Accuracy (for me)

[jrayborn]

Just me rambling...

I have been a shooter for an awful long time, I'm 40 and had the itch since I was 8 with my BB gun's and shot them constantly. As I got older I had .22's both Long Rifle and Magnums, and spent every nickle I could on ammo. I shot a lot as a youngster, it was my thing and I got pretty good at it.

Older still I joined the Marine Corps and actually got taught how to shoot a rifle. Wow, its easy to do when you have good instruction (and I did). I could make even the most worn out M16-A2 earn me "Expert" if I concentrated. In my 6 years I shot expert 8 times...every time actually. 500 yards, and if I can see you, you are going to have a bad day.

So when I became a civilian again my interests naturally came back to shooting and I saved and saved and got an M1-A. I learned everything I could about that rifle and can easily keep my shots in a 12" target prone and slung from 300. Not much to brag about but I have never ever been the type who could hold .5 MOA. I have never been lucky enough to be with anyone else who did either though so I don't feel so bad.

Now at this point I have almost 100 different rifles and pistols. Mostly I shoot at steel targets not paper because its fun. I like to hear the clang and its easier than walking back and forth to hang targets, plus if anyone else is at the range I like to offer to let them hit it too, always gets them smiling..

So I can usually hit what I aim at with a rifle and with a pistol I would say I am better than some and leave it at that. I have recently in the last few years become completely infatuated with Ruger revolvers and have a SP101 and GP100 both in .327 mag (one for each of my boys) and a .45 colt Redhawk. The GP and SP both shoot like lasers and at 50 yards I hit my plates with little trouble but that Redhawk on the other hand is another story.

So finally this weekend I decided to get a bit more serious and shoot some paper. Most normal people would have done this a while back, but lets just say I am unique. First I shot the GP100 off a rest with a my load of NOE 313640 120 grain bullet/2400 combo and was shocked to see an inch group at 20 yards. I know that to most of you that is a huge group but to me that was very good, and unexpected, I have had this revolver for only about a month. Thank you Ruger!

The SP101 was very similar but I have owned it a couple years and it needed a bit of tweaking of the forcing cone and the barrel had to be firelapped to get the leading to stop, but it shot very well too.

I was working up to it so I took up the Redhawk up next and shot a very unexpected group at only 20 yards, but still 3rounds cloverleafed and 3 within about a inch of them. I was shocked. I cannot get this gun to shoot but here it is on paper with a nice group. I even tried a couple cylinders of 325 grain boolits over 2400 and it was right on, a bit off to the right but very very good.

I had been really cursing this revolver but it would certainly seem that I am the issue with it. I think that I am not so good with the heavy recoil and shortish (4") barrel. My 325 grain loads clock at 1000 fps and I read of some that like 1200, wow. I think I need to find some lighter loads and shoot more paper with this gun, and I think I will be happy :)

[Doc Highwall]

I say paper targets never lie. If you really want to shoot your best, constant load development is not the way by looking for the magic load.

Find a load that shoots better off a bench then you can shoot standing and practice a lot with it.

Also get a 22rf to match your gun and shoot that a lot also.

I have 22rf guns to match almost all my center fire guns for both plinking and serious match shooting.

Shooting a 22rf match rifle with match ammo at 1035fps - 1080fps is A LOT HARDER TO SHOOT THEN A 308 Win AT 2600fps.
It takes more then twice as long for the bullet to get out of the barrel making follow-through VERY IMPORTANT, not forgetting wind reading skills.

[crabo]

I like making targets like these. I like to practice the same sight picture and type of targets whenever possible. The misses can give you as much information as the hits. Most public and private gun clubs will not let you shoot steel.

I second the recommendation to shoot .22s a lot, particulary if you can get it in the same type of gun that you also shoot your centerfire in.

[fredj338]

DOn't let anyone tell you that 1" groups @ 20yds isn't good shooting, both for you & the gun, it is quite good. Most service semiautos won't make much better than 3" @ 25yds, most revolvers will do half that. Yes you can tweek & tinker to do better w/ most guns, but not a lot better than 1" @ 20yds IME, which is not limited to close fast shooting on plates.

[243winxb]

but it would certainly seem that I am the issue Have you tried this. > Have someone load the gun with 3 rounds so you dont know if its going to fire or not. See what happens when you pull the trigger.

[jrayborn]

I've really just never been one to worry about tiny groups, I pretty much figured that most people, shall we say, embellish their skills with most shooting. I am very happy to hit a 12"x12" steel plate at 50 yards with a handgun 4 or 5 times out of six. I never expected all three Ruger revolvers to hold a nice group like they did.

And yes to me there is no doubt about flinching. With the .45 Redhawk after a couple cylinders, it seems like the single action trigger is about 50 pounds. Ever see someone flinch from a rest?? Thats me!

