The tinsel fairy is real and she is a brutal teacher

[Love Life]

Moderators-I wasn't sure where to post this one so I apologize if it's in the wrong spot.

Here goes. There have been many discussions on this forum concerning the tinsel fairy, how much water is needed to cause a visit, pre-heating ingots before adding them to the hot pot, and safety gear. Well here is what happened to a friend of mine today.

My friend got into casting his own boolits about a month ago. I gave him all the pointers on safety including the right clothing, ensuring all moisture is kept away from a hot pot, and preheating ingots. I even provided the link to this wonderful site and told him to read, read, and read some more. Well he did read, but I don't believe it was this site. He read on the internet some where that you don't have to pre-heat ingots before adding them to a hot pot.

Well he called me today and the first thing he says is "My pot blew up!! What made it happen?" After asking some questions we figured it out. He added a cold 2 pound ww ingot to his hot pot. According to him about 1 second after he dropped the ingot in lead just erupted from the 20 pound pot. He now has severe burns on his face, arms, and scalp. Burnt off his hair to.

I am now heading to buy myself a clear face shield and to check up on him. Maybe he'll let me take pictures after the customary at least you were already ugly jokes.

I know it has been said before, but after this all I can say please heed all the safety precautions and wear good protective gear while casting.

Dick

[Matt_G]

OUCH!!! :holysheep

Sorry to hear that your friend had to learn this lesson the hard way. :(

[BulletFactory]

I just set the ingots on the little electric skillet that was originally just intended to preheat the mold. I had one pop last week and it made one heckuva mess. No injuries though.

[HeavyMetal]

Some times, if you do it just right with just the right combo of ingot temp to hot alloy in the pot, it doesn't explode it just does one heck of a gurgling act with a bubbling rise about 2 inches above the pot!

This will make the hair on your neck ( and several other places) stand at attention!

Please tell your friend I am sorry he had to learn this lesson in such a harsh way and suggest he contact the web poster, show him a picture or two of his burns, and add the word lawyer a time or two to the text.

Maybe that will scare that "dweeb" into being a lot more careful about what he posts!

Once again I hope your freind recovers with no permanant injuries!

[Colorado4wheel]

I never preheat my ingots. I made them myself. Don't know how the moisture would get into the ingot after I make them. Just trying to understand how this would happen.

[cbrick]

I never preheat my ingots. I made them myself. Don't know how the moisture would get into the ingot after I make them. Just trying to understand how this would happen.

Temp difference.

I had the same thing happen several years ago. When I got everything out and heated the pot, added ingots and was ready to flux & start casting there was a 1 pound ingot that had fallen on the floor. It was winter & cold, no water involved, the floor had a rubber mat covering, no cement floor. I bent over & picked up the ingot & dropped it into the pot.

I had no idea I could move that fast. I went straight back about 10 feet landing on my hieny with my feet towards the pot. Nearly emptied the RCBS 22 pound pot, had lead all over the ceiling, three walls, bench & floor. I had lead on my shoes & Levi's but didn't get burned. All I could say was "Holy doggie doo doo Batman". Well, that's not really what I said but this is family forum.

I eventually got all the lead cleaned up except for a little I left on the ceiling as a reminder of what an idiot I was for doing that. Never did get my shorts clean, had to throw them away (didn't want to save that reminder).

I had always heard that when melting lead you should always make sure the area around is you clear and I learned that this is very sound advice, had there been a stool or something behind me to impeed my backwards flight through the air the outcome would have been far worse than a mess.

Yep, I pre-heat my ingots if the pot is already hot and in fact I did that night too. Except for that one.

This hobby is only as safe as you make it and even then only if you keep your wits about you.

Rick

[Matt_G]

Yikes Rick. I'll bet that was a sight!
It's amazing how fast condensation can form when the conditions are right for it. (temperature differences and humidity)

[geargnasher]

I, too hope your friend comes out just as handsome as he was before! That really sucks. An exploding pot of lead seems to be statistically more injurous than an exploding revolver.

Even a small ball of lint stuck to the ingot can do it. Water is absorbed by just about everything, and once it goes over 212 degrees it expands 1600 times just about instantly, with thousands of PSI of force. I had a spider make one heck of a gurgle once, I used to slowly add ingots, holding them with a glove and dipping them slowly into the pot while listening for the faintest sound of the Tinsel Faerie's grumble, this time it popped slightly without warning and I saw the remains of two or three spider legs smoldering in the lead left in the pot.

