Case Fillers for rifle cases

[DonMountain]

I am new to casting and loading rifle boolits for my military surplus cartridge rifles. Most of which are medium size cases like the 6.5 x 55 Swedish, 7mm Mauser, 8mm Mauser, 7.63 x 53 Argentine, 303 British, 7.7 Jap, 7.5 x 55 Swiss, and 30-40 Krag. What are the advantages of using some sort of case filler with lead boolits and reduced powder charges, and what sort of case fillers are there and what do they consist of? Where might I get the materials to make them?

[Certaindeaf]

Just use a position insensitive powder such as Red Dot etc. and fillers are not necessary.

[MajorJim]

I know a lot of double rifle shooters that use Dacron. A Kapok wad/wafer is another thing they use. And some actually use cream of wheat.

Some of the issues with large cases where the powder charge leaves a lot of empty space are ignition issues and "chamber ringing". The filler packs the powder closer to the primer and allows for consistent ignition. These are big issues for a double rifle using calibers where the case was made large to keep chamber pressures down. That and the fact the doubles are darn expensive to fix.

[303Guy]

Personally I would recommend using a powder that would be safe with a full case load then use that at a somewhat reduced volume that will allow the use of some compressible filler to protect the boolit base and assist in proper combustion. Some use Cream Of Wheat with a powder charge just below the shoulder body junction and compressed from halfway up the neck or something. Gearnasher is the man to aske about that one. I've used wheat bran in the 303 Brit over H4350/AR2209 and a 205gr boolit with a 69% load density to good effect. That might be pushing it a bit but pressures seemed mild and consistent and accuracy was as good as could be expected for the condition of the bore.

Failing the higher velocity end, there is Trail Boss which fills the 303 Brit case completely. I have used shotgun powder and H4227/AR2205. Shotgun powder not so much success but the H4227 with wheat bran filler was pretty good. My load was 18.1gr under 11 or 12gr wheat bran with a 208gr boolit.

My concern with faster powders that only partially fill the case is the kaboom factor! The Brit case holds something like 50grs of H4227 and a double or treble charge of shotgun powder is going to spell trouble.

[williamwaco]

Just use a position insensitive powder such as Red Dot etc. and fillers are not necessary.



Ditto:

I use and love Unique. I have done extensive testing with it in the .30-30 and the .38-55 with cast bullets. I have chronographed the same charge with the powder all the way forward, all the way back, spread along the bottom by shaking back and forth and three of each for a nine shot string.

There is NO difference in velocity regardless of where the powder is located. Extreme spreads of only 15 to 25 fps.

I never use fillers and never recommend them. A lot of people use them.

I will give you one piece of advice about using fillers, regardless of which filler you use. DON'T SHOOT INTO THE WIND!


.

[303Guy]

DON'T SHOOT INTO THE WIND!Hah! That's a fact! :mrgreen:

Poly-fill shouldn't be a problem though. That's the filler for simply holding the powder in place.

[jonk]

I'd make sure that you still use a powder that fills half or more of the case and 1/2 to 1 grain of Dacron fluff should be fine. I've also used pufflon, granulated plastic, and dryer lint. They work fine, just make sure the filler contacts both the powder AND the bullet, and has light compression.

[Larry Gibson]

This "sticky" will answer your questions.

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?t=109280

Read the thread and then if you have questions don't hesitate to ask but be specific.

Larry Gibson

[williamwaco]

Hah! That's a fact! :mrgreen:

Poly-fill shouldn't be a problem though. That's the filler for simply holding the powder in place.

.75 grain polyester fill was exactly the fill I was shooting into the wind when I learned the lesson. Kinda like shooting trap into the wind before the days of the plastic shot cups.

[DIRT Farmer]

My one real positive experience with fillers was with wheat bran on 303 guy's sugestion. I was shooting a 303 with as I have found an extreamly eroded area in front of the throat. With paper patch not much exited the muzzle in one piece, most of the lead was in the barrel. With wheat bran I could keep the shots in 2 inches at 50 yards but it falls apart quickly. I would guess the wheat bran formed a gas seal behind the paper patch. With cream of wheat and corn meal, I found some slugs that were around 1/3 longer and wasp waisted in the berm. They didn't group well either. I also lost the neck of two cases with corn meal, as in gone down the barrel. My attempt at instant jackets diden't work well either. The powders used was IMR 4227, 3031, 4064 and 4350.

[geargnasher]

This "sticky" will answer your questions.

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?t=109280

Read the thread and then if you have questions don't hesitate to ask but be specific.

Larry Gibson

Beat me to it again, Larry. [smilie=l:

Gear

[leadman]

All of those cartridges would work well with IMR SR4759, 2400, or AA5744. Unique is a great powder but velocity is limited sooner than the other powders.
These will need no fillers but you do need to make sure there is only one charge in the case.
I use 2 loading blocks most of the time. empty primed cases in one block, drop the powder charge in the case, move to the second block. Before seating the boolits inspect the level of powder in each case.
You can also drop the powder in the case and immediately seat the boolit.
Either way will work to keep you safe and no need to use fillers.

I have nothing against fillers and do use them but they do take extra time to load.

[zomby woof]

I've found a limit to velocity with fast burning powders. I started getting sideways boolits when I upped the charge of 2400. I use slower powders to get the velocity i wanted but ran into delayed ignition or hang fires with charges of 3031. I started adding Dacron to my load of 3031. I got the velocity I wanted along with the accuracy. I now use a filler with all my slower powders. Hang fires are no fun, especially during a rapid fire string. It's time consuming to add the filler.

[zuke]

Use Trailboss.
It's so bulky it doesn't need filler's.
16 grain's fill's a 45-70 case about 3/4 full

[runfiverun]

there are ways around using fillers.
there is the fast powder high pressure low volumn low velocity approach.
there is the slightly slower powder that shouldn't be position sensitive but may be.
then the area where fillers come into their own the medium fast rifle powders like h-322,h&I 4895, down through the 4064's.
you then come to a section of powders that really shouldn't be used in reduced loads such as 4350 and it's general powder speed.
you then come to the slower case filling powders.
the trick here is to find one that fills the case, burns reasonably clean,and gives the velocity you want.
the use of fillers does several things.
it will position the powder against the primer for much more consistent ignition, it can lower extreme spread, and shot to shot velocity variations.
it will make the case appear smaller to the powder charge.
you can often use a lower brisance primer and maintain velocity and increase accuracy.
the use of filler also allows you to maintain your velocity consistency when in hunting situations while shooting at up or down angles.