im going to turn my MN into firewood

[jballs918]

well after this weekend of shooting it im at the point where im going to toss it in the fire. i have a problem where my shells are sticking after i shot it. it is to the point where i have to bang on it and half the time the bolt extarctor just lets it go. i have taken a 12 guage bronze brush to it like 3 times and still no luck. im pretty much at the end of my rope. any ideas from you guys before i sell the thing for like 70 bucks lol. thanks again.

jason

[Larry Gibson]

Are you using milsurp ammo?

Larry Gibson

[trooperdan]

It's your ammo; I'll lay you odds you are using some lacquer coated surplus steel-cased ammo. If you have scrubbed the chamber well (and it sounds like you have), switch to some brass-cased ammo. Winchester sells some S&B made ammo under Winchesters name.

[jballs918]

ok guys i have used milsur on these. i have tried copper washed and lacquer stuff to. i have had problems with both. and im really iffy on lying out the money for all the reloading stuff for it. but if you all think the brass will work i may have to try it

[piwo]

Here's a link to that discussion on another board. I hope this doesn't violate any forum rules and if it does, please just delete it. This is one of probably 60 threads that discuss this topic as it is the most common issue encountered on the Three Line Rifle (mosin nagant). http://www.russian-mosin-nagant-forums.com/smf/index.php?topic=6783.msg88043#msg88043

If this one doesn't do it for you, just search on "sticky bolt" and you will find A TON of threads where this is discussed.

I'm one of the admins on that forum and have posted links to this forum for others to follow when they had a topic under discussion here. The forum linked to has a "preservationist" stance when it comes to milsurps, so sportorizing topics aren't allowed. Cleaning, care and maintenance are of course all common topics of discussion. I only mention that because there are discussions here of projects with their MN, and while appropriate topics here, they are not there. It's a big world, and room for all. Mutual respect is never a bad policy:cool:

As I stated, if posting this link is taboo, Admins please remove.

[dk17hmr]

I did this to mine give it a shot might help you out. Suggested to me by another member here and I am very pleased with how much it helped my rifle out.

http://www.surplusrifle.com/shooting2006/improvingm44carbines/index.asp

[DaveInFloweryBranchGA]

Your chamber is the problem. Get the goo from the crappy commie ammo out of it and you'll be back in business.

Regards,

Dave

[Buckshot]

................Posting links to other forums for info, advise, safety and such is no problem at all.

...............Buckshot

[piwo]

Try the steam technique. Cosmoline that hardens turns into a clear "plaque" that is almost impossible to remove without heat. This also applies to the bolt mechanism. Take the bolt assembly completely apart and steam it as well... hell, boil the parts if you wish... Heat melts even prehistoric cosmoline. Heat is you ally here! Many guys who live in warm climates wrap their stocks in newspaper and leave in the car with the windows rolled up. The cosmoline melts and oozes out of the pours of the wood. This will also happen when you are shooting sometimes, the barrel heat will cause the cosmoline to melt and ooze out.

The Ruskie's drowned these weapons in the stuff because they were pretty sure they'd need them again to fight the west one day. Cosmoline will keep them in perfect hibernation indefinitely, but it is a MOTHER to remove, especially if it's turned hard. Please give it a try before you start cutting, filing and grinding: I think all your problems will disappear!

[dk17hmr]

I read about a guy taking a 3"(?) PVC pipe caping one end dropping the barreled action into it and filling it with kerosene, letting it soak fer a while, that would eat away the cosmline problem eh.

[Junior1942]

Ask your mechanic to let you wash it in his parts cleaning vat. The vat will even have a sprayer.

