Swage down a Ness safety bullet to a hollow cavity?

[Elkins45]

I see that Miha has a couple of the Ness safety bullet molds left over. I'm thinking of picking one up just for the fun of it, but I was wonderting about the possibility of making it a little more ballistically friendly by making a swaging die that turns the nose in a bit to add some taper and streamline it.

Here's the bullet:

http://hgmould.gunloads.com/molds/ness.jpg

I think I could build a simple die body and insert a lubrisizer nose punch of the desired profile, with an ejector rod sticking out of the top. I could use my reloading press to shove the bullet into the die like a Lee sizer, but it would stop against the nose punch and swage down the tip. I could then whack the ejector rod and spit the bullet back out.

Your thoughts?

[MikeS]

It's been done in the past. I read some of the old articles about the Ness boolit, and in it they were swaging the nose on some of them quite a bit, making them much more pointed, but with a huge hollow point, and they found that it didn't effect the boolits ability to basically disintegrate when it hits, so it can functions the same as it did when used as cast.

[longbow]

Read about it here:

http://www.sodcity.com/gallery2/view_photo.php?set_albumName=Moulds-etc&id=Dope_bag

Just in case since I have had trouble with the saved link, here is the post (#76) from georgewxxx:

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?t=126732&highlight=ness&page=4

Longbow

[beagle]

You can use a round TP and turn the edges of the ogive a little during sizing. Enough for reliable feeding but you can't overdo because the nose will be expanded out of specs and it will be hard or imposible to chamber. I've always gotten excetional accuracy out of that bullet in the 06./beagle

[Elkins45]

You can use a round TP and turn the edges of the ogive a little during sizing. Enough for reliable feeding but you can't overdo because the nose will be expanded out of specs and it will be hard or imposible to chamber. I've always gotten excetional accuracy out of that bullet in the 06./beagle

Do you have the plain based or gas checked version?

[ku4hx]

I thought the idea was essentially an inert dummy round that when chambered allowed the gun owner a chance to take the gun away from a kid (or whoever) before they could chamber a live round and hurt somebody. http://www.safetybullet.com/

Reconfiguring the nose, and re-purposing the boolit aside, how many of these "safety" rounds would you need to necessitate getting into casting them? Why not just load a normal bollit with no powder and a spent primer in the pocket?

Or are we talking about boolits that disintegrate upon impact thus severely limiting penetration?

[Elkins45]

Or are we talking about boolits that disintegrate upon impact thus severely limiting penetration?

We're talking about this. Take a look at the photo in post #1.

[runfiverun]

you'll want a hollow point stem on the nose of the punch.

[georgewxxx]

The amount of pressure you apply while sizing and the how soft your lead is to a lesser extent had a big part on how the mouth ends up, in or out. Often times I used a .22 or similar nose punch and placed a fired .32 auto or S&W short case and used that to keep "Ol Nessie" going down straight. If I wanted to experiment and close up the nose portion, I used a punch intended for a 358311. You can shape it to a round nosed if you push hard enough. Pressure felt on the sizing press handle is a learned exercise on boolit distortion. You might have to sacrifice a few to get it how you want. Yeah, do like Longbow said, read up on it before you start.

[Elkins45]

I have to make a .300 die anyway to salvage a poor mold design I had made. If I have to I could just shove the nose up into it after the nose has been swaged.

[ku4hx]

We're talking about this. Take a look at the photo in post #1.

I did, but how is that a "safety bullet"? Looks like a regular lead alloy boolit to me with a very large nose cavity.

[Elkins45]

I did, but how is that a "safety bullet"? Looks like a regular lead alloy boolit to me with a very large nose cavity.

The creator called it that because it was designed not to ricochet. It was originally conceived as a lead bullet for varmint hunting.

http://www.sodcity.com/gallery2/view_photo.php?set_albumName=Moulds-etc&id=GP

[35remington]

ku, read about the bullet in the link provided for you in post #3. The shape of the bullet makes it extremely obvious why this is called a "safety bullet."

I'm a little surprised why you're still confused.

[MikeS]

I thought the idea was essentially an inert dummy round that when chambered allowed the gun owner a chance to take the gun away from a kid (or whoever) before they could chamber a live round and hurt somebody. http://www.safetybullet.com/...

After reading this message, and going to the website, at first I thought it was a stupid idea. Then after going to the website again, and doing more reading, and seeing how it works, I think it might actually be on the right track. However I do see a BIG problem with it. Below is a copy of an email I sent just now to the folks that make this safety bullet. I'm curious what other folks here think of the perceived problem, as well as my solutions to it.




Hi.

I found your website thru a link on one of the shooting websites. While I think you have a good idea, I see one fatal flaw. So let's say I buy a safetybullet, and load it into the top most position in the magazine in my gun, which is where I believe you say it should be? Ok, so I now leave my gun loaded, but with a safety bullet as the top most bullet, and I can consider my gun safe, so I leave it in my top dresser drawer where I can reach it quickly in case I need to protect my family. Jr. has some friends over, and goes to show off my gun to his friends, racks the slide, points it at the wall, and pulls the trigger (Jr. wouldn't point it at one of his friends, he's been taught to never do that), and your safety bullet goes off, and locks the gun, like it should. Now Jr. puts the gun back where he finds it, and being afraid of getting in trouble doesn't mention the incident. A few days later (or weeks, or whatever), at 2AM I hear my front door being kicked in, so I go to grab my gun, and to my surprise it's locked up solid! So now when I need my pistol to protect my family, it's locked up solid, and the bad guys come in and kill me & my family (including Jr. the one we were trying to protect in the first place)!

Considering that the safety bullet is a one time use device, perhaps including in the shell some kind of electronic beeping alarm, or alternatively a dye pack of some kind that would mark either the area around where the gun was fired (or should I say attempted to be fired), and/or Jr.'s hand, so it would be fairly easy that a safety bullet had been fired would be an easy way to solve this problem?

I personally don't live with any young children anymore, but hopefully soon I will have grandchildren to worry about, so I'm really interested in your product. As I see it, it has the beginnings of being a really good product, and with small additions could be a great one.

Please let me know what you think of the scenario I laid out, and if you have an answer to it, either with your existing product, or with a modified or added to one. Thanks!

Am I crazy, or is this a valid concern?

[Wayne Smith]

Two completely different devices for two completely different purposes. Unfortunately with the same name. Ness had it first!