Colt Python and cast boolits

[454gene]

I have a colt python like I would like to shoot more, 4 inch barrel and a double action to die for thanks to Frank Glenn in Arizona.
I read that the rifling in a python made some boolits more accurate but don't remember what kind. Lookin for something to shoot in the Harry Reeve's match at Camp Perry so there going to have to be good at 50 yds.
Also if anyone has a good load using Bullseye or Solo 1000 I would like to hear about that.
TIA

[Lance Boyle]

I'm just starting playing around with loads for my python, a 1961 4" blued one.
My Python cylinder bores are running around .359+/-. My barrel IIRC is a tight .357 groove. I have been sizing at .358 as that's what I have on hand at the moment. From anything I've read on loading cb's for revolvers is you match your cylinder diameter not so much the barrel. The rest will swage down to fit. The other thing I've read is with the python or the k frame smiths, use bullets that have the longer bearing surface such as the 158's and up to avoid damage (can't remember if it was just frame cutting or forcing cone cracking) The longer bullets get a better guide into the forcing cone than the shorter 125's which release the gas behind them before they are well into the forcing cone/barrel, and I think sometimes they might tilt and slam the forcing cone causing them to crack. I'm sure someone with a lot more revolver time than me can straighten us out on that.

I can't say I've done anything close to full load development yet. So far I've only loaded up some loads with trailboss and am getting about a 2" group at 25 yards.

My powder on hand for pistol is the trailboss obviously, bullseye, W231, AA#5, clays, and universal clays.

I too will keep an eye on this thread for tips.

[H.Callahan]

My 1973 vintage Python was my go-to gun when I was shooting Bullseye and PPC back in that era. Mostly shot cast 148-ish grain WCs over 3.0gr of Bullseye Powder. If I had to shoot longer than 25 yards, I would switch to cast 158gr SWCs with about 3.5gr of Bullseye or about 4-4.5gr of Unique. My Python would drive tacks with almost any reasonable cast load that I would put in it.

[GP100man]

The most accurate boolit I have is an old 357429 IDEAL mold ,but if memory serves me rite the Colts cyl is to short to accomadate it (GP100 cyl is 1.600) & will handle em with a little to spare .

Your next best bet is the 358156(155 gr. swc) but it carries a gas check (unless ya get Buckshot to remove the shank) or the 358477 (150 gr. swc)which has a big following !

The Lee 158 rnfp does good for alot of applications ,but some disdain it for having a beveled base.

I normally use the 357446 for general shooting , some have experienced less accuracy at lower loadings & the problem is Lyman has changed the original designs of this mold as they have with many .

I get the best accuracy if the front driving band is the same as the base ,but some cyl/throats have problems with this ,thus the changes.

I have nothing that shoots as good as the NOE 360-180 mold I have except the old 357429
Been tryin to put $$ away for a NOE 360-160 but it seems stuff comes up & takes it !!

:cbpour:

[rintinglen]

In my PPC days, I shot hundreds of pounds of Cast 148 grain wadcutters through two 6 inch Pythons. (Between 1977 and 1981 I smelted, cast, and shot a 33 gallon garbage can full of wheel weights--That I got for a six pack and a Pizza.) My standard loads were 2.8 grains of Red Dot or 3.0 grains of Bullseye with either a Lyman 358-432 or a Cramer 16H WC. I could shoot a 4 inch group with them at 50 yards fairly consistently.

However, the most accurate load I ever shot from either of those guns was a Speer 146 grain JHP over 14.7 grains of 2400--that load was scarry accurate. For years I had a 12 shot, 1 1/4 inch group, 25 yard Target hanging on the garage wall so I could show off to my friends.

[Cherokee]

My old Python was the most accurate revolver I had wih anything I fed it, jacketed or cast. I used .357 size CB's for it.

[MtGun44]

Lyman 358477, 358429 (if the cylinder is long enough) or RCBS 38-150-SWC (old molds will
be marked 38-150-K or KT) are superbly accurate designs. Lee 358-158 RF is another really
good design, in the LBT style. Use NRA 50-50 or LBT soft blue to start.

Read the revolver accuracy sticky and about slugging bore and measuring cyl throats.

Bill

[rintinglen]

:kidding:Bill, you're stuttering.