[wills]

Let it simmer a while?
http://www.brownells.com/Images/Products/082003664.jpg

http://www.brownells.com/aspx/NS/store/ProductDetail.aspx?p=1062&title=BLACK+IRON+BLUING+TANK

[jballs918]

well guys i ripped it part the other night and took a 12 guage brush and a propane torch to heat it up. i heated the chamber and then run the brush in it a few times. so hopefully this will help. i want to be able to make sure i can shoot the milsurp before i start casting

[jballs918]

i wonder if the thing wouild fit in the dish waster

[jballs918]

oh wills where did you find the vat at. i could use one of those

[scrapcan]

you can use a capped piece of pvc pipe and boiling water. hang on a wire or just drop in to capped pipe. Make sure your pipe is upright and held solidly in some way and pur boiling water into the pipe. You may have to do it several times. but it will work. And if you have a large stock pot and or a turkey fryer you can heat your water with that . DO NOT PUT PARTS IN YOUR COOKING POT IF YOU WANT TO COOK WITH IT AFTERWARD.

Make sure you protect your now clean surfaces because they will rust.

Easyoff oven cleaner will work also, but it is smelly and even more messy than boiling water.

[uscra112]

The most widely method for clearing gummed-up model airplane engines is soak 'em in hot antifreeze. Hardened castor oil may not be Cosmoline, but it's close! I have one simmering on the stove right now.

Anti-freeze will not let the steel parts rust, and it's an alcohol, so it's a pretty fair solvent at elevated temperature.

Wonder if it'll work on this stuff? Fortunately I do not own any of those old M-Ns, but if I had one I'd try it.

I use my dishwasher to clean old stock wood all the time. Use LOTS of the powdered kind of detergent, and set the water temp on HIGH.

The old-time auto machinists used to use a "hot tank", which had a strong mixture of solvents in it, one of which was creasylic acid. I doubt you can get that anymore, (our government minders having decided that we can't be trusted with anything that some fly-specked scientist suggested might be carcinogenic to .01 percent of the population if mixed in a cocktail and drunk daily for 1 to 3 years), but boy did it ever remove baked on oil and grease. It was kept at about 200 degress, and the whole shop smelled like creosote. So did the machinist, no matter how often he bathed.

[Ricochet]

A Turkish Mauser opened my eyes to how hard cosmoline can set up. I cleaned that thing thoroughly with gasoline and Hoppe's #9 on patches and a bronze brush, really scrubbing it hard. I could just see soft ripples where the rifling should be, in a shiny bore. I was really sad, because it was an otherwise nice looking rifle of the roughly finished "2x4" 1944 variety. I didn't bother slugging the obviously worn-out bore, but did stick a caliper in the end and measured the grooves at .336" x .338" at the muzzle. Tried shooting it with 1942 Turk ammo and couldn't keep it on paper at 100 yards. Cleaned it up and did that again a time or two. Actually got a spare barrel that wasn't a whole lot better looking, and tried to get the old barrel out. It was in pretty tightly and my barrel vise is one that's better suited for installing a barrel than removing a tight one. Thought applying a bit of heat might help, but didn't want to ruin the heat treating. Applied SAE 30 oil all over the receiver and stopped heating it when it started to smoke. Didn't help. So I heated the barrel, and figured I could get a bit more vigorous with it. Smoke came out of the bore, and some debris fell out of the breech. At some point while I was fooling around with it, I happened to look through the bore, and it had nice sharp rifling! I'd scorched out gummed up cosmoline that had filled the grooves, surviving all that scrubbing with solvent, shooting, and scrubbing again, repeatedly! The measurement I'd made was of a belled muzzle from cleaning wear, not a worn bore! The poor bullets were getting squeezed down to about BORE DIAMETER on firing and must have gone to way excessive pressures. That Turk is a sturdy rifle, and that dried cosmoline is stout stuff! If it's clogged up similarly on your chamber wall, it'll be hard to remove. I'm not recommending heating barrels and chambers smoking hot as a general solution.

