Some Facts about the names on the Vietnam Wall

[Bad Water Bill]

Carved on these walls is the story of America , of a continuing quest to preserve both democracy and decency, and to protect a national treasure that we call the American dream."

Something to think about: Most of the surviving parents of the dead are now deceased themselves.
There are 58,267 names now listed on that polished black wall, including those added in 2010.

The names are arranged in the order in which they were taken from us by date and within each date the names are alphabetized. It is hard to believe it is 36 years since the last casualties.

The first known casualty was Richard B. Fitzgibbon, of North Weymouth , Mass. , listed by the U.S.Department of Defense as having been killed on June 8, 1956. His name is listed on the Wall with that of his son, Marine Corps Lance Cpl. Richard B. Fitzgibbon III, who was killed on Sept. 7, 1965.

There are three sets of fathers and sons on the Wall. 39,996 on the Wall were just 22 or younger.

The largest age group, 8,283 were just 19 years old 33,103 were 18 years old.

12 soldiers on the Wall were 17 years old.

5 soldiers on the Wall were 16 years old.

One soldier, PFC Dan Bullock was 15 years old.

997 soldiers were killed on their first day in Vietnam .

1,448 soldiers were killed on their last scheduled day in Vietnam .

31 sets of brothers are on the Wall.

Thirty one sets of parents lost two of their sons.

54 soldiers on the Wall attended Thomas Edison High School in Philadelphia ....wonder why so many from one school?

8 Women are on the Wall -- nursing the wounded.

244 soldiers were awarded the Medal of Honor during the Vietnam War; 153 of them are on the Wall.

Beallsville , Ohio with a population of 475 lost 6 of her sons.

West Virginia had the highest casualty rate per capita in the nation.
There are 711 West Virginians on the Wall.

The Marines of Morenci - They led some of the scrappiest high school football and basketball teams that the little Arizona copper town of Morenci (pop. 5,058) had ever known and cheered. They enjoyed roaring beer busts. In quieter moments, they rode horses along the Coronado Trail, stalked deer in the Apache National Forest. And in the patriotic camaraderie typical of Morenci's mining families, the nine graduates of Morenci High enlisted as a group in the Marine Corps.Their service began on Independence Day, 1966. Only 3 returned home.

The Buddies of Midvale - LeRoy Tafoya, Jimmy Martinez, Tom Gonzales were all boyhood friends and lived on three consecutive streets in Midvale, Utah on Fifth, Sixth and Seventh avenues. They lived only a few yards apart. They played ball at the adjacent sandlot ball field. And they all went to Vietnam . In a span of 16 dark days in late 1967, all three would be killed.
LeRoy was killed on Wednesday, Nov. 22, the fourth anniversary of John F. Kennedy's assassination. Jimmy died less than 24 hours later on Thanksgiving Day.Tom was shot dead assaulting the enemy on Dec. 7, Pearl Harbor Remembrance Day.

The most casualty deaths for a single day was on January 31, 1968 ~ 245 deaths.

The most casualty deaths for a single month was May 1968 ~ 2,415 casualties were incurred.

For many Americans who read this they will only see the numbers that the Vietnam War created.
To those of us who survived the war, and to the families of those who did not, we see the faces, we feel the pain that these numbers created. We are, until we too pass away, haunted with these numbers, because they were our friends, fathers, husbands, wife's, sons and daughters.

There are no noble wars, just noble warriors...

"That we never forget"!!

[Tom-ADC]

Haven't been to the wall in DC burt have visited the one in Pensacola & when the traveling wall visited here a few years back. Its on my bucket list, maybe next summer.
Do have a few friends/shipmates listed.

[P.K.]

Thanks for that BWB. With 11-11-11 right around the corner it was a nice reminder.

[starreloader]

Two of my best friends from high school are listed on that wall... All three of us were there at the same, they were in the Army and I was in the Marines...

[theperfessor]

Heros all. May their souls know peace.

[sargenv]

I was able to see the wall when I was there in about 6 or 7 years ago.. At the time I didn't know anyone who was listed on the wall, but it still moved me all the same.. I was able to see the Korea memorial, the Nurse's memorial and the Lincoln memorial.. The WWII memorial wasn't finished yet so I wasn't able to see that one yet.. I was only 8 when it ended and when I was growing up, it wasn't really in the history books yet.. anything I learned about it was on my own research.

