Taurus ran out to find a Bear staring in the slider. Spooked my Mother, but when Bear heard my Mother screaming he took off running!!

2) Moved into my new house. 3AM I get woken up with a large rucuss on my back porch. Sounded like someone trying to break in my rear door, again I grabed my 9MM and headed to the door. Grabbed the door handle and opened the door as fast as I could, jumping back to give me a little more room. Turns out a stray dog had come onto porch and knocked over the garbage can that was there, the can was banging into the door. Thank God!!

I don't think I would hesitate, but I hope I'm never put in that situation for real!!

[bowfin]

Ever point a gun at someone? No

Ever had one pointed at me? Yes

I ended up with it after a tussle, no one hurt much more than in a schoolyard fight. I was more worried about getting shot by accident than I was getting shot on purpose, as the pointer was very drunk.

[starreloader]

5 times, 4 while on duty and 1 off duty... Always tried to apply the same 2 rules as Goatwhiskers... Rule #1 worked with the 4 on duty.. Had to use rule #2 for an off duty dirtbag.. 45 Colt Combat Commander settled that problem...

[smokeywolf]

Drawn my pistol many times. Actually pointed it at person, a few times. In the capacity of law enforcement, you unholster your sidearm routinely because of a perceived threat; traffic stops when a warrant comes back on a license plate, sometimes domestic disturbances, and of course armed robberies.

Babysitting cattle, I actually returned fire once. I was using a model '94 30-30. Shooters were at least 700 yards away; 2 shots from them, one shot returned. They made a break for an irrigation ditch close by. The only cover available to me was my horse. That was the end of it. I think their intent was to determine what my fight or flight response would be.

[scarry scarney]

Yes, too many.

[DIRT Farmer]

First night on duty in a car by my self, backing up another officer. The senior officer let the drunk get back in his car, who then reached under the seat, I saw a flash of metal as the drunk swung his hand towards the senior's chest. I realised it was keys just before the hammer got all the way back. The drunk thought it was funny.

And nothing ever happens in a town of 1200.

[rmatchell]

Only once. I was on vacation with my family, when we came up a a guy and his wife stuck on the side of the road. My wife offered for us to take him back to a gas station a few miles back to get help. The whole time he was in the van he kept digging in his pockets making me regret helping. I keep a pistol in the door with me when we travel, slowly brought it up and took the safety off. Next thing I know the guy said that he didn't have any money but would like to give me his knife as a thank you for helping he had been stuck on the side of the road for a hour or so. I was glad to see things turn out ok, but I hope never to be in that spot again.

[Tom W.]

Twice. Once when I was waiting for my first wife to get off of work, I was napping in the car. I feel the door start to open and hear a guy say " Hey, I know..." and that's as far as he got, because I had my Government Model squarely between his eyes and had disengaged the safety. The thing that sticks into my mind is the green soles of his sneakers heading north at a very rapid pace.
The other I was waiting at a bus terminal to pick up my son as he was discharged from the Marine Corps. I had to wait several hours, as the time he told me and the time the actual schedule was didn't mesh. A crackhead cane up and started to rub my windshield with a sweaty towel. I suggested that he go away. He said something about needing some money, and I told him again to understand Go Away, and reached for the console and he decided to go. About three hours later a wino came up and said that I needed to give him $5 so he could eat breakfast. He started to reach into the car, and I pulled the little mouse gun that I had, and he ran like something was after him. If he'd have grabbed me we both would have been on the evening news.

[jimkim]

And nothing ever happens in a town of 1200.

Yeah right. lol I grew up near Rhine GA. In 2000 the population was only 400. People used to say "if there wasn't a killing on the weekend in Rhine, something was bad wrong". I've heard people from all over the state talk about Rhine. I guess they named my county right. I'm from Dodge. It shoulda' been called duck. lol

[Olevern]

only 2X outside of my LEO duties and Vietnam.

Once, while off duty and out collecting rents on the apartments I owned, I picked up three young men hitch-hiking (younger, more stupid days) in town who wanted me to drop them at a bar across town. I was headed in that general direction anyway, so agreed to drop them off. On the way one of them (the one sitting in the front seat) pulled a knife and demanded money. I was approaching a major intersection, so locked up the brakes (throwing the knife wielder into the dashboard), coming to a stop right in the middle of the busy intersection. I jumped out of the car, pulled my pistol and pointed it at the thug in the front seat, telling him to leave the knife on the the seat and get out on the ground. He complied but his two buddies bailed out and ran. I didn't care, the perp was waiting for his ride to jail when it got there.

The other incident was when I was temporarily assigned to NAS (Naval Air Station), Willow Grove, Pa., and I was driving thru Philly early in the a.m. to get to work. Two punks caught me at a stop sign intersection and one came out right in front of my vehicle with a bucket of dirty water which he threw on my windshield while his buddy came around to my drivers side window and stated "that'll be five dollars for the car wash". I slightly raised the 8 3/8" S&W mdl. 27 off my lap and he saw it and bolted.
His buddy, from where he was standing blocking my leaving couldn't see the gun, but after a lengthy pause to consider the situation (probably thru drug fogged brain), decided if the situation was dire enough to make his fellow tough run away it might be prudent to run himself.

It's a pain to carry but could be even more of a pain to not have when you need it.

One of the last brainiacs were so stupid as to stand in front of my Chev. pick up truck to block egress with no apparent weapon. I could have run down stupid #2 with absolutely no effort and avoided the situation but prefered to end it without injury, therefore I displayed the gun.

[Olevern]

only 2X outside of my LEO duties and Vietnam.

Once, while off duty and out collecting rents on the apartments I owned, I picked up three young men hitch-hiking (younger, more stupid days) in town who wanted me to drop them at a bar across town. I was headed in that general direction anyway, so agreed to drop them off. On the way one of them (the one sitting in the front seat) pulled a knife and demanded money. I was approaching a major intersection, so locked up the brakes (throwing the knife wielder into the dashboard), coming to a stop right in the middle of the busy intersection. I jumped out of the car, pulled my pistol and pointed it at the thug in the front seat, telling him to leave the knife on the the seat and get out on the ground. He complied but his two buddies bailed out and ran. I didn't care, the perp was waiting for his ride to jail when it got there.