I am quite honestly just really happy to know the guns all shoot so well and will happily practice lots more so hopefully I will improve. I suppose what I really have learned is that I need to shoot paper more and maybe try some more moderate Colt loads. I was really quite unhappy with the Redhawk at first, it has always been on my short list. Really made my day to see it shoot so well.

[303Guy]

That's a brilliant idea! I'm goint to incorporate it into my targets.

[Cariboo]

Have you tried this. > Have someone load the gun with 3 rounds so you dont know if its going to fire or not. See what happens when you pull the trigger.

years ago my buddy would load my revolver an I his, real light wadcutters to full house mag. sure was interesting to see the flinches and to see them become fewer as time went on.

[44man]

I believe in the opposite!
SHOOT FARTHER. 20 yards is for a slingshot, did you know you have a gun?
Find someone with some heavier guns, .44, etc.
Have someone load for you and get rid of the flinch off the bench first.
Find out what heavy guns do and how they feel. Go stronger and stronger then what you have.
You can shoot a .22 all your life and fall apart when you are handed a real gun. Your brain will be wired for the .22 ONLY.
It will let you down fast if it thinks RECOIL!
Starting small is good for a beginner learning safety and trigger control. That does not prepare you for RECOIL.
If you want to fall asleep with your .45, have coaching with a .44 mag or .475 for a while.
Sorry but even if you get real good with the .45, if someone hands you a .475 or .500 you will be out of your comfort zone and out of your mind. Your brain will not accept it.
I assure you that if you get real good with the GP100 off hand, you will be a big mess with the first shot from a cannon. I have tater rows on my range from tough guys.
Work your way DOWN, not up. It might take a friend with a club. If you know how to shoot, change your brain wires.
If a .44 mag scares the hell out of you, GO UP, then the .44 will feel mighty fine. The GP100 will be a BB gun.
Going from a .22 to a .38 to a .357, to a .44 special, to a .44 mag is an old, tired way. Each step up means training all over again.
Same in the army. Shoot the Springfield, then the M1 then go to the toy M16 and just watch what you can do.

[jrayborn]

Thanks guys for the help.

44 Man Thanks for the insight. I can assure you fear plays no role in my shooting. I have no desire to shoot .44 magnums when my .45 Colt is capable of similar performance nor do I have the desire to shoot 500 ubermags. To me they serve no useful purpose, but I am sure they are a blast to shoot. I absolutely do agree though that if I were to start shooting bigger magnums on a very regular basis that I would soon man up, or flinch even worse. You make a valid point though.

As for shooting to only 20 yards, heck it may have been 15, I'm not sure. I was with my 9 year old son so we were just out having a good time. One of the best days I have had in years to be honest. He shot my MarkIII faster than I could load the mags for him :)

I have taken 9 classes in the last couple years and have actually learned a bunch. They were geared mostly toward self defence/speed/employment of handguns and carbines and believe me when I tell you I am not the type to brag, but I did better than most, but I would truly love to spend some time with guys that hold tiny little groups with revolvers. I have read too many stories to think its all internet bravado and would just love the opportunity to learn.

Fortunately for me I learn a bunch from this forum and some others so there may still be hope :)

Thanks!

[Echo]

Have you tried this. > Have someone load the gun with 3 rounds so you dont know if its going to fire or not. See what happens when you pull the trigger.

+1. It's called Ball & Dummy practice, and you can load the cylinder yourself. Two together, skip a chamber, another live one, skip another, and skip another. Spin the cylinder and snap it in without cheating. Your jerks will be obvious to all involved, but mainly to yourself.

[44man]

I understand, the .45 is a great gun. But you can do the same with it.
Make some heavier loads and get used to them. Do the ball and dummy stuff. Shoot until it is comfortable to you. You really will start to like it.
It is not fear that causes the problem, it is the expectation of more recoil without conscious thought. Your mind will try to resist it without your help.
Flinch is common unless you shoot thousands of rounds a day. I have the problem with a few off hand shots even though I do not flinch from a rest with any gun, even the big .500's. Believe it or not, I can flinch with a .22 off hand if I don't talk myself out of it. I have to talk to my stupid mind for every shot. Bob Munden I am NOT! :mrgreen:
You are not alone my friend! :Fire:
Yet there is something about shooting heavy stuff a little even if you shoot a friends guns so you start to get used to it. Stay reasonable, don't try it with a 2# .44. Just a little more recoil then you mostly shoot is good enough.
It is as simple as shooting a .357 for a while if you shoot the .38. Shoot a .38 if you shoot the .22.
I love my .475 so shooting a friends .500 has made me more comfortable with my gun. The .475 has made my .44 feel really nice. But I still can flinch with the stupid .22! A bottle of Jack is my salvation. :drinks: