Are Hard To Eject Casings A Sign Of Too High A Pressure?

[UtopiaTexasG19]

Today I loaded up some new to me .357Mag. bullets in 5 powder stages from lowest grain recommended to highest grain recommended. About 2 minutes cooling between shooting sessions. There were 6 bullets in each batch and when I finally shot the last 6 at the highest grain recommended the fired casings were stuck in the cylinder and almost impossible to get out. Once they cooled they did finally manually eject but were still a bit stubborn. All loads slipped into the cylinder very easily before being ignited. Is the extreme expansion of the brass an indication of too high pressures and should I not use this amount in the future? The formula for the over expanded casings was.....
Dan Wesson .357 Magnum (1974)
Winchester .357 Casings (New)
Winchester WSPM Primers
H-110 at 16.7 grains
Missouri Bullet Company .38 Match/.358 Diameter/158 Grain/LSWC/Brinell 12

I am still waiting on the replacement chronograph I accidentally shot last week so I do not know the fps though the Hodgdon chart shows 1591fps.
I would like to experiment with this higher load unless someone indicates the over expanded casings are a no go.

I cleaned the pistol afterwards and there was abosolutely no leading in the barrel
Thanks...

[MtGun44]

Yes. If you are having trouble extracting cases from your reloads and factory ammo does
not do it, you are too hot and need to reduce the pressure. Remember, each gun is a
thing unto itself. You start low at the recommended starting load and gradually increase
the powder charge, as long as nothing unusual happens. Hard extraction is unusual and
a sign that you need to back off. Personally, I use 16.3 H110 in several .357s, but just
because that works in my guns does NOT mean it is safe in yours.

Definitely, you are PAST safe and not only should not go higher, but you need to go lower.

Have you got several loading manuals and have you read the front of them?

Bill

[Carolina Cast Bullets]

Stiff extraction is one indicator of too high pressure. Look at the primers as well. The primer should not be flattened out on its edges and the firing pin indent
should be a dimple with no "flow"

Any of these by itself is an indication that pressures are too high. If any of them occur in conjunction, its time to back off.

If it were me, I'd not load that again. I'd back off at least 1/2 a grain from that upper load.

Keep in mind, its a pistol, not an elephant gun. Tis better to slack off and keep your gun and your hands than remove either from reality.

My $.02

Jerry
Carolina Cast Bullets

[Huntducks]

Now what do you think maybe to much pressure:shock: this is basic reloading 101 (stuck case hi pressure)

First off you picked a powder that builds up high pressure two i'm sure you only looked for max FPS but what you did not check Hodgdon book list 16.7grs with a Hornady 158gr jacked XTP bullet not a LSWC hodgdon does not even have a load for H-110 with a 158gr LSWC.

Also I see your using a Mag primer that will also push your pressure north if I was you I would back off and try little gun powder CUP is 15,000 less then H-110.

[fredj338]

Most of the time yes, but not always. Some cyl can be rough or have rough spots & even moderat pressure cause sticking. So look at other things like case head marking & flattened primers. If you have all three, then you certainly are running the ragged edge.

[303Guy]

The pressure might not be too high for the steel of the gun but it is too high for the brass - it is sticking after all. It could also be too high for the steel. As stated by others, the other signs would indicate if that is so.

I have had sticking case on loads that showed little pressure on the primer while a different powder showed much higher pressure but did not stick. The cause seems to be pressure build up in the neck of the case. Point being that thetre are pressure waves in a case upon firing that can cause damaging pressure while not showing it at the case head or on the primer.

[Blammer]

based on your description, I would say YES it is too high a pressure and would back off.

[bruce381]

16.5 sticks in my guns once in a while due to the mixed brass I use so i dropped to 16.0 you should to.

[303Guy]

UtopiaTexasG19
It sounds like you are interested in maximizing the performance of you gun. Might I suggest you have a look at Lil'Gun? For the same velocity you get coser to half the pressure. A lot less pressure anyway.

Here is an excerpt from Hodgdon's on-line loading data;

158 GR. HDY XTP Hodgdon H110 .357" 1.580" 16.7 gr 1591 fps 40,700 CUP

158 GR. HDY XTP Hodgdon Lil'Gun .357" 1.580" 18.0 gr 1577 fps 25,800 CUP

Check it out for yourself under 357 Magnum pistol.
http://data.hodgdon.com/cartridge_load.asp

Not suggesting you should do it but it can be compressed quite a bit.

[63 Shiloh]

Hey 303Guy, a little OT, however, what is little gun powder know as down our way?

I have heard it is AP100, not confirmed though. Can you please let me know what ADI powder is little gun?

Mike

[303Guy]

I fear that Lil'Gun is not made by ADI and hense there is no equivalent - pity. It is available over here in NZ so I should imagine it is on your side of the ditch too. Fantastic powder! Its one of those powders I want to find a use for. Magic in the hornet. I'm betting its magic in the 357 too.

[pistolman44]

I got a Dan Wesson SS 44 mag does this after about 15 rounds fired at normal pressure. Every shot after 15 have tight extractions. I have heard this is a familure problem on Dan Wesson revolvers.

[odoh]

Lil' Gun in my larger calibers heats up the barrel in my revolvers and rifle immensely. One shot in my Puma 92 is almost too hot to touch. Others report like experiences but have not heard any reports +/- in the 357. I don't trust it. 4#'s on hand and will not replenish. Hear nothing but good when used in the 22 Hornet tho. YMMV

[lwknight]

It might be that the cylinder is a little dirty or sooty especially if you have been shooting 38 spl's in it. Also your reloads might no be as slick as the new factory brass.

