Wet Conditions, powder, primers, and ammo storage

[Coote]

We're getting some serious rain today. There is the possibility of maybe 15" falling in the mountains and 7" around home over a three day period. Things are damp. And I want to do some reloading.

This got me thinking... how resistant to moisture are modern primers and powder?

If I reload during wet weather when there is a lot of moisture in the air, am I likely to have problems later? Obviously I'd load indoors, but I hope you can see what I'm asking.

A while back I obtained some military surplus .303 British tracer cartridges dated 1943. They had boxer primers, so I was grateful to get them for the brass. Some had patches of corrosion on the outside. We shot a few, and they weren't particularly consistent. We didn't get a single misfire though. Some of the tracer didn't show a trail, and the accuracy was horrible. I pulled the heads on some. Some heads came out easily, and some really seemed to be welded in place. Some of the powder was a tad gooey, some was caked quite hard but some tipped out and looked good. There was corrosion inside some of the cases. When I fired reloads using this brass (with its original primers), a few of the cases developed minor splits where there was corrosion. All the primers fired.

Anyway, I'd appreciate hearing ideas about powder, primers and ammo in relation to atmospheric moisture.

Thanks in advance... Coote.

[fredj338]

Well, tracer ammo has never been aprticularly accurate. Modern components are still best stored in cool dry conditions. Loading when it's damp probably doesn't hurt anything, your powder & primers are not exposed long enough. It's the long term storage that is the issue.

[KYCaster]

Humidity here seldom gets below 50% (85% right now), and I've never noticed any issues related to humidity.

I store powder and primers in original containers on a shelf with no special protection from heat or humidity. I've used plenty of components that were stored in unheated areas, with temps from below zero to 100+ and humidity fluctuations from single digits to 100%. As long as the container doesn't show signs of having been wet, I won't hesitate to use it....and so far have been satisfied with the results.

I'm a bit more careful with loaded ammo. No problems with atmospheric humidity, but I have had duds and hang fires due to melted lube contaminating the powder so I'm careful to keep ammo below 90*F or so. I sometimes keep my ammo in a cooler on the way to the range.

Jerry

[Jim]

I have a decommissioned refrigerator in my gun room. All my powder and primers are in the lower section and a lot of (not all) my ammo is in the upper section. In each compartment is an open quart container of cat litter to absorb moisture. I have hasps and staples screwed to the doors and cabinet of the frig to lock it if I want.
On the other hand, we're a half mile above sea level, so even though we have humidity, it's not all that bad.

[fredj338]

I have a decommissioned refrigerator in my gun room. All my powder and primers are in the lower section and a lot of (not all) my ammo is in the upper section. In each compartment is an open quart container of cat litter to absorb moisture. I have hasps and staples screwed to the doors and cabinet of the frig to lock it if I want.
On the other hand, we're a half mile above sea level, so even though we have humidity, it's not all that bad.

Another good option is just a cheap plastic or even foam ice chest. Put a dessic pack in it & done.

[Wayne Smith]

I have primers and extra powder in an old, functioning refrig in the garage. I keep it plugged in because the beer is in their too! This is new, however. For years no special storage other than in a heated or air conditioned house of apartment. In New England we had heat but no air, no problems with primers or powder but not a lot of humidity, either.

For years people stored powder and primers in their non air conditioned homes and did not report problems because of humidity. Air conditioning did not become common until after WWII, typically not until the '60's. Prior to that most reloading was done in common humidity to the area and worked.

[soldierbilly1]

Funny you should mention this. I live in PA and recently, unfortunately for me, my basement flooded.
Nearly all of my ammo was high and dry, except for some hunting handloads in 308. The plastic MTM ammo box was in 3 inches of water, over the tops of the bullet tips! The rounds sat submerged in 3 in of water for about 4-5 days before I discovered them and dried them off. I pulled one bullet off, all was dry inside.
I hit the range and all 10 rounds fired without a hitch. All dead on. Go Figure.
billy

[Bad Water Bill]

For 15 years I bread tropical fish. 29 gal tanks floor to ceiling were the separation between the powder,primers and other reloading goodies. There were close to 100 tanks with their individual bubbling filters working 24 7 365. When I got back into reloading all of the old (1965-70) primers still went BANG.

You might want to ask your friendly druggist about the silica gel packs that are in the big pill bottles. I take baby food jars put the gel in then drill holes in the lid. Put a piece of old nylon sock over the jar then screw the lid on. They can be recharged over and over many times.

Some of my silica gel most be almost 40 years old and still going.:grin::grin:

[fredj338]

Funny you should mention this. I live in PA and recently, unfortunately for me, my basement flooded.
Nearly all of my ammo was high and dry, except for some hunting handloads in 308. The plastic MTM ammo box was in 3 inches of water, over the tops of the bullet tips! The rounds sat submerged in 3 in of water for about 4-5 days before I discovered them and dried them off. I pulled one bullet off, all was dry inside.
I hit the range and all 10 rounds fired without a hitch. All dead on. Go Figure.
billy

Ammo is pretty water tight. The press fit of bullet & primer doesn't allow much space for moisture creep.