I wonder if caustic solutions such as Liquid Plumber would remove the polymerized cosmoline? Won't hurt steel or bluing, and it's readily available. Easy to take the barreled action out of the stock, put the breech in a container so it could be soaked up to the chamber in it after a preliminary degreasing. Alternatively a cotton wad or tampon soaked with the caustic solution could be left in the chamber for a while, then cleaned. Worth a try. That might work with the caustic soap cleaners like Super Clean, Purple Power, etc. Or perhaps with plugging the bore and filling the chamber with foaming oven cleaner.

[trooperdan]

Now that is an interesting tip, using antifreeze as a solvent! I assume it is the original antifreeze, propylene glycol and not one of the newer permanent type, right?

I have seen the use of a dishwasher for stock wood but (my opinion) it is just too harsh. Anyway, cleaning and restoring an old military rifle is part of the enjoyment! I might use some Simple Green sparingly but my favorite to de-grease stockwood is mineral spirits, whiting, a plastic bag and a hot day!

[uscra112]

Yes, the glycol type. And it has to be hot.

I wonder if MEK would touch that Cosmoline? That stiuff will dissolve polyester resins used for fibreglass. Hard on yer liver, but you can buy it by the gallon in Home Despot.

Acetone?

Oh, I dunno - the dishwasher doesn't seem too harsh to me. I've done a dozen or more that way. The old timers told you to make a strong trisodium phosphate solution and use it boiling hot. Dishwasher detergent is principally TSP, and while the water ain't boiling, it IS pretty hot. MIL stocks tend to be too long to fit, though. What I really like is that it really gets the oil out of any cracks or splits, which makes gluing-up go much better.

[TAWILDCATT]

I have heard that (oven cleaner) will clean out the grease.
yes and that hot tank was great use it many times in Ratheon.

[TAWILDCATT]

I have heard that (oven cleaner) will clean out the grease.
yes and that hot tank was great used it many times in Ratheon.

[piwo]

well guys i ripped it part the other night and took a 12 guage brush and a propane torch to heat it up. i heated the chamber and then run the brush in it a few times. so hopefully this will help. i want to be able to make sure i can shoot the milsurp before i start casting
The thing is, if you load with brass that you will buy from Graff's (not the milsurp lacquered crap), you won't have the problem anyway. Getting it to shoot milsurp well first is a waste of time in my opinion. I have a little experience with these rifles and their barrels are all of such different dimensions, you may NEVER find a milsurp round that will shoot well. Some do, some don't. If you've cleaned her real good, buy some REAL brass, and cast for her with the correct size boolit for that particular barrel. Trying to make the ruski rifle shoots Czech silvertip is like asking the ruskie's today to play well with the Czech’s today. :???: Could happen, but ain't holding my breath!

Cast, load, shoot... I'm betting you surprise yourself with how well she shoots. 8-)

[twotoescharlie]

oven cleaner screws up the wood,not reccomended

TTC

[piwo]

oven cleaner screws up the wood,not reccomended

TTC
Good point. I read it that he was dismantling the rifle to do the deed... but if that's not true, by all mean, do not use the oven cleaner. Oven cleaner is one of the best stock stripping agents out there. I've used it several times with great result: WHEN I wanted to strip the stock!

[jballs918]

one great thing i dont mind about the musty is how easly it comes apart

[handyrandyrc]

Here is one other thing to check:

Back the front screw out a turn or so (on the underside). I had done everything you had, and still was having extraction problems. I had overtightened the screw up front, and it was making things difficult! I came from the "gutenteit" mentality with fasteners, and realized I was wrong in this case.

Just a thought, and something that fixed my Mosin.

[Ricochet]

Since this was mentioned here, I took a screwdriver to my M91/30, and the front screw was way tight. I backed it out and retightened it moderately. Just loaded up a few rounds, but ran out of time to get to the range this evening. Noticed it made the barrel rise up off the tip of the stock free floating, instead of touching it as it had been. Bet it shoots better.
:drinks:

[Ricochet]

Well, it sure does shoot well. I posted a group pic up in the Cast Boolits section. Action works mighty smoothly with brass cases. I didn't try any steel today.

