More crimp and seating depth questions

[mac1911]

34463

34464

34465

Ok so I started loading for 38 special
Where on this style of bullet should the crimp be ?
The Lee load data says a min OAL of 1.42 with bullseye and 158gn Semi wad cutter. It does not specify what style of semi wad cutter though.

Im right at the cusp of the 1.42 min limit and I crimp just enough as to not catch my finger nail on the case mouth rim ?
Good ? Bad ? On the right track ?

I cant tell you what went wrong with 2nd cartridge from the left.

[462]

You've mixed brass: The case of the second cartridge from the left is shorter, thus the boolit didn't seat as deep.

[MtGun44]

If you have widely varying brass length, most crimping systems give you very different
crimps. If you trim to a common length you will have consistent crimps. This is (IMO) the
only real reason to trim straight case pistol brass.

As to the original question, most revolver boolits have a crimp groove and for most guns
that works well. There are some notable exceptions like the Keith 358429 in a short
cylinder N-frame S&W (27 or 28) where the boolit has to be seated way deeper than the
crimp groove to keep from protruding past the front of the cylinder.

Bill

[nicholst55]

With revolver ammo, uniform case length is more important than with auto pistol cartridges. If your case length varies, so will the seating depth of your bullets and the crimp. Probably not as critical with a mild-recoiling cartridge like .38 Spl as for .44 Mag or .454 Casull, but still important.

Especially if you're using mixed brass, you might want to trim it all to a uniform length before you load it the first time. A lot of folks say that they never trim pistol brass, but I trim my revolver brass once when I first start loading it. The case mouths will probably split before you need to trim it again.

JMHO.

[para45lda]

I agree that you have at least one case (2nd from left in bottom pic) that is shorter.

Presuming all the rest are the same length it looks like you need to seat them out a little further. The edge of the case mouth should be in the groove above the loob groove. The one on the left in the second picture looks pretty close. IMHO.

[Old Caster]

If the crimp groove is real wide you can get away with quite a bit of varying length in a .38 especially if your loads aren't real stout where you need a strong crimp. If you are shooting HBWC's where the brass actually goes a few thou in front of the bullet it is real important to trim. This is probably the biggest reason that people have trouble with reloads in their model 52 Smith's and an uneven and unsquare mouth can cause bullets to tip in flight. I recently found this to be true with 32 and HBWC's but the difference here of 3 or 4 thousandths is enough to cause trouble although I don't know whether being out of square or varying lengths cause the most problems. 38 brass might just hold the position of being the most variable length brass there is because some brands are .010 different when new. If you have the equipment to trim, you might as well do it as mentioned above to not worry about it again. -- Bill --

[mac1911]

34471

is this better ? I set the die to put the brass just inside the crimp ring.

I also trimmed all my brass. I tried getting away with the trimming. the 200 cases I have where all 1.4 or taller with 1.47 being the tall average. I figured I could get away with that.

[mac1911]

34472 better pic maybe ?

[cajun shooter]

It appears with my older eyes and maybe not your loading that you don't quite have enough crimp in the first photos. I have seen some incorrect posting of late on the reason to crimp. Yes it is first to hold the bullet in the case and keep it from moving under recoil of another round being fired in the revolver cylinder. With certain powders that have a burn rate that is gradual and smooth to it's peak pressure point in the curve, every round that is uniform will give the correct pressure and be the same. If they are different and in different places on your bullet then your target of choice will appear to be shot from a shotgun. A nice even and smooth roll crimp will show up down range. I think that your round that is said to be short may well have been not open wide enough for seating a lead bullet and you have shaving. I also find that you get better rounds when you load in 4 stages instead of three. By that I mean seating and crimping in separate stages. The Redding Profile Crimp die gives that factory looking roll crimp that is desirable to good ammo. I have always felt that a tool meant to do one thing is better than a tool that has to multi task.

[mac1911]

OK I been doing double duty with learning to cast, reload and use my camera better. I think this pic if the crimp is a tad better than the previous. I think the crimps are better also.

[MikeS]

OK I been doing double duty with learning to cast, reload and use my camera better. I think this pic if the crimp is a tad better than the previous. I think the crimps are better also.

You need to seat your boolits deeper into the case, it looks like you have the case mouth right at the bottom of the crimp groove, it needs to be at least half way up in the crimp groove. Having said that, the real test is how they shoot. If you can shoot them without the boolits coming out of the case under recoil, and they go into the chamber without forcing it in, than it might be fine. Don't get hung up on published overall lengths, with cast boolits it's a whole different ball game, and different boolit/gun combinations might work differently in different guns.

[EDK]

You just have to play with the seating depth and amount of crimp. Your later photos show better settings...you're getting close to what I would want. (I have the added need of having the 357 and 44 ammo work in my MARLIN Cowboy Rifles, so the case mouth MUST be rolled into the crimp groove so as not to hang up in the rifle chamber during the feeding cycle.)

Two "quick and dirty" solutions would be a LEE FACTORY CRIMP DIE or a taper crimp. Your case length variations would not mess you up with either of them.

You might want to expand the case mouths a very small amount more.

You're definitely on the right track and getting close to the goal.