[Bad Water Bill]

A young girl I worked with married a soldier. Immediately after the homeymoon he went to Nam and was blown to bits his first day there. To the best of my knowledge she has never dated or married. More than one life damaged there and many more that I have known badly injured but all of them are HEROS to me.

[Geraldo]

Check this site out. The link is to the birthday page, but there is a lot on it worth looking at.

http://thewall-usa.com/search.asp?action=birthday

Last summer I went to Bethesda Naval Hospital to visit the son of one of my best friends. His son triggered an IED, and is incredibly lucky to be alive although he is leaving the Corps on medical discharge. While I was there he found out that the only guy from his fire team who wasn't hit by the IED had been KIA.

One morning I went into DC and went to the Wall. I think it's the most impressive monument there. Probably because of being at Bethesda and the news from Afghanistan, I couldn't shake the feeling that we're building another wall. So when you get done looking at thewall-usa.com, take a look at this site, and don't forget the ones listed on it:

http://apps.washingtonpost.com/national/fallen/

[smoked turkey]

This touched me deeply too. Thanks for reminding us once again of the terrible price that has been paid for the freedoms we enjoy.

[frankenfab]

Wow, I am humbled once again by the magnitude of sacrifice by true Americans. I never got to serve, and I probably wouldn't have lasted very long at the age of the average soldier.

But I have always respected, and tried to get my kids to undestand and aknowledge the importance of what War Veterans have done for us. I have always contemplated that I could have been born at that time and had to go through something like serving in a war. It could have been me, killed on the first day.

Thanks to all that served.

[P.K.]

Wow, I am humbled once again by the magnitude of sacrifice by true Americans. I never got to serve, and I probably wouldn't have lasted very long at the age of the average soldier.

But I have always respected, and tried to get my kids to undestand and aknowledge the importance of what War Veterans have done for us. I have always contemplated that I could have been born at that time and had to go through something like serving in a war. It could have been me, killed on the first day.

Thanks to all that served.Thank you. Alot of folks have no idea, you do.

[Larry Gibson]

Yes, may God bless them all.....my only problem with the names on the wall is that I knew too many of them.....very hard for me to hold it together there..........

Larry Gibson

[Blacksmith]

I still can't face the wall. I don't live that far away and have been to DC a number of times. But I just can't go to The Wall. To much baggage.

Blacksmith

[timkelley]

It has been 40 years since I came home from VN and I finally believe I could stand up to 'The Wall'. The strange thing is I knew no one who was killed there except one Department of the Army Civilian.
For some reason, I felt dirty as if I had done some wrong in coming home unhurt. Strange what your head will tell you.

[DCP]

Many gave all
All gave some


They shall grow not old, as we that are left grow old:
Age shall not weary them, nor the years condemn.
At the going down of the sun and in the morning
We will remember them.


Vaya con Dios

[montana_charlie]

Here's a page of statistics I picked up in an email ... I think ... and saved.
CM


Viet Nam Vet statistics

In case you haven't been paying attention these past few decades
after you returned from Vietnam , the clock has been ticking. The
following are some statistics that are at once depressing yet in a
larger sense should give you a HUGE SENSE OF PRIDE.

"Of the 2,709,918 Americans who served in Vietnam , Less than 850,000
are estimated to be alive today, with the youngest American Vietnam
veteran's age approximated to be 54 years old."

So, if you're alive and reading this, how Does it feel to be among
the last 1/3rd of all the U.S. Vets who served in Vietnam ?!?!? ...
don't know about you guys, but kinda gives me the chills, considering
this is the kind of information I'm used to reading about WWII and
Korean War vets...

So the last 14 years we are dying too fast, only the few will survive
by 2015...if any.. If true, 390 VN vets die a day. So in 2190 days...
from today, lucky to be a Vietnam veteran alive..... in only 6 years..

These statistics were taken from a variety of sources to include: The
VFW Magazine, the Public Information Office, and the HQ CP Forward
Observer - 1st Recon April 12, 1997.

STATISTICS FOR INDIVIDUALS IN UNIFORM AND IN COUNTRY VIETNAM VETERANS:

* 9,087,000 military personnel served on active duty during the
Vietnam Era (August 5, 1964 - May 7, 1975).

* 8,744,000 GIs were on active duty during the war (Aug 5, 1964-March
28,1973).

* 2,709,918 Americans served in Vietnam , this number represents 9.7%
of their generation.

