Need help with installing gas checks

[jrinne0430]

I have cast some 45-70 bullets using Ranch Dogs TLC460-425F molds with Lyman equivalent type alloy (purchased along time ago from Midway). These are dropping out at .459 average.

Here is my problem, when using Hornady .45 gas checks and the Ranch Dog .460 sizing dies, there is not enough crimp to keep the checks on. Wondering if I am doing something wrong? Is there another method of keeping the checks on?

[gray wolf]

I think if the checks are crimped properly they should stay on.
Have you given thought to perhaps the shank is to small a diameter ?
Annealing the check may help. That's it for me--so lets see what the check experts have to say.

[stubert]

Roll up a peice of emery paper and open up the shank, it only takes minutes. measure the id of the checks and the diam. of the shank.

[koehn,jim]

I think a .460 sizeing die is to large, I use a .458 in mine. What is the bore diam. of the rifle. What diam are the boolits before sizeing. I would think that you need to size the boolits down to crimp on the check, you could also go to checks made from thicker material say
014 instead of .10 like most of them. Just my thoughts hope it helps.

[jrinne0430]

Bore slugged .458 (microgroved) and bullets drop from mold at .459 average. Wanted a larger diam bullet to bore but need the checks to crimp on and stay on. Can pull off checkes easily after sizing. I may have to glue them on but is time consuming. Did not measure shank...

[phaessler]

+1 on annealing ( gray wolf ) , AND opening the check shank diameter (stubert). I have done both, and have had it happen on other calibers.

I experience this quite often when sizing for my Marlin 1895CB, 0.459 +0.001 = 0.460", gets the check on, but not tight enough.

Pete

[jrinne0430]

How do you open the shank?

[giz189]

Just my 2 cents worth. I have four .45-70 and larger and I find I don't need a check on any of them.

[TomAM]

Hornady checks are .460" OSD, and so sizing them to .460" doesn't squeeze a crimp on.

It's not a problem, though. The check won't fall off of the loaded bullet because it's held by the 45-70 case.

When fired, it's pressed against the bullet base by thousands of psi, and upon entering the bore it's sized down to .458 and .452 (land diameter). It's there to stay.

[MikeS]

If your mould is dropping at .459 and you're using a .460 sizing die isn't going to do much. Try beagling your mould to make it drop a larger diameter boolit, and see if you still have problems. Don't forget as the boolit diameter increases, so does the gas check shank. As the Hornady checks are designed to be crimped on, when you place them on the larger shank, they will spring out a bit, then sizing them back to .460 should make them stay on.

[gray wolf]

I had a little problem also, I place the check on my bullet #429244 and all is well.
The bullet as cast is about .434
I run it through a .432 sizing die and the bottom of the check is fine-----
but the top of the check springs back to .433 and is to big for the cylinder throat.
At least I think it is, it wont go through and I don't no how safe that is.
If I anneal the checks all is fine--but I have not found a way to get even annealing of the checks. I have done a few with the small propane torch and I am finding it difficult to control everything.
I though about oven heating and slow cooling --but does the kitchen oven get hot enough ? Also I don't want to contaminate the food cooking

[felix]

Anneal the checks in a dual threaded pipe with caps on each end. Put toilet paper in the pipe with the checks to adsorb the oxidating air when the pipe gets hot. Put the pipe in the outdoor cooking smoker and smoke the pipe in lieu of food. No need for turning. Next day, the checks are dead soft and they should be clean as a whistle. ... felix

[TCFAN]

Anneal the checks in a dual threaded pipe with caps on each end. Put toilet paper in the pipe with the checks to adsorb the oxidating air when the pipe gets hot. Put the pipe in the outdoor cooking smoker and smoke the pipe in lieu of food. No need for turning. Next day, the checks are dead soft and they should be clean as a whistle. ... felix

I have done the above except I use the wood stove for a couple of hours. Just put the pipe in with a load of wood. Works good for me.

If using aluminum checks I put the pipe in my lead pot at 700 deg. for one hour. The aluminum checks come out dead soft................Terry

[gandydancer]

run the checks on the Boolits through a lee sizing die upside down (butt first) the checks will stay on.

[gray wolf]

If you use the pipe method with the two end caps
do you need any kind of vent hole in the pipe ?
Or just put the end caps on ?

[TCFAN]

I have not found a need for a vent hole. I just screw on the caps hand tight... .........Terry

[MT Gianni]

If you use the pipe method with the two end caps
do you need any kind of vent hole in the pipe ?
Or just put the end caps on ?

Not if you put paper in the pipe also. I would not use galvanized pipe because of fumes, cost and chance of a zinc mix somehow effecting the hardness of a check it touched but that is just me. If that is all you can find, just run it empty or with paper only the first time.

[44man]

Bore slugged .458 (microgroved) and bullets drop from mold at .459 average. Wanted a larger diam bullet to bore but need the checks to crimp on and stay on. Can pull off checkes easily after sizing. I may have to glue them on but is time consuming. Did not measure shank...
It is very hard to get a mold just right so checks go on tight. I have a RD mold that I need to seat checks with my press but have molds where they are too loose. I lapped them for a good fit.
It is just the shank where the check fits. It allows for check spring back.