Advice

[dverna]

Although I currently purchase bullets, I wish to set up to produce cast bullets for all my guns should supply become limited. My first project will be 9mm bullets. I would like to produce HP bullets for small game and self defense use. I will be using a mix of 2-3 parts range lead to 1 part Linotype. I have my old Star Lubri-sizer, but I have not cast bullets in over 30 years.

I am looking at a 122-125gr and 140-7gr options. The 122 gr bullets will be used in a carbine at about 1300 fps.

First question. What are the advantages/disadvantages of flat base vs BB bullets?

Second question. How does the Penta hollow point compare in terminal performance to a normal HP?

Third question. I have noticed some of you purchase both HP pins. Why?

Fourth question. Is one lube groove sufficient with the alloy and speeds I will encounter in the 9mm?

Last question. What lube would you suggest? I have purchased a heater as I do not like the mess I remember with 50/50 and would prefer a "hard" lube

If there are other factors I should consider please advise. I am not concerned about saving a few dollars. My objective is to produce accurate and dependable bullets that do not lead. I have decided on 4 cavity molds as I do not enjoy casting nearly as much as reloading and shooting.

Thanks in advance for your advice.

Don

[sqlbullet]

Well...I will hang some opinion out here first.

BB bullets are generally easier to deal with (cast, load) but you may pay a price in performance (accuracy). This disadvantage will only become apparent as you really approach limits. It has to do with the less predictable way the BB bullet will deform at the base if you enter the plastic pressure region for lead.

I have no experience with HP designs, so others will have to opine.

See above, although I would guess to gain the ability to cast and use both for different situations, or perhaps for testing.

I am a big fan of one large lube groove in pistol bullet design. In general I like to see the body of the bullet divided into three equal sections: front band, lube groove, rear band. Others have differing opinions.

I prefer a lube that does not require heat and I don't mind a little stickiness. I also enjoy casting and reloading, so I make my own lube using the Felix formula as a base. If I want it harder I add paraffin. I have a friend who is a big fan of hard lubes and swears by Rooster Zambini lube.

Pay careful attention to bullet size. When loaded it must be .001" larger than bore size minimum. I suggest loading a round and then pulling the bullet and checking the size. Sometimes a loading op, like a factory crimp die, will apply enough pressure to size a bullet down a thousandth or two.

[MtGun44]

Penta tears into five petals, works fine if soft enough alloy is used.
Sure, one lube groove is fine for 9mm, but the most important thing is FIT for any boolit,
and 9mms are a bit of a PITA for beginners. Strongly recommend the Lee 356 120 TC and
sized to .357 or .358.

Check out the sticky on "setting up a new 9mm for boolits" or something close to that. I
like NRA 50-50 or LBT soft blue, avoid lube heaters, and think that hard lubes are generally
inferior to soft. Stick to a known good lube, ESPECIALLY if you are going to load for 9mm,
and you may be OK. Lots of folks have had a lot of trouble with 9mm and boolits, but it
is not particularly hard to do, but please follow the path of "known good". After you get it
working, there will be plenty of time to go off and try your own ideas.

Here's the link:

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?t=121737

Bill

[fryboy]

(ramblings and in no particular order )
another aspect of the BB vs FB is no concern with your star sizer but for many who use the others the bevel also tends to fill with lube requiring wiping off ( mess would of course depend upon the lube )
as for lube ... until rooster quit selling us HVR i too liked their lube , i like their regular zambini as well , for a better deal get some carnuba red from white label lubes , in addition to getting great lube at a awesome price you'll also be supporting a fellow caster and board member ( never a bad thing ) and it's about hard to make it for what he sells it for ;)
in my humble opinion your alloy while fine for the hi intensity of the 9 mm mite be a lil too hard for the HP's best expansion , as bill mentioned they work best if soft and malleable and fit is indeed the most critical
the different pins allows one to change the boolit's terminal performance somewhat as well as the weight to some extent , and if you're serious about 4 cav HP's get your order in early as sometimes there's a wait for custom molds

[dverna]

MT,

Good thread you directed me to. Thank you.

Don

[MtGun44]

You are very welcome. Have fun, get the 9mm working first, THEN go off and try all the
fun and interesting variations and see what they do for your gun. Every gun is a thing
unto itself and will not work exactly like any other one.

You can get a Lee 6 cav in 356-120 TC and they usually drop about .358 or even .359,
so they are good for most 9mms. They have a BB, but are fine when run through a
Star. I use 50-50, basement is cool enough for no mess, slightly sticky, but not
a real issue. LBT soft blue is great stuff, too, less sticky but works very well.

Bill

[x101airborne]

As far as penta pins vs. standard round pins, I just like the look. I have not shot any game with mine yet to really determine the difference. Snakes and stuff dont count as game. They die from round nose just the same. I most often use LLA thinned with mineral spirits for lube. Easy to apply and works pretty well.

[williamwaco]

Last question. What lube would you suggest? I have purchased a heater as I do not like the mess I remember with 50/50 and would prefer a "hard" lube


Don


Don,

The only hard lubes I have ever used are the ones that came on commercially cast bullets I purchased.

Over a period of several years, when I got lazy and just didn't want to cast, I bought several thousand "hard cast" commercial bullets from four different suppliers. They were a uniform disaster, all calibers, all sizings, leaded like crazy. After months of fretting and fuming and scrubbing bores, I decided to re-lube them with Lee Liquid Alox. Problem solved, no more leading, no more scrubbing.

See:

http://www.reloadingtips.com/pages/lla_bullet_lube_2.htm

for more on re-lubing with LLA.

I will be surprised if you find hard lubes to work well in your 9mm.

NOTE:
I am not saying hard lubes don't work.
I am saying I can't make them work.