The other incident was when I was temporarily assigned to NAS (Naval Air Station), Willow Grove, Pa., and I was driving thru Philly early in the a.m. to get to work. Two punks caught me at a stop sign intersection and one came out right in front of my vehicle with a bucket of dirty water which he threw on my windshield while his buddy came around to my drivers side window and stated "that'll be five dollars for the car wash". I slightly raised the 8 3/8" S&W mdl. 27 off my lap and he saw it and bolted.
His buddy, from where he was standing blocking my leaving couldn't see the gun, but after a lengthy pause to consider the situation (probably thru drug fogged brain), decided if the situation was dire enough to make his fellow tough run away it might be prudent to run himself.

It's a pain to carry but could be even more of a pain to not have when you need it.

One of the last brainiacs were so stupid as to stand in front of my Chev. pick up truck to block egress with no apparent weapon. I could have run down stupid #2 with absolutely no effort and avoided the situation but prefered to end it without injury, therefore I displayed the gun.

[Sasquatch-1]

In 25 years of law enforcement I pulled my weapon many times. I also worked in Washington D. C. and in narcotics for 15 years. I once had to shoot at a dope dealer. Unfortunately I missed. As others have said here, If you unholster it you better be ready to use it or the thug you pull it on may use it on you.

Personaly I think most people who have carry permits would freeze in a situation where they would be justified shooting someone. If you have a carry permit and/or are thinking of getting one, you better make darn sure you pay close attention to the legal aspect of carring.

On a small side bar, When I responded to burglary calls in the Capitol Hill area, the victims would often ask, "Should I get a gun?" My response was always NO! I would tell them to go to animal shelter and find the noisiest dog at the pound and take it home.

[725]

23 years as a ghetto cop in one of America's most violent cities. Pulling Roscoe was as natural as morning coffee & grilled cornbread. Never to make a point but rather to be as ready as possible. Frequently the malcontent never realized I was unholstered until I reholstered. It's not TV. Been shot at several times without effect. Can't count the times I began to apply pressure to the trigger only to have the situation change at the most critical moment. I was lucky in many ways. I don't know anybody that wanted to get into a shooting. Those who did shoot suspects were usually pissed about it.

[high standard 40]

Many years ago when my wife and I were living next door to her parent's house, we were home late one night while her parents were away. I heard a vehicle drive up to their house and I observed from a window as they started to burglarize the house. I had the wife call 911 and I gathered up my Mini 14 and a 30 round mag and I eased out the door. Long story short, I helped the three perps decide that they needed to stick around until the Sheriff deputies arrived for a conversation with them. I did it without a second thought but my sincere hope is that I'm never forced to make that decision again. I didn't have to fire a shot, but I came close when one of them didn't quickly heed my orders to drop and spread.

[Jim]

I've never had a problem admitting things that most people would not. That time I had a gun on that guy that was winching my wife car up on that ramp truck, I was shakin' like a dog passin' pecan shells. Truth be told, I was scared to death I was actually gonna have to shoot him.

[fishnbob]

I've never had a problem admitting things that most people would not. That time I had a gun on that guy that was winching my wife car up on that ramp truck, I was shakin' like a dog passin' pecan shells. Truth be told, I was scared to death I was actually gonna have to shoot him.

Yep! The second thing that comes to my mind is, "am I gonna spend the rest of my life in jail for this SOB?" That occurs right after the click of the safety.

[Grandpas50AE]

Once many years ago when working at a convenience store, a guy pulled a knife on my brother at the cash register; he decided the SxS 12 ga. in my hands 10 feet away didn't mix well with his drugs and he dropped the knife and left.
A year later a guy ran me off the road and got out of his pickup truck with a tire iron to approach me sitting in my car, he decided it was a case of mistaken identity when he saw the muzzle of my .45 auto looking at him.

Hope I never have to fininsh the "trigger tension adjustment", but I know I can if necessary.

[KCSO]

Drug Warrant, gun in EACH hand one on the owner heading for his gun and one on the pit bull heading for me. The owner changed direction and jumped on the pit bull crying "Don't shoot my doggie". Both were about a pound away from dead.

[gray wolf]

Once many years ago when working at a convenience store, a guy pulled a knife on my brother at the cash register; he decided the SxS 12 ga. in my hands 10 feet away didn't mix well with his drugs and he dropped the knife and left.
A year later a guy ran me off the road and got out of his pickup truck with a tire iron to approach me sitting in my car, he decided it was a case of mistaken identity when he saw the muzzle of my .45 auto looking at him.

IMHO The above calls seem to be very justified
There are many post here that indicate weapons were deployed
When not justified. Flame me if you like, but I think a little re-thinking is in order.
Also some of the situations clearly did not warrant deadly force.
Would you shoot that guy washing your car windows ??
Think about some of the reasons given here for displaying a weapon,
Think about all the wrong things that could have happened,
Think about the consequences a life was taken in some of these situations.
You can't shoot someone if they have a stick, bat, shovel, or a pipe in there hand.
Sometimes even a knife. Was it displayed in a threatening manor ?
So far most of what I have read here IMHO don't qualify.
LEOS are a different story, different training, different mind set.
If I even felt the slightest threat answering a call I UN-snapped, If a hair stood up
it was at my side.
I have read here to many times, people saying WOW I don't know if I could have fired my gun, What the helll are you carrying it for.
There are to many instants that people have been bothered by someone on the street and a weapon is pulled, ( no fear of life, as a deterrent ) The dirt bag leaves and gets a LEO, the person is arrested for brandishing and threatening.
The weapon on your belt or in your hand is capable of turning a breathing, living human being into a pile of bleeding dying flesh.
You better be darn sure, and darn capable, and darn willing.
Just to keep things in perspective, and clear the air on my stance here.
if someone threatens my life ( feeling like I have to end this RIGHT NOW )
they get double tapped. I am in NO way indicating a passive attitude,
or that deploying a firearm to save your life is wrong,
just be sure you are right.

FLAME attire on.

Sam in Maine

[Olevern]

IMHO The above calls seem to be very justified
There are many post here that indicate weapons were deployed
When not justified. Flame me if you like, but I think a little re-thinking is in order.
Also some of the situations clearly did not warrant deadly force.
Would you shoot that guy washing your car windows ??