[bobthenailer]

The rifleing twist in Colts is better sutied for the better accuracy with 148 WC than S&W twist rate

[Char-Gar]

In the days of yore, target shooters would debate endlessly on the relative merits of Colt and Smith and Wesson 38 Special DA sixguns. There were differences;

Colt

1-14 left hand twist rifling
Barrel groove tended to run .355-.356
Cylinder throats tended to run .359
Cylinders rotate clockwise

Smith and Wesson

1-18.75 right hand twist rifling
Barrel groove tended to run .357 - .3575.
Cylinder throats tended to run .357 - .358
Cyinders rotate counter clockwise.

The debate was never settled, with Colt and Smith and Wesson fans just going to neutral corners. Plenty of matches were won with both makes and no clear winner emerged.

I favored the Colt Officer's Model Match, but did well with the K-38 as well. The Colt had a little larger frame and was a tad heavier. The scosh of extra weight is what I liked.

The matter of right or left hand twist of rifling is an interesting discussion. The Brits has always like the left hand twist and the rifle would twist/recoil toward the shooter rather than away or so the theory goes. No less personage than Harry Pope, through left hand was the way to go. US military and most commercial makers always went with the right hand twist.

I can tell the difference between Colt (LH) and Smith and Wesson (RH) twists, as the pistol recoils, or at least I think I can. It might just all be in my head.

[pdawg_shooter]

The Lee 358-158-Rf sized .358 for a very snug fit in all 6 throats. Groove diameter is a hair under .357. Shoots better than any handgun I have ever shot. It is a 4' blue.

[H.Callahan]

In the days of yore, target shooters would debate endlessly on the relative merits of Colt and Smith and Wesson 38 Special DA sixguns.
IIRC, a lot of the disagreement was barrel vs. action. Basically, a lot of shooters felt that the Colt barrels were better, but that Smith actions were better. That led to grafting Python barrels onto Smith frames. The results were dubbed "Smolts" or "Smythons". I got to shoot one once and have to admit that it was a dream gun. I suspect that the L-frame Smiths grew out of those guns.

Wish I had done one back when I could afford it.

[Char-Gar]

Python barrels were a little different than regular run of the mill Colt barrels. After the barrel was bored (and before the grooves were cut), a tungsten carbide ball was forced through, burnishing the steel. This was supposed to be the reason for the shooting quality of Python barrels.

Ordinary Colt barrels were broached rifled and that was it. Over the years I had 4 Pythons. Two 6" and 2 4". One of the six inchers would shoot rings around most any other sixgun. But the other three, were good, but nothing remarkable. I thought then and think now, that they were overpriced for what you got.

[454gene]

I should be receiving a NOE 358477 soon. Sounds as if this will be a good place to start.

[H.Callahan]

I thought then and think now, that they were overpriced for what you got.

Yeah, I paid $170 and PBM'd about it the whole time! :kidding:

Seriously, when they were being produced and easily available, although they WERE a bit more expensive than other Colt DA's, they were well worth the extra cost.

[MtGun44]

Sorry about the double post, no idea how it happened. I just deleted one of them.

I expect you'll be happy with 477, great design.

Bill

[tonyjones]

Bill,

You've had enough experience with 1911 pistols to know exactly how that happened. It's called a double tap.

I'm laughing with you, not at you.

TJ

[Old Caster]

I did extensive testing of SWC's for the Harry Reeves matches and also found that the Lyman 358477 or the RCBS 150 is as good as you could get. I like the quality of the RCBS mold much better as I do not get as many rejects. I tested a model 66, 14, 2 27's 2 28's and a Python with a bunch of store bought bullets. The 27's and 28's fit my hand the best and I wanted to use them but could never get them to shoot well no matter what bullet I tried. The 66 and 14 hit my knuckle with most grips I tried until I got a Pachmayer and it still isn't perfect but acceptable. The 14 was a small amount better than the 66 so it was my choice and shot the Lyman or RCBS bullet very well and were better than HBWC's in both guns. The Python was easiest to get accuracy out of and it was even accurate with cast 148's and HBWC's. The only reason it wasn't my choice is because it seems that the hammer is in the wrong place or it just doesn't fit my hand and was difficult to shoot the short line portion of the match. The two bullets can be very accurate but the amount of powder can make them from not so good to about 2 inches 10 shots at 50 yards. The only load I have found that isn't quite fast (830 or so) that is accurate is 3.5 of 231 with a softer lube. Hard lube had to be moved faster to be accurate. I tried a lot of powders but soon caught on that slower powder was easier to get accurate. These were all 6 inch guns so I don't know how that will equate to your situation but I feel that these two choices will be a good direction to go. Keep your alloy somewhere around WW or a bit softer and make every effort to make good consistant bullets.