158 grn mold

[JohnFM]

Is casting an average 161 grn bullet.
Add a little tin to the mix?
I mean it's close enough, but that's what the alloy needs?

[Larry Gibson]

Cast of what alloy(?) to begin with?

Larry Gibson

[JohnFM]

From a big batch of straight wheel weights.

[runfiverun]

if you are making well filled out boolits why bother?
three grains is pretty close actually most are off by 5 to 10 grains in weight. [over and under]
weight isn't a big deal, you are gonna start at the bottom of the data and work up till you find a load that you are happy with anyway's......right?

[williamwaco]

if you are making well filled out boolits why bother?
three grains is pretty close actually most are off by 5 to 10 grains in weight. [over and under]
weight isn't a big deal, you are gonna start at the bottom of the data and work up till you find a load that you are happy with anyway's......right?

Ditto.

You can't add enough tin to that mixture to get the weight down to 158. ( well you could, . . . if you had enough money. )


.

[Lefty SRH]

What mold are you using?

[DrCaveman]

What runfiverun said, most of my straight WW or recovered lead comes out several grains over published, but still varies by several grains. Now that my alloy has recycled itself a few times over, things are a little more consistent, but still not within the +/- .3 grains that many claim.

I'm sure there are ways to make the mold produce match-level consistency, but I think what you are experiencing is pretty typical. As your technique and alloy smooth out, so will your dropped weights. At least that is what I have found.

[DrCaveman]

Just pretend that they are 173 gr, for published starting load purposes, and work yourself up from there. You are walking the land of trail blazers, enjoy.

[JohnFM]

Thanks for the replies. Didn't think it would take changing tin composition much to make significant changes in a bullets weight.
Was just a point of curiousity.
If cast weights stay in that range I'm happy. Better be, I got about 200 #s of ingots out of that last batch to use. :) Hardness tester says they're running about 11.
Was pleased with size out of that Lee mold too, all the ones I miked were within about a half thou, pretty good for a 20 buck mold I thought.
I used that Lee liquid Alox lube, strange looking stuff to me, all I've ever seen is the more conventional hard lube.
After that stuff gets good and dry I'll start working on some loads and run some through the Lee sizing die to see if there is a difference.

[dale2242]

I don`t think I have ever had a boolit drop from the mold the advertised weight, even with the stated alloy.
A difference from the advertised weight does not matter to me in the least as long as they are consistant boolit to boolit.
I have never had the weight so far from the stated weight that I had to change from listed load data....dale

[JohnFM]

I can see a load change needed for these because of the softness as compared to what I usually use.
I recon they'll get a little harder. I'll let them rest 2 days and then recheck them as close as I can before I shoot any.
I'd think what they are now would be more suited to 38SPL velocities.

[rintinglen]

We spend way too much time dwelling on minutae, often based on unrealistic assumptions. The notion that there is any such thing as "Wheel weight Alloy," for one thing. Unlike steel or aluminum, where an ASME numbered alloy has meaning, wheel weights are what ever alloy the manufacturer could get cheap. BHN's can range from down around 8 upwards of 12, depending entirely on what happened to be in the smelters pot when the foundry made up the ingots for the Wheel Weight Manufacturer. Given that the bucket that we got from our friendly Tire dealer has samples from lord only knows how many different lots from maybe a dozen different manufacturers, the notion that our resulting alloy is going to be any particular combination of metals is almost laughable. If it melts and casts good boolits, its great.

[MtGun44]

Molds essentially NEVER cast the published weight, so don't sweat 3 gr diff, entirely
irrelevant. Use normal 158 gr load data and START LOW as is proper and you will
be just fine.

Bill

[williamwaco]

Thanks for the replies. Didn't think it would take changing tin composition much to make significant changes in a bullets weight.
Was just a point of curiousity.
If cast weights stay in that range I'm happy. Better be, I got about 200 #s of ingots out of that last batch to use. :) Hardness tester says they're running about 11.
Was pleased with size out of that Lee mold too, all the ones I miked were within about a half thou, pretty good for a 20 buck mold I thought.
I used that Lee liquid Alox lube, strange looking stuff to me, all I've ever seen is the more conventional hard lube.
After that stuff gets good and dry I'll start working on some loads and run some through the Lee sizing die to see if there is a difference.

If you don't like that alloy, I will certainly be happy to take it off your hands.

I mix until I get more than ten and less than 12 BNH. That range is just about perfect for my use.