The crime of unlawfully seizing and carrying away a person by force or Fraud, or seizing and detaining a person against his or her will with an intent to carry that person away at a later time.


Generally, kidnapping occurs when a person, without lawful authority, physically asports (i.e., moves) another person without that other person's consent, with the intent to use the abduction in connection with some other nefarious objective. Under the Model Penal Code (a set of exemplary criminal rules fashioned by the American Law Institute), kidnapping occurs when any person is unlawfully and non-consensually asported and held for certain purposes. These purposes include gaining a ransom or reward; facilitating the commission of a felony or a flight after the commission of a felony; terrorizing or inflicting bodily injury on the victim or a third person; and interfering with a governmental or political function (Model Penal Code § 212.1).



Think about some of the reasons given here for displaying a weapon,
Think about all the wrong things that could have happened,
Think about the consequences a life was taken in some of these situations.
You can't shoot someone if they have a stick, bat, shovel, or a pipe in there hand.
Sometimes even a knife. Was it displayed in a threatening manor ?
So far most of what I have read here IMHO don't qualify.
LEOS are a different story, different training, different mind set.
If I even felt the slightest threat answering a call I UN-snapped, If a hair stood up
it was at my side.
I have read here to many times, people saying WOW I don't know if I could have fired my gun, What the helll are you carrying it for.
There are to many instants that people have been bothered by someone on the street and a weapon is pulled, ( no fear of life, as a deterrent ) The dirt bag leaves and gets a LEO, the person is arrested for brandishing and threatening.
The weapon on your belt or in your hand is capable of turning a breathing, living human being into a pile of bleeding dying flesh.
You better be darn sure, and darn capable, and darn willing.
Just to keep things in perspective, and clear the air on my stance here.
if someone threatens my life ( feeling like I have to end this RIGHT NOW )
they get double tapped. I am in NO way indicating a passive attitude,
or that deploying a firearm to save your life is wrong,
just be sure you are right.

FLAME attire on.

Sam in Maine

When one prevents another from leaving, as idiot one and idiot two did, that is attempting to kidnap, particularly when combined with the stated objective of extorting money from the victim. Justification enough.

[gray wolf]

A stretch in my opinion, but I understand your need to justify your actions.
So exactly who would you have shot ? the guy who through the water on your car ?
(and was extorting money from you )
or the guy you say was stopping you from leaving ?
At what point would you have used your weapon ?
So if some bum on the street ask you for money and happens to be standing in front of you, that gives the OK to draw down on him.
Sorry I just don't see your point, all you had to do is roll up your window and drive away, big deal a guy was in front of your car. IMHO deadly force was not needed, and that's what the weapon is for.
But then again I know these kinds of discussions prove and accomplish nothing.
I said my say and you said yours.

[Jim]

Fellas, I'm tellin' ya' what I know to be fact, if this thread gets outa' hand, it'll be one more that gets shut down. If y'all wanna continue discussin' this, ya' might wanna temper your responses a bit.

[Lonegun1894]

I have drawn many more times than I have fired, but have done both. Mine were military, which I won't go into here, LE, and civilian. In Law Enforcement, drew many times, and fired twice in the last 4 years or so. First was when a man decided to get high and run me over with a truck, and the second was at a domestic when the suspect decided to send his dog after me while he tried to reach for something. I handled the dog and my partner handled him. As far as drawing, like has been said, that was a very common thing due to the area and the people we were dealing with. Sometimes we would go a month without drawing a weapon, other times, I would draw 3-4 times in the same shift. As a civilian, had a guy walk out on front of my vehicle at a red light and draw a gun while his friend came from behind with a pistol. The guy next to me got winged with my .45 while the one out front got run over. Another time, within 5 miles of the Southern border, stopped to help a man who was broken down on the road, and had a shot go past me from out in the brush. I returned fire, and the local SO found blood but no shooter where the shot came from along with a SKS the shooter left behind. As far as times I have drawn, a road rage incident where a man decided to try and run me off the road because my 5mph over the limit was too slow for him, he changed his mind as soon as he saw my .45 looking at him. There was one night at an old job where we got several calls from a girls ex-boyfriend that he was coming to see us that night after close and for everyone who wanted to live to leave before he got there. Several of us kept long guns in our vehicles in addition to the handguns we carried, so when he walked in with a baseball bat he faced two 12ga shotguns, an AR-15, and a .30-30, and decided to leave without incident. We all kept our handguns with us at all times anyway, but a few more employees started carrying after that night. Another night, walking out of the local Walmart, I made it half way to my vehicle when a guy yelled at me from about 25-30yds away that I have his money. Told him he has me mistaken for someone else, and he responded that he will take mine anyway. I drew my pistol, and aimed it at him while telling him to get on the ground, at which he turned and ran. The local deptartment said they had several incidents reported and the description matched mine also, but that they had been unable to catch him so far but that he had not harmed anyone or drawn any kind of weapon YET, but just seemed to use intimidation. I never saw a weapon, or even him reach for one, but would have fired if he had attempted to approach me as he had made his intent very clear and he could have easily had some form of weapon concealed somewhere.

I have had to do this enough, that it is a reaction, rather than a decision followed by action. But I would be happy to not have to do this again, and hope it never becomes necessary to repeat the above. However, since it was necessary, and we do live in interesting times, I will make sure me and mine are safe, and help anyone else if possible also, even if that means drawing and firing again. And I couldn't agree more on the two points made by the posters above. First, if you carry, you better be willing and able, and second, you had better be right.

[AndyC]

Yes, but I've lived in weird places and had weird jobs.

