.40 s&w lee factory crimp die

[josper]

I have seen in other threads that using the FCD is frowned opon. Not knowing better I have used it on my loads for my .40 s&w . I was worried that I had screwed up my loads and I pulled a few with my inertia puller and miked a few at random. They were still .401. Do I still need to worry about that die sizing my boolits down? My alloy is 3# ww- 1#lino. They shoot fine as far as I can tell.not much leading.I still think I need a light crimp to prevent boolits from creeping back in the case.I don't want to risk a kaboom.

[geargnasher]

If the boolits still fit the gun after sizing, you're probably ok. Most of us don't have such luck with the carbide rings on .40 and 9mm.

Unless you have a boolit with a crimp groove and are rolling the case mouth into it, your taper or factory crimp isn't going to hold the boolit against going into the case. Only case tension holds the boolit against getting deep-seated under recoil, so make sure you aren't messing that up with the FCD, because they can kill case tension due to brass springback. But of course that varies with alloy and brass, so only you can tell for sure if everything's ok after running through the FCD.

One nice thing about being able to use the FCD is you'll be certain they will all chamber, provided you have the proper overall length set for your gun.

Gear

[Wayne Smith]

Iffen it ain't broke, don't fix it!

[sqlbullet]

You will want to pay attention if you get new brass. Thicker brass may introduce the issue. But as said nothing to worry about til there is.

[youngda9]

I have used the FCD with success with .40, .357, and .44. It is all in the setup. Once you get it figured out you're good to go.

[geargnasher]

I have used the FCD with success with .40, .357, and .44. It is all in the setup. Once you get it figured out you're good to go.

Not exactly. I have a .40 FCD that sizes the thinnest brass I have and .401" boolit down so that the boolit ends up being .398"!! Yep, it leads the bore to buggary too!

Since I punched out the carbide ring and just used the floating sleeve to "crimp" the bellmouth, it works fine.

Gear

[prs]

Gear, I wonder what lead to your die being so tight? With 40S&W I use the ring portion of the Lee CFCD to push the brass all the way through to get it back to round in case I've stepped on it or it got a bulge (have not gotten bulges with my reloads). It sizes the form fired brass back to round, but not as small as the Lee full length size die I have. Since my boolits are dropping .402 or close to .403 and the case mouths are .400 to .401 with this operation, I wonder if I should not just nix the full lengh sizer and deprime with universal, then use the M die to bell -- that way the brass gets worked less. With the M die the case indside diameters are about identical to what the Lee CFCD creats anyway. It fits, it shoots and cycles the Glock (generous chambers I think). I dunno, I hate to vary too far off the forbidden path...

prs

[geargnasher]

I'm convinced there were some running production changes in the FCD ring diameters. I have one die set that has the same ring in the sizer as in the FCD, talk about a flustercluck.

Gear

[W.R.Buchanan]

PRS you can't "nix" the sizing operation!

I kinda know something about this push thru sizing operation as I sell a pusher and have done about 20,000 cases myself using the Lee Deluxe Factory Crimp Die with the internals removed.

Using the Lee FCD with Carbide insert to push thru size the case makes the OD of the case .422-.423. The only thing you are trying to do with this operation is to remove any bulge from the area above the extractor groove on the case so that when you full length size it, you don't create a more prominent bulge at the bottom of the case. This bulge is much weaker than the original case.

Push thru sizing makes this so that the brass doesn't flow forward when you size it, which would weaken the case in that area. You can tell reloads that haven't been push thru sized very easily as the cases all have bulges at the bottom. Look for it at your next gun show, it sticks out like a sore thumb.

Roll sizing accomplishes the same thing. It makes the case cylindrical again. Just another way to do the same thing.

Then you run the case thru YOUR NORMAL REOADING OPERATION.

After the case is sized with the full length sizing die,,, it is squeezed down even farther to about .416-.418,,, and then the case is expanded and belled in the expander/charge die. This operation is what defines how much interference fit you have between the bullet and case. You are typically looking for .004 smaller than the boolit. IE .396-.397. The case must be small enough before this operation to let the expander yeild the correct fit for the bullet.

After the bullet is seated, you taper crimp the cartridge. After the Taper Crimp the case mouth should measure .417-.418 but only right at the mouth. This operation physically drives the case mouth into the boolit, but it only does that at the mouth itself. It does not size the boolit.

Also the Carbide ring in the FCD should not size the case either as the case is smaller than the ring in the die. If it does something else is wrong. .40S&W brass is typically .010 wall thickness. .401+.01+01 =.421 If the die is .422-423 then it never touches unless you get one that is bigger and that one needs to be pulled and redone as something is wrong with it.. If it sizes while coming out of the die you ahve too much crimp. It should not touch the sizing ring in the die unless something is wrong.

I disagree with those who do not crimp Auto Pistol Ammo. It also facilitates feeding of the round, and it does prevent bullet movement. Every factory round made is crimped, they wouldn't do it if it didn't result in better, safer ammo. My most recent purchase of Winchester .40S&W from Walmart had bullets that were crimped to .416 and the taper crimp was very pronounced.

One other point here. using the FCD on rimmed ammo such as .44's, .357's etc is completely different than doing rimless cases. It still will crimp the case, but those cases need a different type of crimp which can bulge the case mouth easily if overdone. So the FCD sizes any resulting bulge when it is used.

I doubt you will ever run into one of your reloaded .40S&W's that won't chamber in a Glock or other Generic pistol. The reason is these guns ahve very generous chambers some as big as .436 which will swallow just about anything that you throw at it. These guns are made for reliable functioning with acceptable accuracy, they are not target pistols.

IF you do find one that won't chamber, then you should look it over very closely as there is a definate problem!. When you figure out whats wrong with it then set it aside as a reminder not to do whatever you did that made it that way.

Hope this helps you understand this cartridge better. one final thought. Don't hot rod this round. Load it conservatively and you will be fine. You can buy factory hot rod rounds if you must have them.

Randy

[josper]

This is one round that I don't hot rod.I usually stay at the sugested starting load. For my down and dirty work I have factory" Gold Dots"

[W.R.Buchanan]

Josper: just do your homework and you'll be fine!

Randy

[hedgehorn]

I have knocked the carbide sizing rings out of my factory crimp dies. They size the boolit when crimping. I have pulled them back apart and yes it swages the bullet smaller than I like. I think they would be fine for a jacketed boolit but I dont have any use for the sizing ring. ;)

[prs]

Thank you to all who responded to my response above. I almost did not notice those replies as posts get buried pretty quick around here. W.R. Buchanan; thanks for all of that education, most appreciated. I will review my process carefully with micrometer and caliper in hand to be sure I am getting an adequate stretch case fit over my lead boolits. As I noted above, the internal sizer of the "M" die is setting my inside diameter and I did check to be sure it was not just dropping into an already too open case. My boolits drop a bit over .401 and I prefer to let the barrel size them. The load I am using is very comfortable and does not bulge the case noticably, although I run them through the bulge buster any way.

prs