* 3,403,100 (Including 514,300 offshore) personnel served in the
broader Southeast Asia Theater ( Vietnam , Laos , Cambodia , flight
crews based in Thailand , and sailors in adjacent South China Sea
waters).


* 2,594,000 personnel served within the borders of South Vietnam
(Jan. 1,1965 - March 28, 1973). Another 50,000 men served in Vietnam
between 1960 and 1964.

* Of the 2.6 million, between 1-1.6 million (40-60%) either fought in
combat, provided close support or were at least fairly regularly
exposed to enemy attack.

* 7,484 women (6,250 or 83.5% were nurses) served in Vietnam .

* Peak troop strength in Vietnam : 543,482 (April 30, 1968).

* The average WWII soldier saw 40 days of combat in four years.
The average Vietnam soldier saw 204 of combat days in one year.

CASUALTIES:

The first man to die in Vietnam was James Davis, in 1958. He was with
the 509th Radio Research Station. Davis Station in Saigon was named
for him.

Hostile deaths: 47,378

Non-hostile deaths: 10,800

Total: 58,202 (Includes men formerly classified as MIA and Mayaguez
casualties).. Men who have subsequently died of wounds account for
the changing total.

8 nurses died -- 1 was KIA.

61% of the men killed were 21 or younger.

11,465 of those killed were younger than 20 years old.

Of those killed, 17,539 were married.

Average age of men killed: 23.1 years

Total Deaths: 23.11 years

Enlisted: 50,274 22.37 years

Officers: 6,598 28.43 years

Warrants: 1,276 24.73 years

E1: 525 20.34 years

11B MOS: 18,465 22.55 years

Five men killed in Vietnam were only 16 years old.

The oldest man killed was 62 years old.

Highest state death rate: West Virginia - 84.1% (national average
58.9% for every 100,000 males in 1970).

Wounded: 303,704 -- 153,329 hospitalized + 150,375 injured requiring
no hospital care.

Severely disabled: 75,000, -- 23,214: 100% disabled; 5,283 lost
limbs; 1,081 sustained multiple amputations.

Amputation or crippling wounds to the lower extremities were 300%
higher than in WWII and 70% higher than Korea .

Multiple amputations occurred at the rate of 18.4% compared to 5.7%
in WWII.

Missing in Action: 2,338

POWs: 766 (114 died in captivity)

As of January 15, 2004, there are 1,875 Americans still unaccounted
for from the Vietnam War.

DRAFTEES VS. VOLUNTEERS:

25% (648,500) of total forces in country were draftees. (66% of U.S.
armed forces members were drafted during WWII).

Draftees accounted for 30.4% (17,725) of combat deaths in Vietnam .

Reservists killed: 5,977

National Guard: 6,140 served: 101 died.

Total draftees (1965 - 73): 1,728,344.

Actually served in Vietnam : 38% Marine Corps Draft: 42,633.

Last man drafted: June 30, 1973.

RACE AND ETHNIC BACKGROUND:

88.4% of the men who actually served in Vietnam were Caucasian; 10.6%
(275,000) were black; 1% belonged to other races.

86.3% of the men who died in Vietnam were Caucasian (includes
Hispanics);

12.5% (7,241) were black; 1.2% belonged to other races.

170,000 Hispanics served in Vietnam ; 3,070 (5.2% of total) died there..

70% of enlisted men killed were of North-west European descent.

86.8% of the men who were killed as a result of hostile action were
Caucasian; 12.1% (5,711) were black; 1.1% belonged to other races.

14.6% (1,530) of non-combat deaths were among blacks.

34% of blacks who enlisted volunteered for the combat arms.

Overall, blacks suffered 12.5% of the deaths in Vietnam at a time
when the percentage of blacks of military age was 13.5% of the total
population.

Religion of Dead: Protestant -- 64.4%; Catholic -- 28.9%; other/none
-- 6.7% SOCIO-ECONOMIC STATUS:

Vietnam veterans have a lower unemployment rate than the same non-vet
age groups.

Vietnam veterans' personal income exceeds that of our non-veteran age
group by more than 18 percent.

76% of the men sent to Vietnam were from lower middle/working class
backgrounds.

Three-fourths had family incomes above the poverty level; 50% were
from middle income backgrounds.

Some 23% of Vietnam vets had fathers with professional, managerial or
technical occupations.

