Kinetic pullers and primer failures

[soldierbilly1]

Did you all ever see a connection with these two items? I just pulled about 150 boolits using a kinetic puller. With the FWC's (38 spl, 148 gr) it took about 10 whacks for each boolit. I reloaded these rounds, using same primed cases, and many of them failed to ignite. They were Win SP primers. All my Federals fired perfectly fine. I was shooting my S & W M15 usually a reliable "hitter."
I could not help thinking the shock to the primers may have compromised the primer cake.
Anyone have any similar experience? this is weird.
thanks
Billy boy

It was 8/40 Wins that failed; all 20 Federals fired. Based on the primers appearance, the Winchester appears to be a harder primer.

[gray wolf]

Did the failed primers pop on the second try ? or did you not try again ?
I ask because there is a remote chance that the primers may have backed out from the pounding. Just a guess.

[soldierbilly1]

No, I tried firing them several times and they would not ignite. I pulled one, turned it with the cup side up, legs down, and smacked it on the cement and it popped. However, the pop sounded pretty weak. I really have nothing to compare it against. I also have no new Win SP primers to compare the anvil side appearance. Strange.

[Crusty Deary Ol'Coot]

Very interesting Billy

I can't answer your question, all I know is I've NEVER liked those times I used a hammer type bullet puller.

Finally when I bought a puller for the very few times I ever need one, it was a collet type, which for me has it all over the other type.

I bought the Hornady cam lock unit which just fine.

Keep em coming!

Crusty Deary Ol'Coot

[TJF1]

Could the priming compound be broken up under the anvil?
Terry

[trk]

10 whacks EACH with an inertia puller? You're braver than I.

[Bullet Caster]

I think that there is a little foil piece just over the primer compound under the anvil that has probably been shaken loose in the primer due to the many poundings to unseat the boolit. I think I read this on a thread in this forum. Do a search and you may find it.

I also use a kinetic bullet puller and have used it to unseat some .30-06 old military pre WWII cartridges that failed to fire. I usually had to rap the puller about 3 times to unseat the tarred-in bullets. They used some kinda black tar when seating the bullets to act as a waterproofing. It was hard to remove from the bullet and the case but with some mineral spirit soaks, they finally came clean enough to reload.

I usually rap the puller on our concrete floor and it usually only takes 3. On occassion I have pulled boolits from cases that were overcharged but it didn't seem to hurt the primers any. They all went bang. Of course I've used Fed., Win. and CCI primers and have had no failures on any primer. BC

[soldierbilly1]

I think that there is a little foil piece just over the primer compound under the anvil that has probably been shaken loose in the primer due to the many poundings to unseat the boolit. I think I read this on a thread in this forum. Do a search and you may find it.

I also use a kinetic bullet puller and have used it to unseat some .30-06 old military pre WWII cartridges that failed to fire. I usually had to rap the puller about 3 times to unseat the tarred-in bullets. They used some kinda black tar when seating the bullets to act as a waterproofing. It was hard to remove from the bullet and the case but with some mineral spirit soaks, they finally came clean enough to reload.

I usually rap the puller on our concrete floor and it usually only takes 3. On occassion I have pulled boolits from cases that were overcharged but it didn't seem to hurt the primers any. They all went bang. Of course I've used Fed., Win. and CCI primers and have had no failures on any primer. BC

When the bullets are sealed in, I read where they seat the bullet in further to break the seal and then pull the bullet. May be easier that way.
The FWC bullets are like icebergs; only a small portion is exposed! 90% of the bullet is in the case! yes, 10 whacks apiece. No exaggerating!
Brave?? Probably more stupid than anythng else. I do hear occaisonal reports that a primer can go bang using these kinetic pullers.
billy boy

[Cadillo]

I think that there is a little foil piece just over the primer compound under the anvil that has probably been shaken loose in the primer due to the many poundings to unseat the boolit. I think I read this on a thread in this forum. Do a search and you may find it.

I also use a kinetic bullet puller and have used it to unseat some .30-06 old military pre WWII cartridges that failed to fire. I usually had to rap the puller about 3 times to unseat the tarred-in bullets. They used some kinda black tar when seating the bullets to act as a waterproofing. It was hard to remove from the bullet and the case but with some mineral spirit soaks, they finally came clean enough to reload.

