Black Powder Loads for 7.62 X 54R

[buladean]

I am thinking of trying some black powder loads in my Russian M91/30 with cast .303 bullets. Does anyone have any black powder load data for the 7.62 X 54R?

[Wayne Smith]

Fill the case full of FFF or FF and settle or compress it a bit. Add a card wad or not, insert bullet and crimp. Try it with FFF and with FF and see which is more accurate. You shouldn't need a wad unless you need to protect the base of the bullet.

Make sure your lube is without any petroleum products - a simple Emmert's is adequate.

Clean your barrel throughly - copper fouling is murder on accuracy.

BP must always be loaded to a full case, no air space at all. Compression is variable, Goex seems to like it, reports consistently say Swiss doesn't like it.

[Buckshot]

.............I'll add, after dumping powder through a drop tube, vibrate settle powder. Either hold each case individually against the bowl of your tumbler or with the filled cases in a case block hold IT against the vibrating tumbler bowl.

If you don't consider it cheating, you might also try a bit of smokless against the primer and under the BP charge.

So far as I know the powder we have available to us that most closely mimics the several outstanding black powders of the late 1800's, is the Swiss make. Remember back then BP was the only propellant, and it had been developed to a very high degree.

..............Buckshot

[piwo]

I am thinking of trying some black powder loads in my Russian M91/30 with cast .303 bullets. Does anyone have any black powder load data for the 7.62 X 54R?

What bullet are you going to load over it? The original Black Powder cartridge originally developed for the M91 was a BIG, heavy roundnose bullet. Just curious.......

I've never slugged my M91, but my 91/30 is .309 land to land, .313 groove to groove. and my 91/59 is right on with the 91/30. I've not slugged either of the Fin's yet.... It's something I wanted to try as well, just don't have any moulds yet, and cant' decide what type to get. Something cast and modern, or something more in the original set........

[buladean]

The mold I am using is the Lyman #2660299; .303 RN,GC; 200gr.. My 91/30 is a Finn captured with a Russian one piece stock and Russian globe front sight. The barrel slugged at .311. I have a .313 and a .314 sizer. I also have Goex fffg and Dupoint ffffg black powder.

Thanks for the replies. There are several guys at my gun club who shoot Black Powder Cartridge rifles and they suggested that I should try black powder in one of my 7.62 X 54R's.

[jonk]

Well, while I don't see a problem, rifling for black powder is different from smokeless- i.e. Lee Metfords had different rifling than Enfields. I dunno if the Russians did this or not as I believe that the black powder was very experimental early on and was quickly switched to smokeless. Ergo, you may have to swab after every shot or two. I also wouldn't try it on a gun with a lot of pitting in the bore or cleanup could be a real pain.

I have had a lot of luck shooting BP out of my Nagant revolver actually, but never tried in a Mosin.

[DonH]

A duplex charge of smokeless can make the thing shoot cleaner but so will a small charge of 4F bP over the primer. I shoot BP Cartridge and have not done this myself but my shooting partner does it. In .40-65 he dumps a small charge of 4F then drop-tubes in the main charge of blended 2F and 3F and compresses the lot. With good lube he will shoot a 50 shot match with sighters without cleaning or blowtubing.

The new GOEX Express powder is worth considering in lieu of Swiss.

[Ricochet]

The Russians didn't briefly experiment with BP and quickly switch to smokeless; they didn't switch to smokeless till they also introduced the ~147 grain spitzer bullet in 1908. I think their bullet with the black powder was something like 208 or 213 grains, I can't recall exactly, it's in Barnes' Cartridges of the World, cupronickel jacketed, and as with the .303 it would have used a tightly compressed load of BP. I think the Russians had the .303 closely in mind when they introduced the 3 line cartridge, and I think the Americans did when the .30 U.S. Army was introduced as well.

Funny thing, how closely the Americans came to reproducing a rimless version of the old Mosin-Nagant round 65 years later with the 7.62 NATO cartridge. Wrap some sticky backed aluminum foil around the base of the latter and it can be fired in a Mosin. (Not recommended as general practice, but it's been done.) We came up with a "Chinese copy" of what the Russians had been shooting for three generations, at least. (And still use it, because it still works!)

[WineMan]

This has some good info on all of the 7.62x54R ammunition ever produced:

http://www.mosinnagant.net/i3tro4.asp