Lee Liquid Alox - How Much & Can You Use w/Bullets Cast in Lyman Molds

[niler]

I am new at this and have some questions relative Lee Liquid Alox (LLA) lube.

1) How much LLA is too much - what amount is correct? Please see before and after pictures on 230RN cast in a Lee TL452-230-2R mold using range lead.

2) Can one use LLA with cast bullets other than Lee Micro-Groove designs, such the Lyman 452-460 (200 GR), Lyman 356402 (121 GR) and Lyman 358495 (141 GR) pictured?

Any/all feedback is solicited and appreciated.

Thanks in advance!

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/imagehosting/thum_203624e881bfc5e954.jpg (http://castboolits.gunloads.com/vbimghost.php?do=displayimg&imgid=2310)http://castboolits.gunloads.com/imagehosting/thum_203624e881c280312d.jpg (http://castboolits.gunloads.com/vbimghost.php?do=displayimg&imgid=2311)

[MikeS]

I answered your question about how much it too much, but I'll tell you again, the boolit in this picture has enough LLA on it for maybe 50 boolits! With LLA less is better, and the boolit should have a barely perceptible coating on it.

And yes, you can use LLA on any style of boolit, it doesn't have to be a TL design (with the micro grooves), but again remember, you don't need to fill the lube grooves on a conventional style boolit, just a very light coating. When I load my cast boolits I usually wipe the finished cartridges with a rag to get excess lube off the boolit (when using a conventionally lubed boolit) that gets on them from the way I store my boolits. When I load boolits that have been tumble lubed with LLA I usually don't bother wiping them off, or if I do I don't try to remove the LLA coating entirely, I just give them a light wipe to remove any dust, etc. that might have gotten on the nose of the boolit. Some people like to wipe them down, and totally remove the LLA coating from the portion of the boolit that's exposed outside the brass, and that's fine too, just more work that's not really needed.

[Chihuahua Floyd]

I use just enough to cover the bullet lightly. All I have ever used on my cast bullets is LLA.
I usually give a light coat of lube, let fry, size in a Lee push thru sizer and another light coat.
Bullets are not sitcky, don''t pick up lint, or other bad stufff and do not gum up a seating/crimp die.
I do about 3-400 at a time, following the directions on the bottle. Dump lubed bullets on wax paper to dry and do not try to stand on end, only make sure they do not stack on top of each other. leaves little to no LLA on was paper.
Shot Cowboy Action for 9 years with my cast bullets and am only on my 4th bottle. (3rd bottle broke and leaked).
CF

[10x]

What Mike said!

Just for your information - I have found that a heavy duty Zip lock plastic bag does a great job of lubing the bullets. If you want less lube on the bullets dilute the mule snot (Lee Liquid Alox) with a drop or two of mineral spirits (paint thinner?) or brake kleen.

I place my lubed bullets base down on wax paper and let the lube set up.
You could place the bullets base down on bond paper as it will wick some of the liquid alox off. I've never used anything but wax paper.

I have had extremely good luck with Lee Liquid Alox with .22 and 30 caliber bullets up to 1750 fps - no leading and accuracy comparable to Lyman and RCBS lube.

[niler]

ROGER ALL and thanks much - really appreciate the info!

[shotman]

warm the boolits to about body temp and heat the lube in Hot tap water. I use a plactic jif peanut butter bottle and do about 100 or so at a time about 1/2 tea spoon is more than enough
Wax paper is best to stand them on foil tears and paper sticks

[10x]

warm the boolits to about body temp and heat the lube in Hot tap water. I use a plactic jif peanut butter bottle and do about 100 or so at a time about 1/2 tea spoon is more than enough
Wax paper is best to stand them on foil tears and paper sticks

Or toss the bullets and a pea size gob of lube in a zip lock bag. Close it and drop the whole thing in a bowl of hot tap water for five. Pull out, dry the bag and work the lube over the bullets.
If you use a heavy zip lock it will last over four or five lube sessions before playing out. Do not use too big of a bag either. No point in lubing more bag than bullet.

[geargnasher]

Read this "sticky" thread from our lube sub-forum: http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?t=67654

Gear

[243winxb]

2 tea spoons for 200 to 230 45 acp bullets works for me. Place on wax paper to dry. Alox works on any bullet that i tested using target to mid-range loads in handguns. MR Lee Said >
Liquid Alox application

Best results in applying liquid alox are when the alox is heated before applying, or thinned with paint thinner. This makes it flow more easily, and results in a more even coat. One technique is to boil water and pour it into a coffee mug, and then drop the bottle of liquid alox into the mug for about five minutes.