[Olevern]

: Greywolf: QUOTE :
A stretch in my opinion, but I understand your need to justify your actions.
So exactly who would you have shot ? the guy who through the water on your car ?
(and was extorting money from you )
They were both extorting money, working together collaboratively
or the guy you say was stopping you from leaving ?
The guy who threw dirty water on my car was the one who was preventing me from leaving (and possibly working together with the person in the car behind me at 6:30 a.m., never ascertained that 'cause as soon as the idiots on the street left, I left)
At what point would you have used your weapon ?
At the point that either actor caused me to be in fear of my life or serious bodily injury, ie: produced a weapon or threated to or attempted to physically attack me, having attained proximety sufficient to follow thru on that threat
So if some bum on the street ask you for money and happens to be standing in front of you, that gives the OK to draw down on him.
Doesn't even deserve a response
Sorry I just don't see your point, all you had to do is roll up your window and drive away, big deal a guy was in front of your car. IMHO deadly force was not needed, and that's what the weapon is for.
Narrow Philly neighborhood streets, car behind me, idiot #1 blocking egress in front, actor #2 approaching my driver's side window (a manual window that could not be wound up before actor #2 could have reached into the vehicle) No idea how far these two were willing to go to perpetrate their crime of extortion and actor #2 was almost in my face before he could see the handgun lying on my lap. No idea what weapon, if any, he was carrying, but he certainly had proximety to use an edged weapon or just physical force to drag me out of the truck. He had already expressed an intent to commit a crime (blocking my egress and demanding money) whatever your opinion, mine was and is still that display (and possible use if actor #2 produced a weapon or physically reached into my vehicle for me) was/is justified; this opinion from a LEO (retired) of 27 1/2 years who taught at the state police training academy and was the training officer at our local level for seven years
But then again I know these kinds of discussions prove and accomplish nothing.
I said my say and you said yours.

[Sasquatch-1]

I have drawn many more times than I have fired, but have done both. Mine were military, which I won't go into here, LE, and civilian. In Law Enforcement, drew many times, and fired twice in the last 4 years or so. First was when a man decided to get high and run me over with a truck, and the second was at a domestic when the suspect decided to send his dog after me while he tried to reach for something.

I just want to know if you wear a shirt that says "Try to assault me, I'm easy". I am not trying to be insulting, but I have never known anyone who has trouble follow them like that. One of those incidents would be all most people experience in a life time.

[1Shirt]

Didn't have to draw, just put hands on the holstered Blackhawk, and it was enough to back off the 4-5 young guys who I believe were intent on cleaning my clock.
1Shirt!

[Dutch4122]

........ as a ghetto cop in one of America's most violent cities. Pulling Roscoe was as natural as morning coffee & grilled cornbread. Never to make a point but rather to be as ready as possible. Frequently the malcontent never realized I was unholstered until I reholstered. It's not TV. Been shot at several times without effect. Can't count the times I began to apply pressure to the trigger only to have the situation change at the most critical moment. I was lucky in many ways. I don't know anybody that wanted to get into a shooting. Those who did shoot suspects were usually pissed about it.

Same here and couldn't have said it better myself. Too many times to count in the last 20 years. As far as rounds fired by me, I've had to put down more than two dozen dogs that were trying to take a chunk out of me or somebody else. Never fired a round a another human being; and hope that I am never forced to do so. Been close to tripping the sear way too many times; and have too many stories to tell here.

[Lonegun1894]

I just want to know if you wear a shirt that says "Try to assault me, I'm easy". I am not trying to be insulting, but I have never known anyone who has trouble follow them like that. One of those incidents would be all most people experience in a life time.


Sasquatch,
I wish avoiding trouble was as easy as changing t-shirts. A big factor is that most of those were in a very high drug-trafficking area less than a ten minute walk from the US-Mexico border. Another was that our local PD and command made it a point of announcing that military personell would not be armed on or off duty believeing that this would prevent us from being targeted by the local wildlife, but none of us followed that order and the public statement had to opposite unintended effect--while the required base stickers on our windshields IDed us in case someone missed the uniforms, haircuts, etc, etc. Then when I got out and got home, which happens to be within minutes of I-35 in Texas, which is also one of the biggest drug routes from Mexico through Texas and heading North, my little brother had turned into a participant in that trade, and made me a target by telling his fellow-turds that I have weapons and will be an easy victim. He made an offer of drugs in exchange for someone taking me out, regardless of what the pretense they used was, and several tried, most without any blood spilled. I still have the shirt my little brother put a butcher knife through while I was wearing it, but all I ended up with was a scratch on my chest due to the angle, and the only way I can explain it is that God must have been watching my back that day, because I shouldn't be here after that one. I still don't know what it was I did to deserve this attention, but I got it. Anyway, I had to prove my brother and several of his friends wrong before they got the hint to leave me alone. I didn't ask for any of this, but I also don't have it in me to turn tail and run or give up. It made for very interesting times when I was off duty when leaving base, but a handful of incidents (mostly very minor) my last 2 years before I got out, and then a few more (once again, mostly minor, with a couple exceptions) before my brother got busted and dealt with and stopped egging his buddies on, made for some exciting times that I never wanted and tried to avoid. But having said that, I will NOT sit at home and have my groceries and everything else delivered because something may happen, even when I know I am being targeted like I was for a while. Now, the instigator is looking at 99yrs due to some new incidents he got himself into, so maybe I will be lucky enough to live out the rest of my life in peace, or so I hope, because I am honestly sick and tired of trouble looking for me. Now the last couple of years have been relatively peaceful aside from a few very minor incidents in LE work, and I hope this is permanent because you most people have no idea how nice a change it has been not having a bullseye on my back after several years of having had one.

[Kraschenbirn]

Twice (as a civilian) but didn't have to fire in either case.

Bill

[Sasquatch-1]

Lonegun1894,

If my response dredged up bad memories I am truely sorry. It sounds like a really tough situation when you can't even trust your own brother. Once again my apologies and may you live out the rest of your life in peace.

[firefly1957]

I have shown that I was armed several times to discourage bad behavior never pointed at those people. I did fire a shot across a lake at a dirt bike once while the owner was getting ready to break into my truck and yelling get ^%&ed to me his attitude changed when that 45 slug hit near his bikes front tire and I yelled I have the range your next! While camping in DA U.P. something big got close and made noise and every hair stood up on my black lab in the fire light he looked like a Chia pet making the most awful growl I have heard a dog make I pulled the model 29 and turned my friend froze and could not move to draw his pistol. We found bear tracks next morning that thing circled camp moving branches for over two hours following being detected. I did draw and kill a stray Rottweiler that attacked me, two dogs were on the porch one morning I fed them and called the pound later when I went out the Rott growled it's eyes went wild all its hair stood up and it charged me. At 3 feet it took a 165gr+P Corebon 45 acp he crumbled instantly I missed my aim point by 7 inches at 3 feet! Bullet hit the collar bone and went into heart lungs no exit after a minute it regain some conciseness but was completely done. Nasty business being attacked and shooting even though it was only a dog. Second dog had absolutely no concern over it and stayed calm even let the animal control officer pet it when he arrived. When I was a security guard in Pontiac Michigan I did remove my pistol from the holster one time when I was doing a employee escort at night and several young approached they split quite fast and the gal to my left never realized I had upholstered a model 28 as I had shined a 5 cell light on the "youths" with the other hand holding it high .

