Small Rifle Primers vs. Small Rifle "Magnum" Primers in .454 Casull Loading Recipes

[Southern Shooter]

Can small rifle primers and small rifle "magnum" primers be interchanged in .454 Casull recipes for example with H110/W296, Unique, Blue Dot, H4227?

Thanks

[The Ranger]

that will depend to the powder being used. H110/W296 needs a magnum primer, other powders do not, check the powder data. if you work up a load stick with the same primer, if you change primers start over with working up the load. changing from a standard to magnum primer will cause an increase in pressure.

[leftiye]

Isn't a small rifle standard primer as hot as a small pistol magnum primer? Maybe not, but a small pistol magnum primer should ignite H110 or 296 fine in a 454 case. This probly has a limit on pressure and would probly not work above 44,000 psi.. Otherwise, a small rifle standard primer will work with say 2400, probly with 1680, should work well with MP300 , etc (so would a small pistol magnum rimer). I've got a .454, and have no issue with loading it like a magnum pistol at 35,000 to 44,000 psi. Kickum butt anyway! BTW, 48,000 psi. and up is moderately insane anyway, IMHO. With cast boolits, 50,000 psi doesn't work very well, BTW.

[bobthenailer]

Ive used Fed sr & srm primers along with CCI 450 srm and REM 7 1/2 BR srp , all with sucess !
I just worked up the load seperatly with each primer.

[Certaindeaf]

Here's an interesting read on the subject.. CCI primers.

http://thefiringline.com/forums/archive/index.php?t-417220.html

[44man]

H110 and 296 need a mag primer and also an almost max load or at max. Do NOT reduce loads.
Other powders will shoot with either.
A SR mag primer has a lot of pressure but heat runs out with any airspace. It can push a boolit and the powder into the bore without ignition if there is any airspace.
The caliber should have been made for a LP mag primer at the start.
I cut down .460 brass and opened .454 pockets for the LP primer and found all 296 loads worked and even tested a standard LP primer, it ignited all loads but the LP mag was more accurate.
I took the LP mag primer to over 55,000 psi without even a flat primer, accuracy was great.
It was stupid to go to a small primer in the case and is the reason I will not own one. That primer was chosen for duplex and triplex loads when Bullseye was used in front of the primer. That is still a mystery to me because guns were blown up during testing.
Primer cups are the same thickness and can take pressures you will not believe but the amount of compound they hold is different.
Case size is perfect for a LP mag primer. So is the .475 and .500 JRH and some brass is made for a LP mag for the .500 S&W. DO NOT PUT A LR PRIMER IN THOSE.
Starting loads of 296 and H110 are DANGEROUS with a SR mag primer and you need a brass rod to pound out stuck bullets. Shoot another behind a stuck bullet if you want scrap metal.

[44man]

Be aware, I use Federal primers only with my guns. Tests on the .454 were done with all makes and hammer springs were strong enough for any primer. Maybe some were thicker but it made no difference. Some are harder too, made no difference.
Only heat and primer pressures showed the LP mag primer was better in the .454. ANY BRAND!
It was interesting to read compounds are the same and even amounts from one primer to another is the same. To see they had just a different thickness for a few was something I did not expect yet the compound was the same.
Cup thickness is based more on firing pin pressure then case pressures.
Like military primers needed in the SKS from the floating pin that can slam fire.

[Southern Shooter]

44man, are you saying, if a person stays with the small pocket .454 Casull brass, to work up a load using the small rifle magnum primers for the .454 Casull using H110/W296?

Thanks

[The Ranger]

small rifle is the specified primer for .454 Casull. and H110/W296 need a magnum primer. if you choose to use H110/W296 (i do) then use a small rifle magnum primer.

[Southern Shooter]

I am wondering why Hodgdon does not say to use a Magnum small rifle primer on their website?

[stubshaft]

I have never needed a SRM primer to light any of my 296/110 loads in my FA 83. I guess if you feel the need go for it.

[44man]

44man, are you saying, if a person stays with the small pocket .454 Casull brass, to work up a load using the small rifle magnum primers for the .454 Casull using H110/W296?

Thanks
Yes, use a SRM primer but do not start at the minimum loads with H110 or 296. You will need a brass rod and hammer to remove stuck boolits from the bore.
Maybe a standard SR primer will fire the powder but you must be at or very near max loads.
That was the problem I ran into, less then max was not reliable and I shudder to think of a guy rapping off shots fast double or single action. He will miss the stuck boolit.
You can not "work" loads with those powders, just go to max.
Only the LP mag primer allowed "working" loads.
Other powders like 2400, etc, work fine with the SR primer.
I never liked the .454 but had occasion to work with many and was taken aback with a little "pop" to find all the powder and boolit in the bore. It happened too many times as the charge increased and quit when I got to a max load or a little above.
The SR primer has a lot of pressure but a lack of fire.
I will forever consider it a mismatch for the caliber.
I just do not know why load info includes starting loads.

[evil5826]

So we can all agree that using the following is safe to use correct?

-314grn bullet and 26grn's of H110 with Magnum Small Rifle primers. 314grn bullet after a gascheck and its lubed. Would 28 or 29 grains be better?
-360grn bullet and 24grn's of H110 with Magnum Small Rifle Primers

[High Desert Hunter]

I have never had any issues using H110 with standard small rifle primers, multiple brands, and I have shot hundreds of cast bullet loads with the suggested starting loads from Hodgdon. The only time I have ever had an issue with H110, was a maximum charge in a 44 Mag with a Winchester LP for standard or magnum loads, one round only and it was -25 when I shot it, had a slight hangfire, checked the barrel, rest of the rounds went without a hitch. I can't count how many pounds of H110 I have run through the 454, I only recently started experimenting with other powders.

[evil5826]

Well last sunday I used the 314grn with about 30grns of H110 and two bullets did not go off. Im gonna lower it down to 26grns. Reason is, I was going off a Jacketed bullet data off Hodgdon's website. Some one in the forum mentioned to go off of the 325 GR. CPB LFN PB data due to it being lead. Suggested max amount would be 26grns. Would cutting down to 26grns make it worse?

[High Desert Hunter]

I have fired around 150 rounds of 325gr WFNGC bullets with 26grs of H110 in the last month, but I also have never had an issue with the 30 grain load either.