Place your freshly cast bullets into something about the size of a Cool Whip bowl and drop a few drops of liquid Alox on the bullets. Mix the bullets around until they are all coated. Lay the freshly coated bullets on some wax paper to dry. Liquid alox will usually dry enough overnight to reload the next day, depending upon the humidity. Tacky bullets can be dusted with powdered graphite.

If you subscribe to the "more is better" line of thought, your coated bullets may never dry. Don't go for a "golden" color but rather just a light varnish. If you discover that your bullets are sticky the next day, you can get by with using a little less the next time. Keep reducing until the "stickiness" is gone by the next day.

If you are sizing your cast bullets, it is necessary to lube them first. Because the sizer will remove some of the surface of a larger diameter bullet, you may need to re-lubricate the bullets after they have been sized.

Many of our bullets are of the "TL" or Tumble Lube design. These bullets have many shallow grooves that are perfect for allowing Liquid Alox to adhere to a great amount of surface. It has been reported that the accuracy of these bullets is high.

[res45]

Read this "sticky" thread from our lube sub-forum: http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?t=67654

Gear
I love the Redluse Alox/JPW lube,I don't even have to use the MS in my mix. Not only does it work great as a TL but it's great for ranch dipping bullets as well if you want a little more lube in the grooves.

http://i76.photobucket.com/albums/j1/rhsikes/res45/Coated.jpg

[niler]

Just read the newest posts after tumble lubing the 850+ boolits I cast yesterday w/LLA, thinned w/a bit of mineral spirits/paint thinner and tumbled in a gallon sized ZIPLOCK Bag.

Believe I may be still applying a bit too much - please see photos.

Q3 - Do I need to recoat w/LLA after sizing?

Thanks again, really appreciate the patience with a newbie!
http://castboolits.gunloads.com/imagehosting/thum_203624e88832e52fc2.jpg (http://castboolits.gunloads.com/vbimghost.php?do=displayimg&imgid=2325) http://castboolits.gunloads.com/imagehosting/thum_203624e88834c73f68.jpg (http://castboolits.gunloads.com/vbimghost.php?do=displayimg&imgid=2326)

[geargnasher]

Yes, recoat after sizing. Yes, probably still need to thin it a bit, the idea isn't to fill the grooves, but get a slight film on the boolits, and I mean slight. Two coats should just barely even be visibly after drying. If you follow the forumula in the link I posted above, they will be dry to the touch and not sticky at all in half an hour with good ventilation and low humidity, and you can promptly size them and lube again.

In my experience, it is a waste of time to stand them all up on their bases, especially for the first coat, the waxed paper will prevent any from being pulled of the sides of the boolits if they dry laying sideways. Not a pretty as standing them up, but they load and shoot just as well. Don't worry about LLA on the bases, one of the good things about this tumble-lube is that it doesn't affect powder at all when dry.

Gear

[williamwaco]

I answered your question about how much it too much, but I'll tell you again, the boolit in this picture has enough LLA on it for maybe 50 boolits! With LLA less is better, and the boolit should have a barely perceptible coating on it.

And yes, you can use LLA on any style of boolit, it doesn't have to be a TL design (with the micro grooves), but again remember, you don't need to fill the lube grooves on a conventional style boolit, just a very light coating. When I load my cast boolits I usually wipe the finished cartridges with a rag to get excess lube off the boolit (when using a conventionally lubed boolit) that gets on them from the way I store my boolits. When I load boolits that have been tumble lubed with LLA I usually don't bother wiping them off, or if I do I don't try to remove the LLA coating entirely, I just give them a light wipe to remove any dust, etc. that might have gotten on the nose of the boolit. Some people like to wipe them down, and totally remove the LLA coating from the portion of the boolit that's exposed outside the brass, and that's fine too, just more work that's not really needed.


Exactly!

Another measurement on how much.

I put about 300 125 grain 9mms in a one quart zip-lock bag, add about 1 ( ONE) tablespoon of LLA mixed with 30% mineral spirits.

Whey they are dry. Two hours under a fan. you can barely see it.

Detailed description here:

http://www.reloadingtips.com/pages/lla_bullet_lube.htm

[beex215]

thats still alot of lla. why is there even a puddle of brown on that paper. im sure you could dump more boolits and coat them there. little puddles next to the boolliets too.

i microwave my bottle for 40 seconds before each use. i put about a layers worth of boolits in a cd case. the 50 pack kind. i put about 3 light circles worth of lla and start swooshing them around. i let them dry for a few hours and coat them again. im not sure if thats needed but i do it anyway.

http://i115.photobucket.com/albums/n312/beex215/CIMG2183.jpg
http://i115.photobucket.com/albums/n312/beex215/CIMG2180.jpg
http://i115.photobucket.com/albums/n312/beex215/CIMG2182.jpg
http://i115.photobucket.com/albums/n312/beex215/CIMG2122.jpg

[10x]

bottom line, if the bullets feel "greasy" and look just a little "greasy" that should be just right.