[opos]

Many many years ago before all the CCW stuff I was "summoned" to meet a young man who's ex girlfriend I had been seeing. We met at a bar and just sat and talked for a few minutes....he moved his jacket back and said "I never go naked"....I reached in my Levi jacket pocket and pulled out my little Smith 36 and set it on the table and said "neither do I"....Absolutly nothing happened and I think it was just a display of testosterone.....I live where CCW is almost an unheard of thing so I'm just very careful when in any situation where there are other folks around to not get into situations where an old guy like me would be threatened. We have quite a number of home invasion burglaries near my neighborhood....we don't have kids and we have loaded surprise packages throughout the house and a serious security door on the house....no carry outside but never more than a second or two from a loaded weapon inside and never a question of use or don't use....your warning is the locked door...and your rights end there.

[firefly1957]

I forgot when I was 16 a local nut case was holding a butcher knife on his girlfriend and my sister my other sister came running in and told me Ken was going to kill them I loaded the 30-30 went out put the front sight behind his ear and said "Ken it is time for you to go" he turned white turned around and walked off come to find out the local police thing he had murdered his father by shooting him in the stomach with a .410 shotgun but they wrote it off as a suicide? Shortly after I was married my wife was working nights at a nearby convenience store one icy night they were being watched at close so they locked up and called the police who had everyone on accident scenes. She called me and a few minutes later I pulled up with 4X4 shining three sets of CB lights in the car's side windows one had a bat the other a kitchen knife as I stood looking in I took out and loaded my 45 they left. (no CPL back then)

[John in WI]

I was shakin' like a dog passin' pecan shells. Truth be told, I was scared to death I was actually gonna have to shoot him.

I know that feeling. The one and only time I have ever pulled a gun out of fear, I was teaching a night class in Birmingham (Al). I had a CCW, but of course guns were strictly forbidden on campus. On days I taught night classes, I halfway complied and kept it locked in my desk until I was about to leave. (it was a risk I was willing to take---it was MY safety at stake, walking back to the car at night)

As I got back to my car I heard someone coming up behind me. I stopped, he stopped, I sped up, he sped up. I had a little flip-top Beretta .22 in my pocket. Which is actually a cute little gun. But at that moment it was so small, and I was shaking so bad I could hardly work the controls. And I was thinking 2 things--1) I wish I had my Makarov--he's going to beat me to death with this thing and 2) God, please don't force me to do this.

I took what felt like my last breath, turned and leveled it and he took off. I have NEVER been so glad in my life! My legs were so shaky I could hardly clutch my car and my hands were a little numb. I have never had a blast of adrenilin like that. And not in a good roller-coaster way. It was terrifying.

[Lonegun1894]

Sasquatch,
Not at all. Dont get me wrong, I didnt enjoy it, and would rather not do it again, but at the same time, it gave me a different perspective on things and in the end, like anything else, I would rather people learned from things others have gone through than have to go through it themselves and have no frame of reference or idea of what has or has not worked for others in the past. I figure my life was saved several times due to mistakes others have made throughout history, and many vets (among others) here wouldn't be here now if that knowledge hadn't been passed on to us in training, and I have made enough mistakes in my life, that I just hope someone learns and benefits from my screw-ups at some point, or they're worthless. There's some things that I won't share on an open forum, and some that I will probably take to my grave, but those are the worst times that I would rather no one even had to think about. Some here will understand what I mean, and those that don't, I hope never will. So don't worry about digging up anything about my past, as with a few exceptions, I don't mind sharing if it will benefit anyone here. It has had it's effect, but we all have our ghosts that we live with. And if you hit on anything that I don't think belongs on open forum, we can always PM. So here's hoping it never happens to any of us again, but if it does, may the good guys win--and if you're by my side when the excrement hits the rotating oscillator, we're going home to our loved ones at the end of the day.

[ilcop22]

I had a couple of off duty incidents while I was travelling in Chicago come to mind, but I opted to keep it concealed and exercise gerbil voodoo and/or keeping my head on straight, as the situations didn't warrant deadly force.

[supe47]

Only once. A couple of guys peaking my window at 10:00 at night. Turned out to be a group of OCS candidates who "wondered off" the compass course. My domicile bordered FT KNOX in a town surrounded by same. Funny how the short barrel of a chief special S&W can point you in the right direction.
Supe

[danski26]

Yes...too many times to remember exactly how many. However, my choice has been the combat arms professions for the last 18 years.

[dsol]

I was almost 15 years old the first time.

We had just moved into a new house a few months before and I was home alone sick as a dog with the flu. Was asleep in my room when I heard somthing and the dog started barking. Wandered around in a stupor for a minute or so and heard a voice telling our dog to shut up come from the basement. Glanced outside to the driveway and didnt see either of my parents cars. Grabbed dads nice shiney nickel Model 19 from the closet and went downstairs to investigate.

Yep... not bright, but I was sick and only 14.

Came around the corner and put the front sight on some guy looking in a cabinet and asked what he throught he was doing.

The meter reader just about **** his pants.... we had an inside meter for the natural gas. Back in those days, the readers had keys to houses, and would come in to read the meters. I had no idea, was just scared and not quite coherent either. The gas company paid to have the meter relocated to outside the house soon thereafter.

[big dale]

Well, I didn't draw a gun, but after I pulled an axe out of the glove compartment of my VW those two guys decided to leave that bar parking lot. I guess I would have got my butt kicked if I was not close enough to my car. This was several decades ago and there were no carry permits in Texas back then.