79% of the men who served in Vietnam had a high school education or
better when they entered the military service. 63% of Korean War vets
and only 45% of WWII vets had completed high school upon separation.

Deaths by region per 100,000 of population: South -- 31%, West
--29.9%; Midwest -- 28.4%; Northeast -- 23.5%.

DRUG USAGE &CRIME:

There is no difference in drug usage between Vietnam Veterans and non-
Vietnam Veterans of the same age group. (Source: Veterans
Administration Study)

Vietnam Veterans are less likely to be in prison - only one-half of
one percent of Vietnam Veterans have been jailed for crimes.

85% of Vietnam Veterans made successful transitions to civilian life.

WINNING &LOSING:

82% of veterans who saw heavy combat strongly believe the war was
lost because of lack of political will.

Nearly 75% of the public agrees it was a failure of political will,
not of arms.

HONORABLE SERVICE:

97% of Vietnam-era veterans were honorably discharged.

91% of actual Vietnam War veterans and 90% of those who saw heavy
combat are proud to have served their country.

74% say they would serve again, even knowing the outcome.

87% of the public now holds Vietnam veterans in high esteem.

INTERESTING CENSUS STATISTICS & THOSE TO CLAIM TO HAVE "Been There":

1,713,823 of those who served in Vietnam were still alive as of
August,1995 (census figures).

During that same Census count, the number of Americans falsely
claiming to have served in-country was: 9,492,958.

As of the current Census taken during August, 2000, the surviving
U.S. Vietnam Veteran population estimate is: 1,002,511. This is hard
to believe, losing nearly 711,000 between '95 and '00. That's 390 per
day.

During this Census count, the number of Americans falsely claiming to
have served in-country is: 13,853,027. By this census, FOUR OUT OF
FIVE WHO CLAIM TO BE Vietnam vets are not.

The Department of Defense Vietnam War Service Index officially
provided by The War Library originally reported with errors that
2,709,918 U.S. military personnel as having served in-country.
Corrections and confirmations to this erred index resulted in the
addition of 358 U.S. military personnel confirmed to have served in
Vietnam but not originally listed by the Department of Defense. (All
names are currently on file and accessible 24/7/365).

Isolated atrocities committed by American Soldiers produced torrents
of outrage from anti-war critics and the news media while Communist
atrocities were so common that they received hardly any media mention
at all. The United States sought to minimize and prevent attacks on
civilians while North Vietnam made attacks on civilians a centerpiece
of its strategy. Americans who deliberately killed civilians received
prison sentences while Communists who did so received commendations.

From 1957 to 1973, the National Liberation Front assassinated 36,725
Vietnamese and abducted another 58,499. The death squads focused on
leaders at the village level and on anyone who improved the lives of
the peasants such as medical personnel, social workers, and school
teachers. - Nixon Presidential Papers.

[Red River Rick]

Truly amazing figures! My hats off to all those men and women who served during this war.

I noticed some info is missing, so I've attached this link: http://canadianmilitary.page.tl/-Vietnam.htm

It's Canada's contribution to the Vietnam war.

RRR

[ErikO]

While the ToE may be a ****hole that deserves not a second thought, those that lived and died in that ToE deserve our undying gratitude and respect. Those who did the unthinkable for the unwilling and ungrateful are all heroes in the truest sense of the word.

While I was born while combat operations in SE Asia were winding down and had no kin that served, I feel an odd connection and kinship to those who served. Godspeed and God bless our nation's noble warriors.

[lbaize3]

I visited the wall soon after it was finished in the early 1990's. It was an experience I shall never forget. I left the Gerber dagger I carried at the wall and it was picked up by the park service and placed with the many other things left at the wall. It had my name and service number engraved on it. I often wonder what people will think of it in the years to come.

I spent a lot of time at the panels that held the names of good and true friends who died while I was there. I also visited the names of school mates and relatives that were not lucky enough to come home. Every veteran should go. It is a very emotional experience but also uplifting and cleansing at the same time. I would also suggest that visitors go with other veteran friends for the support that can be given one to the other during the visit. It is amazing how baggage you've carried for so long can disappear after that visit.

[gnoahhh]

I'm sitting here with a tear in my eye. Visiting the Wall is a very emotional experience. Next in emotion is the exhibit at the Smithsonian of the artifacts left in remembrance at the Wall. That stuff is collected periodically and will forever remain public property, warehoused by the Smithsonian and a lot of it makes it to the exhibit (at least I'm assuming they haven't backed off on their promise to do so). Funny how looking at an old muddy pair of combat boots can make a guy cry.