[Sonnypie]

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/imagehosting/thum_203624e88832e52fc2.jpg (http://castboolits.gunloads.com/vbimghost.php?do=displayimg&imgid=2325) http://castboolits.gunloads.com/imagehosting/thum_203624e88834c73f68.jpg (http://castboolits.gunloads.com/vbimghost.php?do=displayimg&imgid=2326)


OH MY GOODNESS!
LOOK AT THE MESS YOU MADE ON THE DINING ROOM TABLE!!! :shock:

Better clean that up before she gets home! :oops: :kidding:

I have a pile in front of a box fan in the shop as we speak.
I leave mine scattered in a pan spread around on waxed paper, not stood up.

[bigjason6]

Looks like I've been using too much as well!

[Sonnypie]

Oh, and to answer your question...
No.
You have to use Lyman Orange lube. Otherwise they get jealous. [smilie=1:

Try as I might, I can't see how much is left when the boolits come out of the barrel.
Darn things are always goin too fast! :(

[williamwaco]

thats still alot of lla. why is there even a puddle of brown on that paper. im sure you could dump more boolits and coat them there. little puddles next to the boolliets too.

i microwave my bottle for 40 seconds before each use. i put about a layers worth of boolits in a cd case. the 50 pack kind. i put about 3 light circles worth of lla and start swooshing them around. i let them dry for a few hours and coat them again. im not sure if thats needed but i do it anyway.



http://i115.photobucket.com/albums/n312/beex215/CIMG2182.jpg



These look about perfect to me.

[niler]

ALL - thanks so much for the assist! LOTS of great info for a new caster.

Sorry I've been so lax posting, work and after hours classes have kept me jumping this week.

Thanks again - I really appreciate everyone taking the time to answer a newbie's questions.

Have a great weekend!

[max it]

HI Guys,

Good thread on Liquid Alox. But are you forgetting that the boolits with the big grooves are usually not the finished diameter?

Much obliged,

Max

[45-70 Chevroner]

I sure wish I had learned to use the computer a long time ago. I have probably wasted a lot of bottles of LLA by using too much of it. I was just doing what I thought Lee suggested to use. If I had known how to use a computer back in the 80's I might have found a web site like this and learned a lot of things. Every thing I have learned about cast boolits up until recently was self tought. I have really enjoyed this web site, and everyone on here have been of great help.

[MikeS]

Even if you knew how to use a computer back in the 80's you would have had a hard time finding websites like this one, the 'web' as such wasn't around back then! About the closest thing would have been if CompuServe (the big online company back then) had any gun related forums, which I don't think they did, or at least I don't remember seeing any back then.

But you're right, this forum is THE place to learn how to cast boolits!

[quilbilly]

I am using the Lee liquid Alox on my 6mm boolits from an old Lyman/Ideal mold and I have gotten my best groups ever with that rifle (Rem 600).

[45-70 Chevroner]

MikeS: I kind of knew that but if I had learned to use the computer back then I would be way a head of the game now. I have only been a member of this web site for a few years and I really only had minimal knowledge. I am still struggling with it. I don't think I will really have a comand of it in my life time.

[Judan_454]

Love to see pictures of piles and piles bullets,im in cast bullet heaven.
Thanks for posting pictures.

[ku4hx]

I sure wish I had learned to use the computer a long time ago. I have probably wasted a lot of bottles of LLA by using too much of it. I was just doing what I thought Lee suggested to use. If I had known how to use a computer back in the 80's I might have found a web site like this and learned a lot of things. Every thing I have learned about cast boolits up until recently was self tought. I have really enjoyed this web site, and everyone on here have been of great help.

The way I figure it, I wasted a whole lot of LLA over-lubing boolits for years ... decades even. Fact is when I learned on this site to thin the stuff way down with mineral spirits I was skeptical. Downright disbelieving to be honest. I mean a coating as thin as advised just would never work in my guns at my velocities. Well, I was wrong. The thinnest layer I can get (and later dusted with Motor Mica) is absolutely perfect. I mean the lubed and dried boolits just look dull, not really lubed, but I've had no leading at all.

And knowing what I know now, I have about a 100 year supply of LLA. Wish I could say the same for alloy.

[prs]

Gosh! I reckon I've been using too little? I lube about 40# of boolits at a time in bucket and only use about 10 drops of thinned LLA. I leave them clumped in the bucket and give them another tumble later in the day or next day and then let them dry in a single layer. They look well coated and shoot fine. The gun barrel sizes them so far as I know.

prs

[41mag]

Even if you knew how to use a computer back in the 80's you would have had a hard time finding websites like this one, the 'web' as such wasn't around back then! About the closest thing would have been if CompuServe (the big online company back then) had any gun related forums, which I don't think they did, or at least I don't remember seeing any back then.

