Hercules 2400 Rifle Powder?

[philthephlier]

I bought an unopened 1lb can of Hercules 2400. I didn't notice until I got it home that it said Rifle Powder under the 2400 on the label. It is an older can of powder that someone traded in at my favorite reloading supply store. Is this the same 2400 that is commonly used for magnum pistol loads?

[44man]

Yes, of course. Same as all the shotgun powders used in revolvers. All powders cross the lines.

[Rocky Raab]

According to early Hercules load sheets, 2400 was indeed considered a rifle powder - it was developed for the .22 Hornet in which it gave (you guessed it) 2,400 fps.

[fredj338]

It's funny as there are few rifle rounds loaded w/ 2400. It's long been a magnum handgun powder, you are good to go for any straight walled magnum round.

[timkelley]

It's also useful for reduced loads in mid size rifles. I like to make lead plinker's in 30-30, and 8mm.

[williamwaco]

According to early Hercules load sheets, 2400 was indeed considered a rifle powder - it was developed for the .22 Hornet in which it gave (you guessed it) 2,400 fps.



The first can of powder I ever purchased was one pound of "Hercules Unique Rifle" powder. Second was 2400. They are still my go-to powders. Especially for cast bullets in rifles.

[Lutzy48]

I use 2400 in my 357 rounds with a 158 gr. Lee RF boolet. Works well in my Ruger Vaquero as well as my Marlin 1894 Cowboy.

[Boolseye]

I started with an old can of 2400, too. Wish I'd held onto the can!

[chboats]

philthephlier - 2400 has changed over the years. The older powders are a little slower burning. If you work up a load with the old powder you will need to do it again with the newer powder. I had a great load from 30 yr old 2400 in a 308 but the newer powder didn't work as well in that load.

Carl

[Larry Gibson]

Have to disagree about 2400 has changed over the years. The older powders are a little slower burning.

The technicians at Alliant say the formula has not changed. My own extensive pressure testing in numerous cartridges shows only the normal lot to lot variation between Hercules and Alliant 2400s. Sometimes one is faster burning than the other but it is more dependent on cartridge and bullet weith than anything else.

The difference between old data and new data is simply that with the modern piezoelectric transducers pressure measurement systems we get a much better and more complete picture of interior ballistics than with the old CUP method. Taking the classic Kieth load of 22 gr 2400 under a 240 - 255 gr cast SWC with get you very close to the SAAMI MAP (Maximum Average Pressure) of 35,000 psi for the 44 Magnum with either the Hercules or Alliant 2400 powder. Depending on bullet and lot of either powder it may actually go over the SAAMI MAP. That's what I have found with either powder, Hercules or Alliant.

I've found no reason to doubt the technicians at Alliant that the formula for 2400 has not changed.

Larry Gibson

[Rocky Raab]

I agree with Larry that the formula has not changed. Nor have the performance specifications, so even if a given lot doesn't match as it comes out of the tun, they blend it and test it until it does meet the performance specs.

What does happen , however, is that older powder can and does sometimes change a bit due to aging. So a can of powder made 50 years ago may not perform exactly as a can made today might. But that's due to aging, not a change in formula or specifications.

[pdawg_shooter]

Larry nailed it. I have both and use them equally in my .357 and 44s.

[1Shirt]

My go to powder! Been using it for many many years in rifle and revolvers because it just plain works. Unique is a close runner up. Am never without both of them.
1Shirt!:coffeecom

[williamwaco]

Well,

I don't have pressure equipment. I do have a chronograph and have had since 1970. Built that one from a kit.

I have been using 2400 since 1956 in .38 Special, .357 Mag. .41 Mag, .44 Mag., .30-30, .38-55. I am using the exact same loads today that I did all those years ago. I can notice no difference in normal pressure signs, performance, or accuracy.

[punk427]

Im also going to have to agree with larry. I worked up some loads in certain rifle calibers with cast bullets with alliant 2400, and last month I got a killer deal on an old unopened 4lb cardboard barrel of Hercules 2400 and have used the same load with the same results. Its just one of those powders from development that just didn't need any improvements, it does perfectly for what its intended for.

[JeffinNZ]

Fantastic cast boolit powder. So glad it's available in NZ again.

[MtGun44]

Jeff! Were you guys out of 2400! Not good.
Hope it wasn't long, it is such a mainstay powder for cast rifle and mag
handgun loads. Is there an ADI powder that is close?

Bill

[303Guy]

The closest ADI powder would be AR2205 which is H4227. I like it as a lower power paper patch powder. I can't say that it's better or worse than 2400 as I've never tried it.

[Cosmiceyes]

I buy the big kegs of 2400.Love my straight wall cases. I did just get a load for a 8x57 using 2400. My eyes opened up on that one too. I'm a 5744 fan when it comes to low pressure fast heavy rifle boolits. One old dog teaching this one a trick! :)'s

[pmeisel]

Love my 2400 in the 357. Getting ready to try it as a mid-range load in the 444.