Big Dale

[waksupi]

Only pointed a gun at one guy. Didn't shoot him.
However, I did scalp a hippie that robbed my place years ago. Hide and hair. Does that count?

[Oreo]

A few times I... Oh, wait, that's right, I live in a state that mandates I be a good victim and not carry a gun lest I reduce the customer base for the defense attorney scum running the state legislature. Never mind, carry on.

Moving stories from all of you though.

[fatnhappy]

A few times I... Oh, wait, that's right, I live in a state that mandates I be a good victim and not carry a gun lest I reduce the customer base for the defense attorney scum running the state legislature. Never mind, carry on.

Moving stories from all of you though.


Thank you for visiting NY, we need your tourist dollars to prop up our defunct welfare state.

I digress.

To answer the OP, several times. Discounting military service with doesn't equate to the question, I've been a couple pounds shy of seeing a jury on 2 particular occasions. In both instances I would have prevailed, even in my home state. Beyond that, everyone else seems to have better stories

[Marine Sgt 2111]

Three times as a civilian, more as a Marine in Iraq. As a civilian, the most recent was someone on either drugs or drunk who tried to run me into a cement divider on the freeway, a .45 auto resting on my door window ledge calmed the other driver down.

The next in line was a crack dealer in Detroit who I accidently happened on in an alley and didn't like the sight of me in his business district. He was reaching under his jacket, the sight of a .45 stopped him and something about me saying "move and you'll be dead before your knees buckle."

The first civilian encounter was when I was 20, carried because I was on a trip on my Harley and felt I needed to. I pulled into a motel for the night and I heard some noise just outside of my room. Someone thought that I didn't need the bike as much as he did, a charter arms .44 spl settled that account with me uttering "don't let your feet fail you now."

Iraq...I didn't use a pistol, a rifle worked just fine and I didn't need to have to say anything...

[9.3X62AL]

only pointed a gun at one guy. Didn't shoot him.
However, i did scalp a hippie that robbed my place years ago. Hide and hair. Does that count?

o m g....... :)

[Tom W.]

Well, I did use my .44 mag. once to shoot a big Rottweiler at about three feet as he came to attack me one morning as I was going out to the truck to go to work. I had to be very careful and wait until I knew that the bullet would pass through the dog and bury itself into the ground. I was jumpy for months afterwards...
And another time when I was moving a refrigerator a pit bull came after me and I shot it with my .45.. It died on my boot...

[Four-Sixty]

I used to live in an older home in a run down part of Macon, Georgia that was converted into two apartments. The upstairs area, where I lived, actually had two entrances. One of which was kicked in at some time in the past so the door frame was cracked pretty badly. So, I always kept my Single Six with the Mag cylinder in it loaded.

I was at home in the afternoon and heard the door open. No knock. I usually kept it locked, but somehow it was opened. In the back of the house already, I grabbed my Single Six. I wound my way to the front of the house slowly. I listened intently to figure out what was going on. I heard the voices of two males. I pulled the hammer back and rounded the last corner to enter the large room they were in and suprise them.

Suprise them I did. They were two maintenance guys coming to check on the apartment. I lowered my gun and admonished them for not knocking before entering. Some foul language may have been involved. I don't recall. I certainly was mad at them for not announcing their visit.

I once had a teacher in High School who gave some advice that helped me prepare my reaction to this situation. He was a former Highway Patrolman and said that you want to condition yourself for stressful situations by "seeing yourself" react to them how you'd want to. In short, imagine yourself being confronted by a would be Robber and producing your weapon smoothly and saying some canned line. Before this happened I thought through about what I'd do if an intruder came into my home. I think it can be a huge help to you for many of these once in a lifetime type of stressful situations.

I'll take my chances with the District Attorney and a Jury. My duty is to protect myself and my Family.

[Jeff82]

Yes. I drew my gun and fired once. It happened really fast, and the shooting was the easy part. The hard part was the subsequent investigation and civil suit. I ran the gauntlet and prevailed over a process that took about four years to finally resolve. And, let's not forget about my fifteen minutes of fame on the news. This changed my life, but not all in a negative way. In my subsequent law enforcement career I drew my gun as a precaution a number of times, but never had another scrape.

Reading some of the responses to this post, I hope my comments will serve as a cautionary example. Whatever you do, you will need to explain in detail many times to an unsympathetic audience, and you really don't know how they'll see it.

My advice; use pepper spray and not a gun. If you carry a gun, also carry pepper spray..way more latitude, even if you screw up...way easier to explain afterwards.

[onceabull]

Carried concealed 8x6x25 wk/yr for about 12 years and never had to touch the weapon..less than 1 year after I left that job, daylight armed robbery(2 inside perps,and a "female"driver)..Did have to do the Chesty Puller thng on 3 characters that were going to evict me from"their blind" on public property.. was able to convince them that 3 on 1 was going to be a dogfall that morning,perhaps because two of the three still had decoy sacks on their backs when the discussion started... Onceabull

[Lonegun1894]

Fatnhappy,
the other stories may be more entertaining after everything is said and done, but having been through the investigations, explanations, etc, etc, trust me, and as Jeff82 said, it is a very long, drawn out, unpleasant process. So to me, the "good" ones are where there are no shots fired. Much easier to explain and the aftermath isn't nearly as interesting. Please don't get me wrong, use it if you have to, but just be sure that you really do HAVE TO.

A wise man told me years ago that sometimes, just because you can legally do something, doesn't mean you should.

[Silver Eagle]

Years ago (in my teens), I was living upstairs at my parents house. My room overlooked our backyard and alley. I was sitting up their looking at my computer monitor with the lights out. I heard some noise outside in the back and looked out. My Dad parked his car in the backyard on a cement slab and I noticed someone messing around by the gas tank.
I went downstairs and grabbed my folding wrist rocket (tubular band slingshot) and a bunch of ammo ( I used either 3/8" steel shot or lead shot of about OOO). Slipping out the front door, I crept around the side of the house and loaded it up, putting a few spares in my shooting hand. Seeing the individual trying to siphon gas out of the car I yelled "Freeze!" He looked up and said, "You're not going to shoot." A large dent in a 55 gallon garbage can a few feet away convinced him otherwise. He put his hands up and said, "Now what?". I convinced him to walk over to a neighbor that had their lights on. Knocked on the door while putting the slingshot in my jacket pocket, and asked them to call the police.
About 10 minutes later a squad pulled up and asked what was going on. I explained it to him, and he got a short confirmation from the punk. After cuffing him up and placing him in he back of the squad, he asked me how I stopped him. I shrugged and slipped the slingshot out of my pocket a bit. He looked down and said, "I never saw that."
Never heard about the results and never got called into court. There was a brief spiel in the local paper of a rash of gasoline thefts and before that, my Dad commented on how he was filling up the tank more often.
I would not have shot to kill, but a ball of that size to the leg would give someone one heck of a charley horse and slow them down.