I usually rap the puller on our concrete floor and it usually only takes 3. On occassion I have pulled boolits from cases that were overcharged but it didn't seem to hurt the primers any. They all went bang. Of course I've used Fed., Win. and CCI primers and have had no failures on any primer. BC

I've pulled down a lot of WWII corrosive M2 ball. The bullets pull a lot easier if you "Crack" the ammo first. "Crack" equals seating the bullet just a tad deeper using your press and seater die. When the glue breaks between the bullet and case, it often makes a crack or snapping sound, thus the name. They pull a lot easier once the glue is broken.

I use a collet puller for jacketed ammo, and save the inertia puller for cast loads which rarely pull with a collet.

[Cadillo]

Somehow I missed post #8.

Darned "Old Timers' Disease"!

[ku4hx]

Given the somewhat violent nature of a bang-on-the-concrete-floor puller, I always assume primers are upset to some extent. Maybe backed out because of some rebound effect.

It just always seemed reasonable to me to re-seat all primers in these cases. I've never had a primer fail in a case from a kinetically pulled boolit.

But for me, this type puller is an accident (of one sort or another) just waiting to happen. Because of that, they're my absolute last resort. I don't shoot full wad cutters so I always have something to grab hold of. If not with my Collet puller then my pliers in my single stage press.

[soldierbilly1]

Could the priming compound be broken up under the anvil?
Terry

I am thinking this is what happened. the integrity of the cake was snafu'd. Possibly, the hammer spring is weakening up on my old Revo!

Oh well. [smilie=b:

I like the idea of the collet pullers, but to buy one for each boolit size is a PIA. Better than a kinetic puller burst though!

Center 'em up!

Billy boy Wiser now!

[DLCTEX]

Fellow member Malcom had a 300 wby. round fire the primer when pulling a bullet with an inertial puller. The primer was ejected with enough force to break the bulb in an overhead fluorescent light, but did not set off the powder in the round.??? Shook him up some.

[Shiloh]

Never had a problem. Only one time did I have to pull a lot of boolits that were of loaded a bit hot.
After about 80 pieces, I purchased a Hornady Collet puller. No issue at all with the inertia pulled primers.

Shiloh

[44man]

Don't beat the plastic things on concrete!
Get a large hunk of oak or other hard wood. I use a piece of 4x4 oak and hit the end grain. Wood absorbs shock.
Plastic will break too on hard surfaces.

[ku4hx]

Don't beat the plastic things on concrete!

I opt for fewer hits on concrete to get job done as quickly as possible. At about $15 each they're disposable ... buy 'em in pairs.

[soldierbilly1]

Don't beat the plastic things on concrete!
Get a large hunk of oak or other hard wood. I use a piece of 4x4 oak and hit the end grain. Wood absorbs shock.
Plastic will break too on hard surfaces.

44 man and KU4:

I think you boys are on to something. Too many hits.
I did a quick post mortem. Upon inspection, the primer compound pellet appears to be cracked and some of it is missing on several failed primers!
This suggests the banging was too much shock for the pellet, possibly fracturing it and making it 'inoperable.' As I said, it took about 10 pops to break the boolits down.
I did not reseat the primers, perhaps I should have. Hopefully, I won't do this again.
BTW, they don't recommend the collet pullers for boolits. But, do they work? Better than excessive banging. If the boolit gets mashed, she goes back into the pot.
thanks for the help. Forget the FWC's for now!
billy boy

[jcwit]

But for me, this type puller is an accident (of one sort or another) just waiting to happen. Because of that, they're my absolute last resort. I don't shoot full wad cutters so I always have something to grab hold of. If not with my Collet puller then my pliers in my single stage press.

If in fact that was truly the case the lawyers would be all over them and they would have left the market place years ago.


I opt for fewer hits on concrete to get job done as quickly as possible. At about $15 each they're disposable ... buy 'em in pairs.

Buy RCBS, and get/use the forever warranty.

Remember there are many, many handgun rounds that the collet puller is unuseable on.

[Crusty Deary Ol'Coot]

The collet pullers work great on any bullet which they can get ahold of.

Thankfully I seldom have a need to pull bullets as in VERY seldom, but the collet pullers are much better and faster then beating the cases on a rock!

CDOC

[Bullet Caster]

Yeah, +1 on using an RCBS. So far I've not cracked it but if it ever goes to kinetic heaven, I'll send it back to RCBS for another.

44man, I have some cedar blocks (4"x4") that I could stand on end and use that to bang on instead of my concrete floor. I'll be giving that a try the next time I have the need to pull boolits or bullets. I know cedar is somewhat softer than oak, but I just don't have any oak around to bang on. Lol. BC

[jcwit]

Usually no need to send them "the puller" back, just a phone call does the job. Three, four days later theres your new one.