[leadman]

Also works in the 410 shotgun.

[aspangler]

8mm Cast load for me that chronos at 2030fps is 24.9 gr. 2400 under the lyman 165gr boolit cast from coww, gas checked with hornady checks and lubed and size to .323. 1 inch groups at 100 yd and enough power to drop a deer at up to 150yds.

[JeffinNZ]

Jeff! Were you guys out of 2400! Not good.
Hope it wasn't long, it is such a mainstay powder for cast rifle and mag
handgun loads. Is there an ADI powder that is close?

Bill

Alliant was not available at all here for many, many years. I rate 2400 over H4227.

We get the privilege of paying twice what you do for ADI powders even though they are made just over the ditch. The Alliant is actually cheaper.

[303Guy]

Do you use 2400 with a powder positioner, Jeff? Wool, I'd assume? My AR2205 is about used up so now I'm thinking of 2400 as a replacement. Can someone post a photo of the stuff please? I have to be careful with powder appearance. I wouldn't want to confuse it with W748 and blow myself up, for example! Yeah, I know but I am absent minded and I have survived this long by taking extra precautions.:roll: I already have some Lil'Gun but find it a trifle faster in the 303 Brit. (Great stuff for the hornet).

[Hamish]

I have been using 2400 since 1956 in .38 Special, .357 Mag. .41 Mag, .44 Mag., .30-30, .38-55.

Hmmm, no mention of the Hornet. [smilie=1:

OK, yall have convinced me. I've had a can of 2400 in my hand on two separate occasions in the last month and put it back.

[JeffinNZ]

Do you use 2400 with a powder positioner, Jeff? Wool, I'd assume?.

Aboslutely. One of my wool wads. Makes a difference.

[303Guy]

I found the remainder of the wool wads you so kindly sent me to sample. The wool seems to burn up completely, no little balls of fizzled Dacron. It has an 'aroma' of its own, doesn't it. :wink:

[Mal Paso]

I go through a Keg of 2400 every few months. I've been finding other uses for the empty kegs but since Alliant changed the label last year these might be "Vintage". What do you think should be opening Flebay bid for a "Genuine Vintage Plastic 2400 Powder Keg".[smilie=l:

[JeffinNZ]

Holy cow Mal. What do you do? Use it for fertiliser?

[onehousecat]

If I could only have two pistol powders, 2400 would be one of them (Unique the other). There are powders that give higher velocities than 2400, but their range of loads is much narrower. With 2400 you can make 44 mag loads that are really pleasant to shoot, or you can make them stiff enough to hunt with.

[gray wolf]

Nice pic of the empty cans--but--- I see some bogus cans thrown in for effect.

[Mal Paso]

Holy cow Mal. What do you do? Use it for fertiliser?

I shoot 44 Mag. About 1,000 rounds a month. I've burned 112 pounds mostly 19g at a time which is 41,263 rounds. Sounds about right. I started with 296/H110 but found 2400 a better match for my 4 & 6 inch revolvers. I'm sure I found the 2400 info (and everything else) here.

[Mal Paso]

Nice pic of the empty cans--but--- I see some bogus cans thrown in for effect.

No Bogus Cans! I pealed the labels off some to put on 1 pound bottles for the bench and my ammo box. They are all empty 2400 kegs. That's just the empty ones I saved and none of the full ones.

They are fairly heavy HDPE and as you can see I've been experimenting making parts bins out of them. For a few years I'd been tossing them in a corner intending to use them for something. Earlier this year I cleaned that corner and counted my empties. I started laughing thinking No Way but I had burned 100 lbs by then.

Hello, my name is Mal .........

[mstarling]

Have used 2400 for medium hot loads in .357 and .41 Mag for the better part of 45 years!

Have recently found it makes a good propellant for 300 BLK and 338 Spectre as well.

[emery]

How about Hercules 2400 for 45 LC loads

[JonB_in_Glencoe]

2400 would be an excellent choice for "ruger only" loads in 45 colt.

[DirtyJack]

That was my first powder behind a 158g hornady swaged bullet. 14g and leaded like crazy. I got an intro to the Lewis lead remover.

[robg]

Used 2400 since the eighties in 357 mag and cast loads in 308 .my favourite powder for flexibility in loading and meters well through power measures.

[GooseGestapo]

The most accurate load I've ever shot in a .45 Colt is with #2400. Nosler lists it in their manual as such. 20.0gr #2400, 250gr JHP. Gets 1,200 fps from 5.5" Ruger.
My 24"bbl WinM94 shoots it to 1,700fps, 1" groups at 100yds with 250gr XTP.

Gets 1,500fps with 310gr Lee FNGC. Once shot a 5-shot, one hole group at 25yds with my RedHawk with this load. It wasn't fun to shoot, though!!!