LLA is good stuff. It sometimes gets a bad rap here but I Have tested it a lot and I really like it.

See results here:

65 loads, 17 bullets, 8 guns.

http://reloadingtips.com/pages/exp_111201a_lla_test.htm






.

[JohnFM]

Bunch of good info in there.
So you size dry, no problem with leading the die? First I guess what kind of die are you using?
Are you tumbling with the bag in a rotary tumbler?
I think it was in the Lee instructions, that it said to relube after sizing, an unneccesary step?

[runfiverun]

lee stuff.
lube,size,lube.

[williamwaco]

Bunch of good info in there.
So you size dry, no problem with leading the die? First I guess what kind of die are you using?
Are you tumbling with the bag in a rotary tumbler?
I think it was in the Lee instructions, that it said to relube after sizing, an unneccesary step?

I size dry with the Lee push through dies. ( Never tried it with the conventional dies. )

I tumble in a zip-lock bag. ( full strength, I no longer dilute it.)

I find it necessary to tumble AFTER sizing whether you tumble before sizing or not. When I tumble before sizing and not after, they lead like crazy.


.

[Rangefinder]

I'm guessing you're using the Lee 158gr SWC for .357? And I'll venture further that you're new to the tumble lube and push-through sizer?

This is not a problem ;)

First, measure your boolits--make sure they are dropping at the size you need or slightly over. Slugged your barrel yet? My Black Hawk takes a .358 just fine, my dad's GP100 takes a .359 to do well. My mold drops at .360 after a light polishing, sizing happens at .359 for both, and both shoot clean.

Tumble lubing: Do it any way you like. I have a mess of left-over plastic containers for the purpose--yogurt, sour cream jugs, a zip-lock bag works well too. The trick is to go VERY LIGHT. You should not see "caramel" on your boolits. Size, lube lightly again, and either let them air dry or, if you're in a hurry, hit 'em with a blow-dryer for 10 minutes. Then you're ready to load.

BHN... Where handguns are concerned, you're actually better off softer so long as you have a GOOD fit. My .357 and .40S&W both get the same alloy mix---50/50 wheel weights with a touch of tin added, and the tin is there because I shoot a lot of Hollow Points, otherwise it doesn't even go into the pot. I honestly don't know what the BHN on it is, somewhere about a 10 I'm thinking, give or take. And I push them pretty hard. My .40 runs about 1150fps on full house loads, and the .357 pushes at the border and occasionally steps over 1300fps. So there is the big rule of casting---FIT IS KING. Your alloy should handle .357 pressures just fine so long as your fit is good.

Last but not least, don't sweat the drop weight. If it's dropping heavy, you'll save in powder ;). Just load consistent and adjust your alloy as dictated by your pistol--NOT by what the book says.

[JohnFM]

The mold is a RN FP, anyway I shot all I had cast up yesterday.
Using 14grns of 2400, hotter than I usually use, I think I'll do a boxful with 13grns.
These were coated with just one layer of LLA and there is some minor leading in the last inch of the barrel.

This S&W 19-3 has a 4" barrel. So, what? Too little lube?
I thought I had slugged this barrel, but I can't find the notes, so maybe I didn't. I'll do that later. I have shot a LOT of MBC .358 bullets through it though with no sign of leading.

I cast another 300+ yesterday, all coming out of the mold as before. .358- .3585 and 161 grns.
Still fingernail soft. Didn't check any yet with the little Lee hardness tester.

I'm going to town today to pick up another 200 #s of ingots that had been poured with a high linotype content. Should be some good stuff to add to my existing ingots if I figure they need to be a tad harder.

[Rangefinder]

John, sounds like you're right on target to me. My favorite load in that weight range is slowed down just a tad--I'd guess you're pushing 1400fps with that load. I'm using 12.8 gr of 2400 under mine. I'm guessing you lubed first then sized on the ones with a single lube layer? Yup--if you lightly lube the second time, your leading will probably disappear entirely. Were it me, I'd save the lyno to sweeten rifle boolits--but that's just me. ;) Happy Casting!

[JohnFM]

Thanks much.
Before I leave, a trip to town uses up a day, I'm going to run some through the sizer and then give them and a bunch of unsized a coat of LLA.
Then tomorrow I'll give them all a second coat with a day to dry and see how they do. :).

One thing about it, this has dropped my per round costs enough even a ROF like me on SS can still burn a lot of rounds without too much expense.