But you're right, this forum is THE place to learn how to cast boolits!

Yep Compuserve had a great shooting forum, until AOL bought them out and cut it the same week. I even still have some of the old post from there stashed away on an old PC I only use as a back up.

I had them both, and dropped them both, when AOL went firearm unfriendly.

[10x]

Yep Compuserve had a great shooting forum, until AOL bought them out and cut it the same week. I even still have some of the old post from there stashed away on an old PC I only use as a back up.

I had them both, and dropped them both, when AOL went firearm unfriendly.

Prior to internet access in Alberta (late 1980s) I would dial up bulletin boards in the U.S. that were open ports for the internet. It cost about $1.00 a minute to do gopher and arc hie searches on the various University and government databases that had public access. There were no graphics, just text and firearms information other than anti gun rhetoric was rare.

[bigjason6]

Prior to internet access in Alberta (late 1980s) I would dial up bulletin boards in the U.S. that were open ports for the internet. It cost about $1.00 a minute to do gopher and arc hie searches on the various University and government databases that had public access. There were no graphics, just text and firearms information other than anti gun rhetoric was rare.

I miss those old dial up bbs's. Used to have all kinds of fun on there! Did you ever play L.O.R.D.?

[10x]

I miss those old dial up bbs's. Used to have all kinds of fun on there! Did you ever play L.O.R.D.?

At a buck a minute for long distance to call into the board I was downloading the board indexes, signing off, and selecting the material (documents) regarding the political fight over gun laws in Canada, connecting and down loading that material, so no.
Video gaming at a buck a minute was a luxury that would divert spare dollars away from the local fight over gun laws.

[44man]

I have to laugh! :kidding:
No amount from a kiss to full lube grooves is what I use. I hate the stuff. It leads my bores and ruins accuracy. Just how much better is Felix lube? About 10000000000000000000000000000000000%! Obama uses even more zeros!
It is Z- Bart for undercoating cars and all of my cars with the junk still rusted out. The stuff burns in the bore and is why less is better, less ash in the bore to scrape off lead. It smokes because it burns and it stinks.
Alox has a high flash point and beeswax helps tame it. It still is not that good at 50-50. ANYTHING other then alox to soften beeswax is better.

[Crawdaddy]

I sure wish I had learned to use the computer a long time ago. I have probably wasted a lot of bottles of LLA by using too much of it. I was just doing what I thought Lee suggested to use. If I had known how to use a computer back in the 80's I might have found a web site like this and learned a lot of things. Every thing I have learned about cast boolits up until recently was self tought. I have really enjoyed this web site, and everyone on here have been of great help.


You wouldnt believe the look on my friends face when he saw my first batch. It was so thick you could cut it with a knife.

[Boolitmeister]

Thanks for all the great info guys. I will be trying LLA pretty soon :)

[Bookworm]

A 5-year-old thread resurrected. This site has an enormous amount of information, sometimes one needs to go mining for it.
FWIW, I never could figure out how to use LLA, and didn't use it until I found Recluse lube (45-45-10). I've had good luck with it, and now I'm preparing to try Ben's Liquid Lube (BLL), using the Lundmark liquid wax, as the Johnson's has become Unobtanium.

Good luck !

[odfairfaxsub]

You can use lots lots and still get great results w handgun. Doesn't take much but I've since gone to powder coat for everything except 38 special, 45 Acp, heavy 9mm, and military loadings. Very successful and no reason to powder coat those

[quilbilly]

I have molds from Lee, RCBS, Saeco, and Lyman. I use it on all for the simplicity and it works on all. Each gets two coats - one before sizing and one after. From now one, don't be a stranger to the site. Belated welcome.

[big bore 99]

I use very little for 45 colt along with a very small glob of paste wax. The wax mixes well with the LLA when tumbling and they dry fast and with no stickyness.

[44man]

I love the stuff, it will kill grass next to my driveway. It also lets your Ford rust out.

[Digital Dan]

I hate it too.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v298/muddler/Guns/Sneezer/Ducks_zpscqr0rx5a.jpg (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/muddler/media/Guns/Sneezer/Ducks_zpscqr0rx5a.jpg.html)

It smells funny.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v298/muddler/Guns/Sneezer/5May4759%202_zps2higuf2o.jpg (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/muddler/media/Guns/Sneezer/5May4759%202_zps2higuf2o.jpg.html)

It can't count. There's 'sposed to be 5 holes in that wad....

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v298/muddler/Guns/Sneezer/11216-4759_zpsnehni36m.jpg (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/muddler/media/Guns/Sneezer/11216-4759_zpsnehni36m.jpg.html)