[BulletFactory]

Hahahahaha

[Mossy Nugget]

Yikes Rick. I'll bet that was a sight!
It's amazing how fast condensation can form when the conditions are right for it. (temperature differences and humidity)

Wow! bring a cold ingot into a warm, humid shop and moisture condenses on it. Drop it in the pot, Wham! Thank you very much! I would have repeated that mistake as surely as history. :goodpost:

[dragonrider]

Colorado4 wheel, take heed of what is being said here and preheat your ingots before you add them to the pot or you will one day be telling us of your visit from the tinsel fairy. Who made the ingots does not matter, temp difference is the key here, condensation will form on an ingot with the right circumstances. Preheat, the risk is not worth doing otherwise.

[cbrick]

Wow! bring a cold ingot into a warm, humid shop and moisture condenses on it. Drop it in the pot, Wham! Thank you very much! I would have repeated it as surely as history. :goodpost:

More curious than that Mossy. This is California, while it was winter & cold (for CA) it hadn't rained in months, the ingots are stored in the shop and in fact on the floor (rubber covered plywood) at the end of the casting bench, the shop wasn't heated as the ceiling vent when casting just sucks the heat out anyway.

But it happened anyway.

I sure recommend pre-heating ingots when the pot is already hot. Yep, I really do.

Rick

[selmerfan]

I always dip one end of the ingot into the pot until I can no longer hold it with my gloved hand. Haven't had it burn me yet...

[Doc Highwall]

This is a second reason to have a mould warmer. If you set your mould warmer to say 300deg. which is higher then the boiling point of water but not hot enough to melt lead, I put my ingots on the hot plate it will remove any water preventing this. I have a hot plate with a piece of aluminum on top of it with a thermometer stuck into it so I know what temperature it is. When I am goin to cast I place my mould on the plate along with ingots to pre heat them.

[runfiverun]

i keep a 1/2" steel top on my pots at all times.
i use it to hold ingots before they go into the pot, it's also a handy place to keep the mold while the pot melts.
it has saved a few bubble overs, at least confined them to one area.
usually right on top of my pile of shiney boolits.

[Ole]

I bet your friend won't do that again!

[Blammer]

preheat ingots to prevent tisel fairy showing up.

hmm, never heard of that before and I've never done it.

oh well, to each his own.

[Charlie Two Tracks]

Sorry to hear about your friend. That lead burns fast and deep! Thanks for posting. It keeps me from getting careless.

[Love Life]

It has rained here the last 2 days in a row and with all the snow we had this winter and spring there is a lot of moisture in the air. I didn't get to go see him today, but talked to him on the phone again. He says thank you for the good wishes. He took an ingot from the concrete floor(about 50 degrees) and put it straight into the pot. I asked if he heard any gurgling noises prior to the explosion, and he said no. He said it a happened pretty much instantaniously. I have always preheated my ingots when adding to a hot pot based off of the advice on this forum and because its so easy to do it. Just place a stack of ingots on the hot plate while you cast. They melt faster and don't lower the temp as much.

Whether people preheat or not is entirely up to them. I just wanted to pass this experience on so people caould see the possible consequences. I will see my buddy at work tomorrow and see if he'll chime in on here.

[Ohio Rusty]

I had a small half inch lead pipe about 10 inches long, that had set on the shelf for a year, I had assumed it was dry inside. Apparently ther was some moisture trapped inside. I put the pipe in teh pot to melt and I heard a hissing sound coming from the pipe. I moved out of the way, and a lump of molten lead shot from the pipe across the garage like a shot boolit !!

The pot didn't erupt, but it gave me more of a caution type nature to unkown lead and moisture.
Ohio Rusty ><>

[Tom W.]

I keep ingots on the bottom shelf of my component cabinet. The house is generally 76-78 degrees, but if I put an ingot into the lead pot it will make the pot boil for a few seconds. These ingots have been poured and inside the house for well over a year....I won't put them in barehanded, I'll use a pair of channel locks.

Most of the time I'll warm them on top of the pot first.

