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View Full Version : Steel sizer V carbide sizer ?



gray wolf
08-12-2012, 08:10 PM
I am asking in regards to the 44 mag. but I guess it could apply to other calibers. OK, the ? is why do some people make statements that they like a steel sizer for some cases, over a carbide sizer.

Mk42gunner
08-12-2012, 09:48 PM
Because a steel sizing die more accurately matches what the cartridge is supposed to look like. The carbide die just has a short ring that squeezes the bejesus out of brass, usually way under what is needed for appropriate neck tension on the loaded boolit.

That said; I still use my carbide dies.

Robert

MtGun44
08-12-2012, 11:32 PM
Carbide is perfect for straight cases, no disadvantages that I can think of, only the
advantage of not being damaged by dirty brass (altho I tumble 99% of my brass before
reloading) and PRIMARILY not requiring case lube.

The problem is with SLIGHTLY tapered cases. The worst is .45 Long Colt (yes, there was
a Short Colt, let's not get sidetracked) because the cylinders in original old Colt SAAs are
significantly but slightly tapered. To get proper neck tension with a straight sizer die,
you must will reduce the diam of the rear much more than is necessary. This damages the
case and lets the cartridges rattle around in the cyl at the rear, degrading accuracy.
I bought an old steel sizer die set (RCBS) that is tapered and I like it more than my Lee
carbide die set for this cartridge. 9mm has a bit of a problem, too, although it is so short
that with a taper in the normal carbide ring, it kind of works OK.

Modern chambers and dies are converting the .45 LC to a straight case or nearly straight case
- maybe a good thing if you only have Rugers and carbide dies, not so good with other guns,
depending on the vintage and maker.

Bill

gray wolf
08-13-2012, 10:42 AM
Thank you men for being helpful, I asked cause I have been using an old Lyman Steel die to size my 44 mag. I think I like it, it seems that it does not size the cases down as much as the carbide die that was so graciously lent to me.
With the set up that was loaned to me, the sizer would size the 44 mag brass so it was .450 when measured on the outside of the case, the expander button was .427 and the inside of the case came out also .427
Now with the steel die the I D of the case is .427 without the expander die being used. So this tells me the steel sizer is not sizing the case as much as the carbide sizer. Is correct so far ?
My bullets are .432 so I think I need to get the inside of those cases to be about .429 .430 that should still give me enough hold on the bullet and ensure I am not deforming the bullets when I seat them.
I have some larger expander buttons coming to me so I think I am on the right track.

koehn,jim
08-13-2012, 01:35 PM
The only dies I use for 44 are carbide, they are so much easier and I have not seen any problem with case life. I have shot a lot of cast and have no problems.

deltaenterprizes
08-13-2012, 03:26 PM
Old steel dies are square mouthed as opposed to new carbide dies that are radiused for use in progressive presses. The square mouth sizes closer to the shell holder than the radiused dies. I picked up an old steel 9mm die when I had a match chambered gun so I could get tighter sized brass to fit the match chamber.

Wally
08-13-2012, 03:34 PM
Carbide is perfect for straight cases, no disadvantages that I can think of, only the
advantage of not being damaged by dirty brass (altho I tumble 99% of my brass before
reloading) and PRIMARILY not requiring case lube.

The problem is with SLIGHTLY tapered cases. The worst is .45 Long Colt (yes, there was
a Short Colt, let's not get sidetracked) because the cylinders in original old Colt SAAs are
significantly but slightly tapered. To get proper neck tension with a straight sizer die,
you must will reduce the diam of the rear much more than is necessary. This damages the
case and lets the cartridges rattle around in the cyl at the rear, degrading accuracy.
I bought an old steel sizer die set (RCBS) that is tapered and I like it more than my Lee
carbide die set for this cartridge. 9mm has a bit of a problem, too, although it is so short
that with a taper in the normal carbide ring, it kind of works OK.

Modern chambers and dies are converting the .45 LC to a straight case or nearly straight case
- maybe a good thing if you only have Rugers and carbide dies, not so good with other guns,
depending on the vintage and maker.

Bill

I did the same--bought a RCBS steel .45 Colt sizer die...as you mentioned, makes a big difference. Looking into the Ruger BHK .45 Colt cylinder one can see the taper at rear. I tried to neck szie only with a carbide sizer, but could never size them all to the exact same depth. One has to be careful sizing with the steel dies as often the case lip will catch on the base of the die as it is not radiused.