[Jim_Fleming]

It took me decades to make my peace with The Wall... I enlisted in Aug 71.

Never made it 'Nam.

A lot of the kids thought I did.

Sent from my Droid

[462]

I came home June of '68. I've not been to D.C., yet, but have seen the Moving Wall twice. The first time, I was alone and couldn't bring myself to view it except from a distance. The second time, my wife went with me and we both shed tears as we walked its entire length.

There are times when I feel guilty that I returned unscathed, other than some hearing loss, and have the utmost respect for those who carry the physical and mental scars. Welcome home.

[Jim_Fleming]

462... Same here... My peace came from standing in front of the moving Wall. In full uniform, just before I was retired due to high year tenure.

Bloody damn survivors guilt is **** for the birds...

Welcome home brother.

Sent from my Droid

[lead-1]

My family's total respect and honor go out to all Vets and to see these stats is completely staggering. Both of my kids have got to go see The Wall and I keep saying that someday I may get to.

[JeffinNZ]

Sadly the casualties continue with cancer. A friend locally who served with NZ forces has retired early purely and simply because so many of his comrades have passed prematurally and he wants to enjoy the time he has left.

[Rick N Bama]

I still can't face the wall. I don't live that far away and have been to DC a number of times. But I just can't go to The Wall. To much baggage.

Blacksmith

Twice I've been to N. VA & could not go the few extra miles to visit the wall. It is on my bucket list as well, but I doubt my ever being able to make it.

Rick

Viet Nam Vet....Oct 1,1967-Oct 1, 1968

[Charlie Two Tracks]

I had a chance a few years ago to go to the wall. Just can't do it. Just reading this thread has me feeling really sad and nervous. I have never been the same since I went over. But that's ok. I don't know what makes one person love their country enough to risk there life and another to not even think about such a thing. I volunteered for the Army and volunteered for Viet-Nam. My brother was over in Chu-Chi when I got out of training and they were going to keep me state side. I didn't want that so I signed the papers and they sent me on over. Only one brother at a time could be in a war zone back then. If I had to do it over again, I would. My classmate and I signed up three months after we graduated. He was killed on his first mission out........ I think I need to stop now.....

[quilbilly]

I did 2-1/2 tours over there. When I had a chance to go see the wall, I was so overwhelmed I had to sit dfown without ever getting close enough to read it. So many friends.

[plmitch]

Wow, there is some great information posted here, alot that I didn't know. I will share this with my kids and grandkids.

[Kraschenbirn]

Been there once...found the names of the pilot and doorgunner who died when we were shot down in March of '67...just stood there and cried. Couldn't bring myself to look for any of the others I knew.

11th Avn Gp, 1st Cav Div (airmobile)
RVN '66,'67, '68

[P.K.]

I want to say something... It may not be popular and many may find it offensive. There are VET's out there who put up the right hand because they decided it was the right thing to do. Damn it! Screw all the damn tables and decimals.....Screw all that! Peoples lives were lost. People also served when no lives were lost. They still deserve recognition because they served at the toughest time.....When there was no war.

[Bad Water Bill]

I was at sea in 1958 when it was PEACE TIME. I can not tell you how many sailors and pilots lost their lives on a 6 month cruise. That statement about the most dangerous 4 acres in the world has never been challenged since I was there. No one was shooting at us but who would like to be on the flight deck at 2400 in a rough sea and pitch black?

I will NEVER try to take any thing away from those valiant soldiers and marines that answered the call and served with distinction.

I am sure someone from the Air force and Coast guard will step up and confirm there is no safe time to be in service defending MY country, YES I would still answer the call if needed.

[Charlie Two Tracks]

I agree BWB. Men and women have given years of their lives for the defense of the country they love. Each was needed and every one helped to keep this country free. The cost of Freedom is high. Peace time or not...

[Jim_Fleming]

BWB, and the rest of my Siblings in Arms. We all would heed the call... again and again and yet again. Never mind the politics. America is far more important.

This thread makes my eyes keep watering up. Foggy and misty too. Must be allergies.

Sent from my Droid

[captaint]

A kid I knew since 4th grade is on that wall. I couldn't even attend his funeral, I was in the RVN myself at the time. I did visit the wall once, about 15 years ago. I got very emotional. I still do, when I think about this. Mike