44 Special Roundball

[Lobo55]

I have come across a free box of .433" Hornady lead round balls for muzzleloading I was reading some threads about loading .433 roundball in 44 special and would like to try it on a few loads. The gun is a new model Lipseys 44 special and the cylinder throats are tight I measured .429 with micrometer and the balls do not pass through the cylinder throats when I drop them in and they sit right at the equatorial line when I drop it in the barrel from the cylinder opening.
If I seat the roundball in the case without flaring the case mouth will enough lead get shaved off to shoot safely in the gun? Can anyone recommend a load for this with Accurate no 5 powder?

Thanks- lobo

[beagle]

You might try sizing them in a sizer and get better result......or expand the case mouth, seat and lay a slight crimp on it and see if they chamber and that no lead is shaved.

I've messed with 2 ball .44 Mag loads but I sized mine beforehand. They're fun./beagle

[1Shirt]

Like Beagle says! They are fun loads, but I also size mine. Suggest you read the article that Beagle wrote on multi loads, it is excellent!
1Shirt!

[shooter93]

Frank Marshall ran them through a sizer to give them sort of a flat side which you could crimp on either tapered or a very slight roll. If you dig up his old stuff he used round balls a lot.

[Piedmont]

Lobo, Just load normally. Flare the case mouth so nothing shaves off. Give them a light crimp. They should chamber fine. When they come out of the cylinder upon firing they will be sized to that diameter. There is no danger.

You will probably be better off with a faster burning powder than AA#5.

[a.squibload]

Agree, only about 1/8" of the ball will contact the barrel.
We used to seat the ball flush with the case mouth,
that is the ball is all the way in the case. Didn't seem
to need a crimp. Scrape the case mouth on a lube stick
and you're good to go.

[kbstenberg]

My Lee RB is just a hair large. I have to run them through the sizer or they won't enter the cylinders on my Red Hawk. When using Unique there is a mager difference in velocity when switching between 1 and 2 balls with the same charge.

[Lobo55]

Agree, only about 1/8" of the ball will contact the barrel.
We used to seat the ball flush with the case mouth,
that is the ball is all the way in the case. Didn't seem
to need a crimp. Scrape the case mouth on a lube stick
and you're good to go.

I am not sure what you mean 1/8" of ball will contact the barrel? Is that when you have the load chambered?

[mdi]

I've loaded round balls (are there any square balls?) in .44 Magnum cases to shoot in my Ruger SBH. I found a mold that drops .433" balls cast from WW which was originally for my Wrist Rocket. The cylinder throats in my Ruger measure .431" and I didn't size the balls at all. I rolled them in alox and seated them just below center and used a very light crimp (Redding profile crimp die). I started with 3.7 gr. W231 but I've used up to 4.0 gr. W231. No recoil in my SBH w/7 1/2" bbl. and just a "pop". I have gotten 2" groups @ 15 yds.

[Wayne Smith]

1/8th of the ball in contact with the rifling as it goes down the barrel, I'll bet he meant. I think that's a little generous, in fact.

[runfiverun]

actually there is square.
what they used to call swan shot was sheets of lead about 1/4"-5/16"s thick cut into squares.
anyway if a loaded ball will chamber it will fire just fine.
i'd try 7-8 grs of the #5 to start.

[a.squibload]

1/8th of the ball in contact with the rifling as it goes down the barrel, I'll bet he meant. I think that's a little generous, in fact.

Yep, we recovered a few fired balls, they had a thin flat
around the middle (equator?) with rifling marks.

[429421Cowboy]

I load .433 RB's in Special brass with 4.0 gr of Unique for a .22 like load out of my SBH which shoot pretty darn good. I seat the balls as deep as they'll go to keep igniton consistant and always flare my cases. Too light a load will really ricochet so be careful! Kept my Ruger loaded with em these last few weeks in the camper at hay camp for shooting gophers and snakes around camp.
I also have loaded beagle's double ball load and it dang sure is fun! Slower to load but a good load for spotlighting varmits with.

[Lobo55]

Thanks to all who responded for the wealth of experience and information. I think I will go with mdi's load to start with and work up from there!
Lobo

[troy_mclure]

iv done 2 ball in the .44mag, in my sbh.
i size to .430 and put a dab of lube between the balls.
with blue dot it would give me 12" at 25yds.
i used clays and got real tight groups 3" at 25yds, but it was kinda slow.