[kelbro]

105° here today and 4% humidity but I still warm my ingots up on the hotplate.

[Mal Paso]

My melt stir spoon is stainless steel, which from fluxing has a thin layer of carbon on it. If I put the spoon into the melt too fast at the beginning of a session there is enough moisture absorbed into the carbon to blow lead out of the pot.

Steam is impressive.

[geargnasher]

This is a second reason to have a mould warmer. If you set your mould warmer to say 300deg. which is higher then the boiling point of water but not hot enough to melt lead, I put my ingots on the hot plate it will remove any water preventing this. I have a hot plate with a piece of aluminum on top of it with a thermometer stuck into it so I know what temperature it is. When I am goin to cast I place my mould on the plate along with ingots to pre heat them.

I do the same. The ingots don't need to be hotter than the boiling point of water, just higher than the dewpoint of the air.

Gear

[Doc Highwall]

I just set the temperature to the temp that I use to preheat the moulds to. Then when I place the heated ingots into the pot it will recover quicker and the mould will be placed back on the hot plate to stay hot along with more ingots if I am going to cast some more.

[odoh]

Picked up some old, circa '70s co ww. Est 40 gal of a 55 gal drum. Was stored dry and seeing as we had no way to unload it from the pickup, we hand downloaded it all into smaller containers for storage in the shed. So had first hand knowlege of their condition.

Last week while smelting some in a 6qt dutch oven, I was looking at the pot load and wonderiing when I'd see the melt. All the visible ww were above the molten alloy. Then, right before my protected eyes, one spit a piece of hardened lead about the size of #5 shot that struck the front of my shirt and bounced off. Surprising how the mind can track stuff like that in brief real time. The dastardly ww that launced at me had a void/cavity and the breakaway around it was clean/fresh w/o evidence of moisture accessibility. As it wasn't in the melt when it occurred, one could consider it in the preheat phase when it popped. I no longer limit my attn/focus to clear evidence to water/moisture/

[cbrick]

preheat ingots to prevent tisel fairy showing up.

hmm, never heard of that before and I've never done it.

oh well, to each his own.

Best wishes for your continued good luck.

Rick

[edler7]

Does this make any sense or am I mentally masturbating ?

WW come off wheels. Wheels are on roads. Roads are treated in winter with salt. Salt is hygroscopic (it absorbs moisture). If a little bit of salt (and the absorbed moisture) would be stuck on the ww clip somewhere when it went into a hot pot....

[captaint]

Rick - And here I was thinking that was tongue in cheek. I still kinda think so.... Mike Hope so.

[noylj]

Had a moth hit my pot once. Now, I always have a layer of vermiculite floating over the lead.

[Edward429451]

I have an RCBS 20 pounder and a Lee 10 pounder and what I do is to empty my pot when done casting, into the ingot tray. If the pot is cold when the moist ingots go in it will drive the water off as it heats up, and no tinsel fairy. Then I simply preheat my ingots on top of the pot for the continued casting session. Simple and no extra appliance plugged in.

I did have two visits from the tinsel fairy. I was smelting lead pipe in a dutch oven on the side burner of the grill and got a refresher course in weight and balance points. Another time I caught a single raindrop from a partly cloudy sky. Both times, I did not know I could leap that far. No injury and cleanup was easy, just peel it up off the driveway.

[JIMinPHX]

Thanks for posting that. I'll try to profit from his bad experience & not learn the same lesson the hard way myself. I've been getting away with doing that same thing here in the Sonoran desert, but I think that I'll quit that practice while I'm ahead.

I'm sorry that your friend got messed up like that.

[Southern Son]

Does this make any sense or am I mentally masturbating ?

WW come off wheels. Wheels are on roads. Roads are treated in winter with salt. Salt is hygroscopic (it absorbs moisture). If a little bit of salt (and the absorbed moisture) would be stuck on the ww clip somewhere when it went into a hot pot....

You don't even need the salt on the roads situation. I live in the Tropics in Queensland, Australia. We rarely get frosts, and I don't think we have ever got ice on the roads, so we don't put salt on the roads. I still had water inside the WW where it is moulded onto the clip.