[MT Gianni]

Yes I have.

[eric123]

Yes in the Middle East...Didn't really enjoy it...

[smokeywolf]

Wife and I were walking the original Smokeywolf one afternoon. Walked by a small, beat up pickup truck with a dirt bag (long greasy hair, tatoos & piercings everywhere) and a pit bull in it. Dirt bag gave me the stink-eye as we walked by. About 40 feet past said creep, my wife gasps, I turn, pit bull is charging us at full speed. Creep is standing by the open passenger door. Didn't have to draw my gun. I dropped Smokey's leash, took two steps back, Smokey sat down, rared back on his haunches, and with his front paws and his 135 lbs., slammed pit bull to the ground and wrapped his jaws around pit bull's neck. Dirt bag approached very carefully, and pulled his pit bull out from under my wolf after I cued Smokey to release him. Not another word was spoken.

In certain situations, a well trained dog or wolf makes a great deadly weapon because you can turn them loose, but still stop them short of killing. Once you release a bullet, you can't call it off.

smokeywolf

[bearcove]

Nope! The guys I work with say I look like I'm pissed off if I'm not laughing.

I've gone where I please, and nobody bothers me.

[Grandpas50AE]

Fatnhappy,
the other stories may be more entertaining after everything is said and done, but having been through the investigations, explanations, etc, etc, trust me, and as Jeff82 said, it is a very long, drawn out, unpleasant process. So to me, the "good" ones are where there are no shots fired. Much easier to explain and the aftermath isn't nearly as interesting. Please don't get me wrong, use it if you have to, but just be sure that you really do HAVE TO.

A wise man told me years ago that sometimes, just because you can legally do something, doesn't mean you should.

Lonegun, both of your posts concerning your experience and situation speak volumes of knowledge and wisdom, my hat is off to you. The biggest thing that comes through from several of the posters here including you is something I believe in whole-heartedly: make sure you HAVE TO before you actually DO. If one has to take another life (even in self defense), there is always the investigation and all sorts of other things to follow, but most importantly, a person will always have to live with the action taken. Most of the trauma I have seen from someone HAVING TO use dealy force is the long mental self-evaluation (or soul-searching) that happens afterward, when they think many times back on it and ask themsleves if there wasn't an alternative at the time they could have taken. Hope you don't have any more incidents as you described, and hope you are able to live in peace from here on.

G50

[429421Cowboy]

First time was when i was 16, in the oil town of Sidney, Mont, which had kinda been taken over by rig trash that usually follows the money, along with the drugs, dog fighting and other crime. We were there to look at a bull before an auction, spent the night in a really nasty old hotel, the Sunrise Inn, for $90 bucks a night and was glad to find a place. Packing our stuff up at 5am and getting ready to leave, a guy ran up to the people next to us and hit them up for money, man said no so he said something like he wouldn't leave a tooth in the mans head if he didn't donate, so he gave him cash. Started to head our way aimed at my mother, brother and i saw this so i pulled the Chief's Special out of the pickup while my brother stuck his hand in his Carrhart vest like he had a gun. Guy looked at me with the gun on one side of the pickup, Ma inbetween and my brother off to one side and slightly behind, shrugged and walked off. No sign of fear, just realised he'd be in a crossfire if he went after the little Armenian lady so he walked off. Somebody hassles my mother he's gonna catch a slug or a eye full of knuckles. I now am old enough to legally carry and do, but we also keep a can of bear spray in the pickup for cases like that. I was ready to do what it took that day but if there was a way to not kill somebody i would always take that first. I hear it's even worse out there now, i have dated two girls from Sidney and don't wish that lifestyle on anybody just trying to live there.

Second time was when i DIDN'T draw my weapon. Was in Great Falls at the mall to get reloading supplies, had my Super Blackhawk under my shirt IWB because i wasn't planning on stopping in town but took the chance to stock up, didn't want to leave my gun unattended so i kept it with me. Ran into a friend there and three guys i knew from the high school rodeo circut, talked to them and thought things were fine. Finnished our shopping, walked outside and was confronted by one of them, claiming he was gonna beat me down for saying bad things about his girlfriend, i told him she cheated on me so i left with no words said. He called me a liar and for that he was gonna have Colton shoot me, Colton carries a ".45 magnum!" "show it to him" Colton pulled back his shirt and showed a .45 Blackhawk. I was at a disadvantage in that i had my hands full and would never draw fast enough, plus a gunfight at the mall for such a stupid thing seemed out of the question, so i talked my way out of it. Last thing i said was to Colton, if you pull a gun you better use it, there are people on the west side of Great Falls that would have shot you dead for even saying you had a gun. The first clue you have that i have a gun is when i point it at your head, none of this "I have a GUN!" stuff. They left, i ran into him a week later with the same girl while i was out with two of my brothers, he shook my hand and was very polite. I thought to myself "now you're all nice when there is three of us and one of you? and act like i should forget what happened?". He broke his neck a day later in a car wreck and she dumped him for his friend while he was in ICU, all's i could think is that karma must really suck!

[Gelandangan]

Never,
even when I was a kid playing cowboys and indians, I was always the indian.

[Cariboo]

It took me a while to write this, as the way I tell it I had better not post. Back when I was 16, I was on my way to a place that I liked to camp driving my triumph herald (my buddies VW bug was a bit faster) when an out of state white Chevy impala with 5 gentlemen in it pulled alongside and started to force me off the road. So I reached into the backseat and pulled out a hatchet. They roared with laughter and shook a chain at me. I reached back and pulled out the machete. They again roared with laughter and presented a length of pipe. We were now down to about 10mph so I reached over on the other front seat picked up the Erma, grabbed the magazine off the dash slammed it home, pulled the toggle back released it leveled the barrel out my window. Well the laughter stopped the rear tires on that Impala lit up and it disappeared down the highway. No shots fired and I had a great weekend camping out with no aches & pains.