[Green Frog]

Just a quick comment on the question about so few mentions of 2400 in rifles... it was designed primarily for reduced loads when used in “full size” rifle cases, a style of loading few rifle shooters embrace that heavily. Once old Elmer Keith and his cohorts found out how well it worked in hot pistol loads, that skewed the interest away from “low performance” rifle loads to “high performance” revolver loads. That’s my story and I’m sticking to it! :bigsmyl2:

Froggie

[JonB_in_Glencoe]

Just a quick comment on the question about so few mentions of 2400 in rifles... it was designed primarily for reduced loads when used in “full size” rifle cases,

>>>SNIP
I've never heard that?
I've only heard about the connection of 2400 to 22 Hornet.

http://www.lasc.us/taylorpaco22hornet.htm


History seems to suggest that 2400 powder from Hercules Powder Company came about because of the 22 Hornet... at the time the powder being used was 1201 (early boxes so marked, later boxes 1204). This powder was also being used as a handgun powder... Keith speaks of it in passing, saying only 2400 far out shines it.

A report in the 1930s RIFLEMAN states that Whelen pushed Hercules to have a new powder manufactured. And it was named 2400 because it would generate 2400 plus fps from the Hornet rifles with 45 grain bullets.

[Larry Gibson]

Phil Sharpe states in his Complete Guide To Handloading published in '37 in describing Hercules 2400 powder;

"It was designed particularly for such cartridges as the .22 Hornet, 25-20, etc., and here it is at it's best."

[quilbilly]

I have two 308 shooting CB's. One absolutely loves 2400 (19.6 gr.) with 160 gr. boolits and the other doesn't. Both have the same twist but the one that likes 2400 has a 6" longer barrel if that means anything.

[Green Frog]

Well, amphibian memory isn’t all it should be, but it seems like back in the dark ages of the 1970s when I started reloading, 2400 was being used for 357s & 44 mags, for reduced loads in. 30-06 target loads and occasionally 45-70s, and by the occasional skeet shooter in 410 shells. The 22 Hornet and the 25-20 (WCF & SS) were pretty moribund at the time, so I guess that’s why I didn’t hear them emphasized. Maybe I should have said “devoted to” rather than “designed primarily for.” I do know it makes a dandy 100 yd target load for 30-06. Anyway, I’ll humbly stand corrected.

Froggie

[Moonie]

I won a case of 1lb containers of 2400 recently at an auction for about $100. While I do have a 357 and 45 convertible NMBH that I can use it in I've been looking for other cartridges and I honestly don't seem to have anything else to use it in. I guess I need to do more 357 shooting, or get more guns... lol

[Littlefish]

Well, amphibian memory isn’t all it should be, but it seems like back in the dark ages of the 1970s when I started reloading, 2400 was being used for 357s & 44 mags, for reduced loads in. 30-06 target loads and occasionally 45-70s, and by the occasional skeet shooter in 410 shells. The 22 Hornet and the 25-20 (WCF & SS) were pretty moribund at the time, so I guess that’s why I didn’t hear them emphasized. Maybe I should have said “devoted to” rather than “designed primarily for.” I do know it makes a dandy 100 yd target load for 30-06. Anyway, I’ll humbly stand corrected.

Froggie
Froggie, back in those dark days of the 70's were you also a disco dancer?:razz: I've been using 2400 (occasionally) since about then and the last time I bought any it came in cardboard cylinder cans. Just started loading for Colt 45 recently and that old 2400 seems to work fine with a semi warm load under a 255gr Laser Cast SWC (heavy crimp) in a large frame Vaquero. Expect it should be good for hogs not too far out.

[Shuz]

2400 has been an excellent powder for me and a friend in our .308 Winchesters. His is a Howa 1500 and mine is a Savage Mdl 11. We've found that from 16g to 19g and a 195g, NOE 311-202cup point can be a real tack driver if we do our part. It meters extremely well in a Dillon 450 measure, and that is real important when loading with a semi-progressive machine.

[tomon]

My 45-70 Rifle load is 21gr of 2400 under a 378gr RNGC boolit from Burnham Bill. It'll hold the Xring at 100yd if I can! I'm mining the 308 loads, and any 30-06 ones I can!

[Char-Gar]

According to early Hercules load sheets, 2400 was indeed considered a rifle powder - it was developed for the .22 Hornet in which it gave (you guessed it) 2,400 fps.

Bingo....Give that man a seegar!

[303Guy]

According to early Hercules load sheets, 2400 was indeed considered a rifle powder - it was developed for the .22 Hornet in which it gave (you guessed it) 2,400 fps.
My understanding is that the name comes from the velocity it produces in the 22 hornet and as Rocky Raab pointed out, it was developed for the hornet. That would be 2400 fps with a 40 grain bullet. And here I'm getting 2740 fps with a 55 gr bullet using Lil'Gun in R-P cases ( larger capacity cases plus my rifle has a large chamber) - with indefinite case life :D.