[Jbar4Ranch]

Lobo, Just load normally. Flare the case mouth so nothing shaves off. Give them a light crimp. They should chamber fine. When they come out of the cylinder upon firing they will be sized to that diameter. There is no danger.

You will probably be better off with a faster burning powder than AA#5.

Ditto on all points.

.45's, but the same principle...

I use round balls a lot for one particular set of .45 Colt CAS guns, and have used everything from .451" to .457" with equally good results. The .457"ers noticably bulge the case, and sometimes drag on the chamber walls a bit when loading, so I normally use .454"ers. I flare the case mouth and often don't even apply a crimp, as long as the flare isn't severe enough to prevent chambering. The ball is seated almost flush with the case mouth (the rules say the projectile can't be seated below the case mouth) over 6.1 grains of Trail Boss (6.1 instead of 6 because that's what the Little Dandy rotor throws), then smear a bit of solid grease lube around the case mouth. This is an extremely accurate load in my 1872 Open Tops and chrono's ~850 fps.

[longbow]

Haven't done the handgun thing with round balls but have in my Marlin .44 mag.

I started with 0.440" RB's and let lead shave. They bulged the cartridge but chambered and shot well. Recovered balls looked quite good with a nicely engraved equator.

There is so little lead contacting the bore that I would bet it shaves or swages to suit without any issues... at least with sane loads.

I started out with Winchester 452AA and worked up a load to 10 grs. They shot pretty well with no pressure signs but accuracy was dropping off there. Also tried them over up to 10 grs. Unique with similar results ~ light recoil and pretty good accuracy.

Once I established that they worked I decided that a little finesse wouldn't hurt so made a 0.434" sizer. No noticeable difference in performance for the shooting I did but loading was easier with no lead shaving.

This was in .44 mag. and ACWW balls.

I am betting you will have no problems in .44 special if you start with a light load and work up. Sizing to suit the throats would not be a bad thing but if they chamber they should be fine.

Cheap on powder and lead, light on recoil, fun to shoot, acceptably accurate ~ what's not to like!

Hmmm, it seems to me that I may even have some RB loads in a manual for .44 special and/or mag. Let me look and see. If I do I will post the loads.

Longbow

[mdi]

Lobo, Just load normally. Flare the case mouth so nothing shaves off. Give them a light crimp. They should chamber fine. When they come out of the cylinder upon firing they will be sized to that diameter. There is no danger.

You will probably be better off with a faster burning powder than AA#5.

I've been loading some .432" balls for some "quiet fun" shooting my .44 Magnum revolvers. I load as any bullet; flare, and very light roll crimp. I rolled them in some thinned alox and I seat them just below center and start the "crimp" just enough to slightly round the corner/mouth. I've been using W231, about 4.0 gr. in magnum brass. I got 2"-3" groups at 15 yds from my Ruger SBH...

[longbow]

Okay then, here we go! Speer Reloading Manual #10 has .44 Special RB loads.

Ball diameter listed is .433" Speer (no surprise!)
Gub used is Charter Arms Bulldog

Loads as follow:

- SR4756 = 3.4 gr.
- SR7625 = 3.2 gr.
- Unique = 3.0 gr.
- 231 = 2.8 gr.
- 700X = 2.6 gr.
- Green Dot = 2.4 gr.
- Bullseye = 2.3 gr.
- Red Dot = 2.2 gr.

All velocities are right around 500 FPS.

Makes me wonder what velocity 10 grs. of 452AA was giving me out of the rifle (.44 mag remember).

I hope that helps.

Longbow

[Chad G]

Are you guys that are shooting the 44 special load with one RB-using any type of wad over the powder? We cast up about 200 RB's yesterday to give this a try.

[BAGTIC]

I shoot HTWW RB in rifle and pistol in several calibers. I don't use WW452 but RD or GD. In a 22 inch barrel (H&R) .357 Magnum with the ball seated all the way down on the powder velocity is 2000-2200 fps. These are very effective on ground squirrels at iron sight distances. 3 gr RD drops velocity to about 1500-1600 if you want to eat what you shoot. This is VERY quiet in a rifle.

I checked Longbow's 2.2 gr RD in Quickload in the .44 with a 20 inch barrel it could produce 800 fps but that again would require seating the ball directly against the powder. Seating it at the case mouth would drop velocity by 200 fps and result in a charge density of only 15%. Personally I don't see how that could produce consistent ballistics. In all my guns I have always used loads with a very high charge density, as near 100% as I can manage.