[429421Cowboy]

....However, I did scalp a hippie that robbed my place years ago. Hide and hair. Does that count?

Am i wrong or was it the Jersey Lilly in Ingomar, Mont, that offered free beer for a hippie scalp back in the day?

[archmaker]

Once - I was as close as you could get to it going bang, finger on the trigger - slight pressure, safety off, thinking I was aimed center mass - but not for sure. He dropped the rifle before he turned around. I would have shot, but even to this day, it chokes me up how close it was.

I was raised to respect a gun, never point it at anyone, and gun safety was DRILLED home (my dad, lost his brother, as kids. Shooting accident, by the older brother, with the baby brother (7yrs old) falling at my dad's (11 at the time) feet). I can say that it was for me an unnatural act.

If I had to do it again I would, I just don't want to be in the postion ever.

[Ken73]

Twice.

Once had a drunk come to my door at midnight (at my old place) and beg me to let me in, and that "my old lady" knew him. I had my 1911, she was in the shadows with hers pointed at his chest. I finally convinced him he had the wrong house and he profusely apologized and left without incident. He never knew how close he came to being shot if he had tried to step in the house! (He was getting a bit pushy.)

Second time turned out to be a bit embarrassing; had what I thought was a trespasser zipping around my property on an ATV late at night, no idea who he was or what he was doing. Only had my little pocket gun with a laser on me, so I trained the laser on his ATV to let him know I meant business. Turned out to be the guy who leases the land behind me, had a few cows get out. I apologized profusely! LOL He said "I saw that little red dot on my ATV and figured I better go let you know who I am!"

Didn't like doing it either time, but was prepared for either. Glad I talked to both guys rather than shooting first.

[fatnhappy]

Fatnhappy,
the other stories may be more entertaining after everything is said and done, but having been through the investigations, explanations, etc, etc, trust me, and as Jeff82 said, it is a very long, drawn out, unpleasant process. So to me, the "good" ones are where there are no shots fired. Much easier to explain and the aftermath isn't nearly as interesting. Please don't get me wrong, use it if you have to, but just be sure that you really do HAVE TO.

A wise man told me years ago that sometimes, just because you can legally do something, doesn't mean you should.


Thanks for the thoughts. I've seen the elephant twice, tyvm. Infantry. Like I said, my stories aren't that interesting, just a couple of dirtbags that needed coaching on being better citizens.

[Bob in Revelstoke]

I was a policeman for a little over 35 yrs and when I had been on the job for a few years back in the late '50 we walked a beat and spent time shaking hands with doorknobs. There had been a number of B&Es and the night in question I was on my beat when on trying a door it opened. I went in quietly and had a look around. The batteries in my flashlight were getting low and I remember too well seeing a wild eyed maniac pointing a gun at me. I had my Model 10 in my hand and was pulling the trigger when I realized the wild eyed maniac was me reflected in a full length mirror on the back of a door. I have often told the story and got a good laugh from it, but at the time it was a different story. That was the only time in all those years I actually had my gun out. I had it handy on other occasions but those days were different somehow. Oh, turned out the owner forgot to lock the door.

[km101]

In 7 yrs as a LEO i probably had to draw my weapon 6 times. Never had to use it but once. Did not have to take a life, and that's fine with me! But if you carry, as a LEO or civilian, you had better be ready to use it and have the mind-set to follow through if necessary. If you are not prepared to use it, when ABSOLUTELY necessary, it is more of a danger to you than it is protection.

Never draw a firearm if you are not prepared and authorized to use it. Blut if it becomes necessary, use it effectively and don't stress over it.

[Ernest]

I have enjoyed the thoughtful posts on this subject. A couple of points that occurred to me.

I am always impressed with how often having any form of deterrent such as pepper spray, a dog or a gun or even a big flash light combined with an attitude of, I want to disengage but I will fight, will stop a situation from escalating. Usually with the out come that every one goes home alive. A good Flashlight and pepper spray is a not good But a great idea. The one time I had to pull a gun saved me from a savage beating or possibly death. Every one went home healthy and alive but two young toughs were very very close to death at one point.

As pointed out by the people who have been there, every bullet fired in anger, has at least 2 lawyers attached to it. A prosecutor to prosecute you, a defense attorney to keep the prosecutor from putting you in jail, usually an attorney who is trying to make you wholly and completely responsible for the welfare of the poor helpless innocent that you shot, an attorney that is trying to keep that from happening etc. It is a mess. And it is going to be very very expensive if you have any assets at all.

I can't help but give out unsolicited advice. If you do have to shoot to save your life do what ever you have to to stay alive. Then be the first to call the police and when they show up say something like " thank god you are here, that man tried to kill me" give the officers your ID then do not say another word until you have a lawyer. Every word you say will be repeated to a very unsympathetic group of people who will decide how the rest of your life goes.

One last bit of advice from John Farnam. " I will give you a secret that will show you how to win every fight. It's simple.. When the fight starts don't be there!" Be home with your family or at work or at church etc. :p
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[fatelk]

This has been a very interesting thread to read. I personally have never even come close to having to use deadly force. I hope I never do.

After moving away from the town I grew up in (near- actually; I grew up on the farm out of town) I read in the paper about an incident that happened in my home town. A homeowner woke up at 2am to hear violent pounding on his door, and "You let me in woman!!!"

He jumped out of bed and ran out the back door as the front door shattered and broke in. Police arrive to find the suspect sleeping on the couch. He was plastered drunk, at the wrong house, and thought his woman had locked him out. It caught my eye because the intruder was someone I knew, and he is one big, scary looking guy! "Big John" used to work for my dad, and was always super nice to me or my folks.

The article ended by saying that the homeowner had the charges dropped because the intruder agreed to come replace the door the next day. He would have been well within his rights to have shot him but it ended better this way.

I just hope I'm never in a situation where I have to make that life-or-death split second decision.