I was smelting and had emtied the pot of the last batch of melt. I re-filled the pot with unmelted WW and put a top on (try and keep down the smoke). I was bagging up some steel and Zink WW when I found a lead WW. So I just lifted the lid and put it in the melt. The WW was dry on the outside, I know this because I had just looked it over to confirm that it was lead. When the WW sank, I heard a buzzing noise and saw the bubbles comming up to the surface, then POP. :holysheep

I hadn't shaved in a while and it was a good thing, rather than the lead stiking to my chin, a few little bits stuck in my beard and a couple hit me on my galsses. The rest (only a tiny bit, maybe a couple of ounces) landed on the front of my cotton shirt.

That WW was dry on the outside, the only place that could hold any moisture was the tiny little gap where the clip is moulded in. I am more carefull now.

[nanuk]

It has rained here the last 2 days in a row and with all the snow we had this winter and spring there is a lot of moisture in the air. I didn't get to go see him today, but talked to him on the phone again. He says thank you for the good wishes. He took an ingot from the concrete floor(about 50 degrees) and put it straight into the pot. I asked if he heard any gurgling noises prior to the explosion, and he said no. He said it a happened pretty much instantaniously. I have always preheated my ingots when adding to a hot pot based off of the advice on this forum and because its so easy to do it. Just place a stack of ingots on the hot plate while you cast. They melt faster and don't lower the temp as much.

Whether people preheat or not is entirely up to them. I just wanted to pass this experience on so people caould see the possible consequences. I will see my buddy at work tomorrow and see if he'll chime in on here.


the very first time I melted WW, I used a propane camp stove and a medium sized cast pot. probably hold 50-70lbs

I didn't know better, ladled out melt into muffin tins, and added handfuls of WW gently on top, with a gloved hand.

I heard several noises, gurgles and steam and such.... just never put two and two together

Until I found this site, and started reading....

Now, WW = cold pot Ingots = preheat

always. Just like handling firearms. Some rules are best ingrained

[williamwaco]

================================================== =======




Here goes. There have been many discussions on this forum concerning the tinsel fairy, how much water is needed to cause a visit, pre-heating ingots before adding them to the hot pot, and safety gear. Well here is what happened to a friend of mine today.


Dick


================================================== =======

This thread scares the hell out of me. I have been casting bullets for 50 years and have at least 20 very close friends that have been casting most of that time with me.

I have never heard of this and I have never preheated an ingot in my life. I have picked up at least six zillion ingots off the floor in all kinds of weather and put them directly into the pot. I have never heard a sizzle or had an explosion.

What causes it?
I am not particularly lucky. How have I avoided it?

Ingots can't possibly have moisture inside. They were molded at > 600 degrees.

An inclosed air bubble could cause it but I have never seen that and cannot understand how one could form in an ingot. ( Although I have seen many air bubbles under the surface of the base of a bullet that looks fine except it weighs several grains light.) These bullets WILL explode if dropped directly into the melt. ( while the bubble is inclosed )

Obviously moisture on the outside of an ingot would cause big trouble but if it was moist, I wouldn't use it at all.

I have seen individual bullets explode when dropped into the pot. I have also seen individual wheel weights do it but I attributed that to grease or oil or an air bubble. or a drop of water on a bullet.

I never drop sprue cuttings back into the pot, I save them up until I have a large spoon full then ease them gently into the melt. Even something the size of a sprue cutting from a two cavity mold can splash tinsel five or six feet.

Surely nobody would "drop" something as large and heavy as an ingot into the melt. That will splash tinsel all over everything even if it were preheated. I use a large vice grip to hold them and ease them into the pot so they will not splash.

Perhaps a large temperature difference? I don't think so but I live in Texas and never cast at temperatures below about 50 degrees.

I guess I will have to buy a hot plate after all.

[Lizard333]

I've never had this happen and I have been adding ingots to my hot lead since I started casting. The difference is I think is your location. I live in Arizona inthe high desert mountains at 7000 feet. We get snow during the winter but is is still very dry. I even run a swamp cooler during the summer to help with temp in my garage. No problems. I did once however empty a bucket of freshly dropped boolits and with a wet hand pick up some ingots and drop them In a hot pot. Tinsel fairy visited then. That was my own fault. It was stupid of me. No injuries, but a learning lesson all the same. Never heard about preheating your ingots till this post.