[smokemjoe]

I like that wal mart stuff called purple power or cleaner, Works great on bores,Cleaning old gun stocks, ect. Smokemjoe

[Char-Gar]

Acetone and a good plastic scrub brush with take lots and lots of old oil, grease and cosmoline out of wood.

[nicholst55]

I did this to mine give it a shot might help you out. Suggested to me by another member here and I am very pleased with how much it helped my rifle out.

http://www.surplusrifle.com/shooting2006/improvingm44carbines/index.asp

Great info! I'll be working on my Mosin tonight!

[EMC45]

Acetone and a good plastic scrub brush with take lots and lots of old oil, grease and cosmoline out of wood.

Depending on the plastic brush that is. With Acetone you may end up with a pile of plastic goo.

[Bad Flynch]

I didn't read all of the replies, but here is additional information:

Most of these guns were arsenal reconditioned in the Soviet arsenals. At the time, they blued or parkerized the guns all over--including the chambers and bores. That is a very dark, rough surface and will not come off with a brush.

If your chamber were a little rough before the treatment, it would be even worse afterward; it does little real harm otherwise: the dark bores will eventually lighten up and the chamber less so.

Have your gunsmith lap the chamber with emery or crocus cloth, as long as it can be done without opening up the chamber excessively. That might just fix it.

I also have seen where some ammo sticks worse than others. The different countries, all part of the communist bloc, that made this ammo were not all equally good at it. Steel cased ammo may stick worse than brass cased ammo, etc., so try another maker for the ammo.

[omgb]

I used home made version of the Outers Foulout machine made from a flashlite and some steel rod. It really worked well. To clean the stock, I wrapped it in rags and put it in a black trash bag. From there I put it in my truck on the dash and rolled up the windows. Mother nature and the SoCal summer sun did the rest.

[Dead Calm]

I have used carborator cleaner on these rifles with some success. It just miche be the ticket for you!! Art

[exblaster]

did you ever try Ed's Red to remove cosmoline?
Exblaster

[JMax]

I would take a look at the chamber and make sure that it is not pitted or have gouges in it. I saw a K98 refurbed by the Russians that had a chamber with severe pitting and would not extract when fired. The barrel had to be replaced to get it into firing order. Use a flashlight w/bolt removed. Look down the breech end with the light shining into the chamber from the receiver bridge to look at the chamber. I suggest mounting the rifle in a cleaning caddy or in a vise otherwise you will need 3 hands.

[unclebill]

did you ever try Ed's Red to remove cosmoline?
Exblaster

yep all my milsurps get a eds red bath.
i chucked an old shotgun brush in a drill to clean my chamber

[corvette8n]

I have used boiling water poured over the stock to remove cosmo, do this several times and dry with paper towels and then let it sit in the sun, if any more oozes out repeat.

[omgb]

Since my original post, I hit on another method that works well. I got a cardboard box about 4 feet tall and about 16" across. I put the sock in this box and then added a drop light with a 150 watt bulb. I set this outside (in case things went poorly) and put the stock in it. I powered up the light and every couple of hours I removed the stock and wiped it down with paint thinner. It took a day or so but I sweated out all of the old oil and crap leaving the stock clean and dry. The plus side of this is that it's gentle enough that it doesn't fuzz the stock or induce any warpage. the temp in the box runs right around 150 degrees according to the BBQ remote roasting thermometer.

[waksupi]

Easy Off oven cleaner.

[Morgan Astorbilt]

Jason,
Does that 70 bucks include shipping? If so, you've got a deal.
Morgan

[sundog]

I've done Easy-Off, and it does work (very well), and it does leave scars on skin when it it is not washed off immediately. Don't ask. And don't get it in your eyes.

[Ricochet]

When I was a teenager working in the school cafeteria, I got Dow Industrial Oven Cleaner sprayed in my eyes. Basically just got a mist, not full force, but it sure got my attention and caused a trip to the eye hospital after I flushed them under the sink for 15 minutes or so. Be careful.