[Silver Eagle]

Been thinking about trying round ball in 45 ACP. What size balls do I need to use .451 or .452? Also, what are good loads for these? I do realize the action will not cycle with light loads.

[Chad G]

I did finally get a 5 rounds of 44 special loaded with 700X, that is a dirty powder I'll be glad when its gone. It shoots relatively high compared to the full house loads i've fired from the CA Bulldog. Recoil was nothing at least in my mind used to having to readjust my grip with 240gr rounds. Did get several ideas on this forum and the limited number of sites that mention loading RB.

I ended up making a wad punch to cut .433 card wads from "Twinkie/Rice Crispie like" boxes and using a .357 case to push them in as suggested by http://www.castpics.net/LoadData/Main.html the fellow that did the write up has inexpensive methods for making wads. I own a lathe and have tons of round bar laying around, you can also use a .500 dia bolt if you don't have rod stock it doesn't need to hardened. I made the punch from steel instead of old brass, either will work in a drill press if you use steel get a plastic cutting board from a dollar store.

Had a RB pop out because I didn't get enough crimp on it but I pushed it back in and fired it anyway. The card wad held the powder in the base of the cartridge despite the recoil from the other 4 rounds - the only things I would change is lubing the RBall's I forgot[smilie=1: for the first 5 rounds but I had no leading so I was okay and using a cleaner burning powder.

Be sure you have all of your brass trimmed to the exact same length this makes it easier when you crimp these buggers, I made 44 spl cases from 44 mag because they were given to me free of charge so they were all trimmed to length or below it :-?. I also purchased a Lee sizer die in .429 since the RB's wouldn't fit in the cylinder unless they were size appropriately. Next on my list to load up 2 RB's and make some shot cups for the fun of it.

[DLCTEX]

Been thinking about trying round ball in 45 ACP. What size balls do I need to use .451 or .452? Also, what are good loads for these? I do realize the action will not cycle with light loads.
I would go with the 452 ball if given a choice, but my mould drops .451 and works fine in my 1911.

[Mohavedog]

I'm intrigued by round ball plinking loads in .44 special or mag. Thanks to all the good advice posted. I have a question. Instead of seating the ball down on the powder or making and using a wad of some kind, why wouldn't a Dacron filler between the powder and ball work? It could easily be adjusted to fit the empty space and be a lot less hassle than making wads.

[John Allen]

I'm intrigued by round ball plinking loads in .44 special or mag. Thanks to all the good advice posted. I have a question. Instead of seating the ball down on the powder or making and using a wad of some kind, why wouldn't a Dacron filler between the powder and ball work? It could easily be adjusted to fit the empty space and be a lot less hassle than making wads.

This is what I was thinking too. Hopefully someone replies that has done this.

[Michael J. Spangler]

Subscribed for updates.

[Chad G]

I fired off 25rds of the RB boolits last weekend. I had severe powder fouling and leading (I know it was supposed to lead up after a few dozen rounds) which leads me to believe that the ball turns side ways between the case and forcing cone upon firing, I found reminents of RB lead in the cylinder, made it nearly impossible to get the cylinder open. About 30 years ago my Dad had a similar issue in his Dan Wesson 357mag where a piece of copper caused a barrel to split, knowing that I am not risking damaging my CA Bulldog that I waited so long to acquire. I have no reason to load 2 RB in the case that would be no different than firing a 240gr boolit.

I did experiment with 3grs of Clays which resulted in a pushed out primer on one case and stout recoil on the second case also it didn't burn completely leaving about 50% more unburned powder in the barrel compared to 700x. Also did 2.5grs of Zip which was nicer than the previous loads but the case volume used was so little that you'd swear up and down that the RB would never leave the barrel, Zip left no unburned powder. Regardless of the loads and such the RB boolits ricochet really bad and I shot mine in the soft silty sand in the desert.

[blackthorn]

I am trying to get my mind around how a ROUND ball turns sideways?

[BAGTIC]

Are you guys that are shooting the 44 special load with one RB-using any type of wad over the powder? We cast up about 200 RB's yesterday to give this a try.


Don't need an over powder wad if your ball are big enough. If they are groove diameter or larger they will swage down to seal the bore.