[Bad Water Bill]

I have a decommissioned refrigerator in my gun room. All my powder and primers are in the lower section and a lot of (not all) my ammo is in the upper section. In each compartment is an open quart container of cat litter to absorb moisture. I have hasps and staples screwed to the doors and cabinet of the frig to lock it if I want.
On the other hand, we're a half mile above sea level, so even though we have humidity, it's not all that bad.

When I moved into my home in 72 a friend offered me his junk freezer, fridge for the taking.

I knew the town I worked in had a range in the basement of the police dept and at that time they reloaded their ammo. A short trip and I asked how they stored their powder etc. In a fridge with a 3/4 plywood box as a liner was the answer. The ATF said it would be safe for over 2 hours of intense heat.

Well there are now 2 fridges both with liners to store my goodies :bigsmyl2:

[aussie460mag]

I have a new reloading room off the laundry with only the door for ventilation, after a weekend of rain and the missus using the clothes dryer, got my nephew to load 100 rounds of 357 for the weekend, and the first 6 miss fired we pulled the rest it looked like the powder had gummed up and stuck together, I now use "closet camels" in my powder/primer cupboard to reduce the humidity to around 60% (i bought a cheap humility gauge off ebay) and haven't had issues since.

[Linstrum]

As far as smokeless powder having a chemical reaction with water or having its constituents dissolve in water, that will NOT happen with probably 90% of smokeless powders available today because water-insoluble constituents are used in them. Both Bullseye and Unique, real honest to goodness smokeless powder classics that go back to 1899 and 1900, are stored under triple distilled water. Of the original test batches of Bullseye and Unique, a bit of each still exists today and they have been under water for 112 years and 111 years respectively!:holysheep Small amounts of both are periodically dried and tested and they are just as potent as they were when made back when your great-grandpa was born. So high humidity in your reloading "man-cave" won't have much effect on the powder. The same with modern non-corrosive lead styphnate primers made since about 1954 when chlorate primers were phased out in the United States. The highly corrosive chlorate primers are still made in other parts of the world, though, and the potassium chlorate in them is totally water soluble, just like table salt. The corrosive potassium chloride produced when chlorate primers are fired CANNOT BE MADE NON-CORROSIVE, and the barrel contaminated with it MUST be washed out with lots of hot water to keep from pitting the bore. Dry the bore thoroughly, too, and oil with a corrosion inhibiting gun bore oil. I simply avoid corrosive ammo to begin with because it saves a lot of trouble.

As far as high humidity itself having a bad effect on other reloading components, that will happen through the agents of corrosion. Brass cartridges that have spots of corrosion on the surface that are surrounded with a ring or spots of bright shiny copper color have what is called PLUG DE-ZINCIFICATION. Plug de-zincification almost always happens where the brass touches another metal, such as microscopic aluminum foil shreds always found in cardboard made from recycled paper, or iron in the form of staples used to close boxes, etc. Garand Rifle enbloc clips that have ammo stored in them for a few months will start making plug de-zincified spots that will eventually rot the cartridge necks off at the shoulder so the powder is exposed and will spill out. Small plug de-zincified spots have tiny holes that go all the way through the cartridge wall, so the cartridges have been perforated. Unless the plug de-zincified area is near the cartridge head, SMALL plug de-zincified spots up toward the cartridge shoulder will not cause problems when the cartridge is fired, even full house 63,000 psi piezo-method .30-06 loads will survive - - - HOWEVER, since the number and extent of the de-zincified spots is not easily determined, plug de-zincified brass should not be fired to be on the safe side. It should be pulled down to recover components if you want them, and the cartridges recycled for their brass content.

So, yes, really high humidity usually won't cause problems with the powder and primers, but because of potential corrosion problems with other components caused by moisture, don't reload when it is warm with pouring down rain outside unless you are going to shoot the ammo in a few weeks. Ammo like that would probably be okay for a lot longer, but it is better to err on the side of keeping things as dry as possible.

Now, with that said about SMOKELESS POWDER, GOOD OLD FASHIONED BLACK GUNPOWDER IS A WHOLE 'NUTHER BALL GAME! The saltpeter in black gunpowder is soluble in water, and getting black powder even slightly damp will ruin its burning and high pressure characteristics. :groner:If it gets soaked, black powder won't even burn from the saltpeter getting washed out of it. On top of that, saltpeter, chemical name potassium nitrate, is both an extremely reactive oxidizer and an electrolyte, so damp black powder will corrode most metals very rapidly as well as ruin whatever it touches. So, The OLD WEST admonition to "Keep yer powder DRY!" still holds true nowadays for black gunpowder. Besides, black gunpowder is getting awful expensive. So, yeah, keep yer black powder dry!:D



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