I started having trouble with my gp100 sticking brass in the cylinders sometimes. It was not bad but annoying at least. I polished the cylinder with steel wool and hoppes and no more sticky brass.

[lwknight]

Lil' Gun in my larger calibers heats up the barrel in my revolvers and rifle immensely. One shot in my Puma 92 is almost too hot to touch. Others report like experiences but have not heard any reports +/- in the 357. YMMV

I too was about to try lil'gun till I read several reports suggesting that it might be a little hard on equipment so I decided that H110 was still just fine

[bruce381]

""158 GR. HDY XTP Hodgdon Lil'Gun .357" 1.580" 18.0 gr 1577 fps 25,800 CUP""

WOW that has to be a typo, presure is what gets them going if this is right thats magic

[bruce381]

under 44 mag the presure is higher than h110/296 that 28,000 has to be typo.

[UtopiaTexasG19]

I was loading .38 Specials at the same time as loading the .357's and might have mixed up my figures for HP-38 and the H110. I'll have to look back at some hand written notes and what I transferred to my computer. From now on I'll just re-load one type of bullet at a time. Thanks...

[CATS]

One powder and load on the bench at a time = Good Job!

[Moonie]

I got a Dan Wesson SS 44 mag does this after about 15 rounds fired at normal pressure. Every shot after 15 have tight extractions. I have heard this is a familure problem on Dan Wesson revolvers.

Not my experience with my 7445 SuperMag.

[C.F.Plinker]

I was loading .38 Specials at the same time as loading the .357's and might have mixed up my figures for HP-38 and the H110. I'll have to look back at some hand written notes and what I transferred to my computer. From now on I'll just re-load one type of bullet at a time. Thanks...

Were you putting H110 in your 38 specials? Or could you have had both H110 and HP-38 out on the bench at the same time?

When I worked up H110 loads for my rifle using the 158 grain XTPs I reached my comfort level at 15.2 grains when I exceeded the Hodgdon velocity for the same barrel length using the same brands of brass and primer that Hodgdon did. The group size decreased to less than half of what it was for the 15.0 grain load I tested.

As mentioned above you are using data for jacketed bullets to load lead boolits. Hodgdon does not show any data for H110 and lead boolits. On the lead data they do show, the data for lead starts lower than for jacketed and, except for Universal, maxes out lower than jacketed.

I agree with the others that you are at and probably over max for your pistol with that load.

What were your group sizes for each load?

[Swede44mag]

I had an 8” Blue Dan Wesson .22 that looked like the cylinder had been tapped it was so ruff inside.

My 10” Silhouette Stainless Steel Dan Wesson .22 does not have the same cylinder problem.

The reason I bring this up is you should check the inside of your cylinder for roughness it will cause for hard extraction.
Also since you are shooting .38spc & .357mag in the same gun at the same shooting session it is possible you have a lead build up that could be causing hard extraction.

But as others have mentioned you may be exceeding your guns limits and may have to back off the amount of powder.

BTW I also have a Dan Wesson Stainless Steel .357mag with an 8" barrel.
It is one of the best shooting .357mag pistols I have ever had.

Good Luck be Safe

[9.3X62AL]

16.7 grains of H-110 beneath Lyman #358156 and using SPM primers would be a "Ruger BisHawk-ONLY" load at my place. I've run a few kernels more than this amount in the BisHawk x 357, but the boolit was loaded "long"/crimped in lower groove and departed at roughly 1475 FPS from the Rooger's 7.5" tube. These loads go into red plastic boxes marked "RUGER ONLY" to keep them the h--l OUT of my Model 19. They might not do my pre-27 N-frame a lot of good, either--and wouldn't fit, thankfully. I did shoot a few out of my 686 x 4", and HIJO LA, whatta handful! They extracted easily, but report and muzzle flash was most impressive.

[UtopiaTexasG19]

I had the HP-38 weighted and loaded into the .38 cases and the H110 weighed and loaded in the .357 Mag. cases. I then seated and crimped the .38 cases with the lead cast bullets and when finished started seating and crimped the SAME lead cast bullets in the .357 mag. cases. The whole time the 2 boxes of XTP's were sitting over to the side of my loading bench. The next day when I went out to test the .357 loads it did not dawn on me that they should have had the XTP's installed and not the lead cast bullets.

[Bob Krack]

""158 GR. HDY XTP Hodgdon Lil'Gun .357" 1.580" 18.0 gr 1577 fps 25,800 CUP""

WOW that has to be a typo, presure is what gets them going if this is right thats magic

Bruce,

Reminds me of an old anecdotal "joke". His car had a dead battery so he asked his wife to push him to 30MPH (automatic transmission) so he could get it started. She accelerated to 30 before she started pushing causing massive damage to both cars. (both the boolit and the gun).

He was kinda thinking about starting out slowly and building up speed, not causing damage to either car (the boolit or the gun).

Think about it? :mrgreen:

Bob

[MtGun44]

With a good boolit and good fit and good lube this is a "so what" situation. I shoot no GC
soft (8 BHN) boolits of several designs in multiple .357s over 16.3 of H110 with great accuracy and
zero leading. No real need for short or full length GCs in .357, even at full velocity.

Bill