Aperture sights?

[Tatume]

Hello Folks,

I’m looking for a rear sight to go on a rifle I’m going to have built. The rifle will be in the style of John Rigby, and will be a small-bore (45 caliber) hunting rifle. My eyes will not accommodate barrel mounted open sights. Although I could use an off-the-shelf Marbles or Lyman tang sight, I don’t want the “factory” look. I’ve been looking at some vintage sights like the Lyman No. 30-1/2 for the Savage 99, and at some sights that are not common, like this one ( http://www.daytraco.com/Varner/sights.html ). I’m not necessarily committed to a sight that would have been on an original, but I want one that is “not like the usual kind” (to quote an old folk song).

I’ve also considered a ladder type tang sight, such as a Baldwin, Lee Shaver, MVA, or similar. However, I don’t need the ability to make adjustments often. The sight will be locked down and no adjustments will be made unless I change the bullet or powder charge. So, this type of sight is unnecessarily complicated.

Then there is the matter of the front sight. My Parker-Hale Volunteer has a globe front sight that I like very much. Although intended as a target sight, it makes a very good hunting sight. Davide Pedersoli makes a sight that looks similar, although it is a folding blade/globe combination. Anyway, I’m open to suggestion on the front sight too. I’m even considering a Lyman 17A, but again, I’m not sure of the modern factory look.

So, I’m looking for information and leads on sights. Although I’ve been talking to the builder, no chisel has been put to wood or file to metal. To me the sights are the most important component. Have you any ideas?

Thanks, Tom

[Nobade]

Found this on another site...Cunyard used to sell these sights, I don't know if they are still available in the USA or not. I think Pedersoli makes a repro version of it, or you could order one from England.

Start quote...........
The Goodwin long range tang aperture sight was designed by a Dr. Goodwin in the 1860s and produced by John Blanch & Sons, a London gun making firm. David's sights were made by British muzzle loading gunsmith Rex Holbrook and have markedly improved his shooting with the Volunteer, which has Henry pattern rifling. For short range (100 yards) David has "settled on a load of 70 grains of Swiss No. 4 [powder] with a thin card wad and a Lyman 457121PH 475 grain bullet." He intends to extend his shooting out to 1,000 yards and is currently working on loads to that effect.

The Goodwin/Holbrook tang sight is adjustable for both windage and elevation and features a screw thread of forty turns per inch. On a 100-yard target, using a gun with a 39-inch barrel, one turn moves the bullet's point of impact 2.52 inches. Holbrook provides a table with sight change results up to 1,000 yards with his sights. He also offers various front sight configurations, including one with a spirit level, to complement his rear tang.

Along with sights, Rex Holbrook provides a full range of muzzle loading gun manufacturing and restoration services. His underhammer target rifle was featured in a recent edition of the Muzzle Loaders Association of Great Britain Journal. Rex may be reached at April Cottage, 11 Mill Lane, Broom, Alcester, Warwickshire B50 4HS (Tel: 0789-778371).

[SamTexas49]

Take a look at the Marble "Bull's eye long" sight #006951, might be what your looking for ?

[451 Pete]

Tom and Nobade,

Nobade I am very sorry to have to be the bearer of some bad news in reporting this but Rex sadly passed away early last year in 2011. He did outstanding work and will be missed by many that shoot these fine rifles. I am not sure but I dont believe that anyone has yet picked up with his work on making sights.

Tom ,the Rigby pattern rifle like most of the muzzle loading rifles of that era has very little drop from the barrel to the stock as compared to a black powder cartridge rifle such as a Rolling Block or a Sharps. This can cause a problem in a sight setting too high on your rifle to be able to adjust down to 100 yds.

I would suggest checking with Buffalo Arms and Dave Gullo the owner. Dave shoots with the United States International Long Range Muzzle Loading Team and carry's a wide assortment of sights for use on both black powder muzzle loaders and black powder cartridge rifles. I would think that he would be able to help and possibly steer you make a good selection for what you desire in sights.

Just my thoughts .... Pete

[Boz330]

I've purchased 2 Marbles sights in the last couple years and I sure won't buy any more. Both went back to the factory and still didn't live up to my expectations.

I bought one of the interchangeable sights and the slop from side to side was close to .200". This was going on a hunting rifle and that sort of slop was enough to miss a deer size kill zone.

As Pete pointed out you may not have enough drop for that sort of sight but I would look at C-Sharps Arms website for their replica of the Ideal tang sight. It is very solid and is adjustable for windage, elevation as well as the staff angle. It is steel and in the ball park price wise of the Marbles and IMHO twice the sight. Down side is the hole spacing may not fit your spacing. But you can probably alter that which I had to do on the Marbles anyway.

BTW the Marbles is going to be replace with one of these sights as soon as money is right.

Bob

[Tatume]

Hi Bob,

The C Sharps sight looks nice, and I may use it. Thank you.

Take care, Tom

[Tatume]

Hi Sam,

The Marbles Bull's eye long" sight #006951 is an interesting sight. Thank you for pointing it out to me.

Take care, Tom

[Tatume]

Hi Nobade,

The Goodwin is certainly an interesting design. Thank you.

Take care, Tom

[ResearchPress]

Rex Holbrook has passed away. Please do not contact the address given for him above. Thanks.

David

[ResearchPress]

Found this on another site...
Start quote...........
The Goodwin long range tang aperture sight ........
Just realised the article you quote from is about me! Note also that it was published in September 1999. (see: http://www.civilwarguns.com/9909b.html )

As in my above post, Rex Holbrook has passed away (August 2011) and the specific sights referred to are no longer available. Pedersoli do make a variant of it, but other than the offset staff it bears no real resemblance to the original Goodwin sight (Rex's was an adaptation of it too, not a copy).

The only original Goodwin I have see had no graduations on it. It was designed as an orthoptic sight and to be used in conjunction with the barrel mounted rear sight and the foresight.

David

[oldracer]

As I had posted earlier, I could not see the front sight on the 42 inch barrel of the Lehigh 50 cal I finished a few months ago. I did not want to mount a tang type of sight but Track of the Wolf sells a rear dovetail sight that has a small hole. I bought one but had to make an adapter since it was too small to fit the dovetail which raised it too high so I had to then solder a small brass rod on top the front sight. It was great at 50 and 100 yards but the hole in the rear was too small as the 100 yd bulls eye over filled the hole.

So I made another dovetail base, cut a small groove in it and cut part of an old copper penny off and then soldered them together. Tested it at the range today and the larger hole was just right with a small amount of white showing around the edge of the bulls eye. I read some place that this was what was done in the distant past so it was okay.

[Good Cheer]

I really like using a peep on my New Englander.
I'm looking into making a tang peep that toggles front to back like a seesaw. One end short range, one end long range. And getting it to stay may be as easy as magnetizing it so either end will stick to the tang while the other end sticks it's tail up. But I'm just sketching it and taking pictures of the GPR and Renegades right now, looking at the angles and height of the sight plains. Might be a lot easier on the Renegade than the GPR.
Would be about the same as adjusting fixed sights with a given load, if it works. Might just be another goofy gadget.

[rmark]

'I'm looking into making a tang peep that toggles front to back like a seesaw. One end short range, one end long range.'

That would be similar to the flip up 'L' sight on some of the No.4 mk.1 Enfields.