[Fritz D]

For any laddle casters . . . pre-heating your laddle is also a good idea before sticking it into a molten pot.

[mold maker]

Lead pipe is a prime way to get a visit. Remember that pipe served its life under ground with pressurized water in it. If there was a flaw or void, it probably was filled with water and oxidized over.
That's a perfect tinsel fairy invitation.
If you haven't had a visit, your number just hasn't come up. regardless of how careful you are, sooner or later she will find you.
Being prepaired and using all cautions, won't stop it from ever happening, but it will save your hide, when it does.
This is a dangerous game we play.

[bdbullets]

Preheating is the best way to go but I keep a large piece of demin materal on my bench when I add any lead to the pot I throw that over it at the same time I drop it in. It has saved a big mess several times and keeps it in one spot if it does. I to have porblems even with preheatd ingots every once in a while like moisture is trapped inside the ingot. Don't know how it would work with a exploding pot but for the splatters and bubbling it works great.

[JIMinPHX]

I never drop sprue cuttings back into the pot, I save them up until I have a large spoon full then ease them gently into the melt. Even something the size of a sprue cutting from a two cavity mold can splash tinsel five or six feet.

I drop my sprue cuttings back into the pot pretty much every time. They are still pretty hot when they go back in. I don't thing that there is any real danger there.

[williamwaco]

I drop my sprue cuttings back into the pot pretty much every time. They are still pretty hot when they go back in. I don't thing that there is any real danger there.

Depends on how far you "drop" them. They don't have to be wet to spalsh.

[JIMinPHX]

Good point.

Mine drop about 1-3" from a gloved hand, depending on how full the pot is.

[XWrench3]

never preheat my ingots. I made them myself. Don't know how the moisture would get into the ingot after I make them. Just trying to understand how this would happen.

CONDENSATION!

i do not usually pre-heat my ingots either. i do load the pot completely full prior to plugging it in. i have had a few snap crackle ***, but the tinsel fairy has not come visiting me while adding ingots. the one thing i do with my ingots (if i am going to cast more than a pot full) is set as much as i might use along side the pot, which is out in the open air and sun. that probably dries them off pretty well, which is why i have had no trouble. i guess i will have to be more carefull from now on. the tinsel fairy has visited me on occasion. fortuneatly, only in smalll amounts. where i usually get it is from adding in sprue knock offs, while i am water dropping boolits. it is imposible to not have a few splashes when water dropping. so when i add them back into the pot, i put the cover on the pot (a peice of license plate) and add a tablespoon full at a time. i have gotten a few small burns. fortuneatly nothing serious. i seriously hope your feind is not injured bad (permanant scarring, infection, loss of use of body parts, etc.). the school of hard knocks is not freindly either. i should know, i have been there enough in my lifetime.

[Crash_Corrigan]

I always pre heat my ingots on the edge of the casting pot prior to using them. All that being said I am going to Harbor Freight tomorrow to buy a face shield to go along with my canvas hat with a long brim, leather welding gloves with a gauntlet that almost reaches my elbows, leather apron, long sleeved shirt and leather boots and of course dungarees.

I have a lot of respect for the dangerous but captivating alloy we play with.

Luck and preparation have allowed me to pretty much escape from getting burned or injured during smelting or casting operations and that started almost 20 years ago. However I am always willing to learn something new.

[Southern Son]

For any laddle casters . . . pre-heating your laddle is also a good idea before sticking it into a molten pot.

+1. I put some lanolin grease on my ladle when I finish casting to stop any rust. Sure enough, I forgot and dipped it in the melt one time. Not nearly as spectacular as the WW I dropped in with water in the gap around the clip on the WW, but it still spat at me.

[MtGun44]

HMMMM. I've been dropping ingots into pots for 40+ yrs, never had anything beyond
a bit of boiling and bubbling occasionally. Can't even imagine how many times I've
dropped an ingot into a half full pot of molten metal.

Bill

[odoh]

I too 'insert' ingots into melts.When ingotizing, the center is the last to solidify w/contractional forces creating a dip/low spot that can be seen. It seems to be less pronounce if the ingot mould is hot. Fast cooling of the ingot creates minute fissures/cracks in that area which can collect otherwise unnoticed condensation hence the bubbling and hissing. Being aware of the potential to awaken the fairy, I slowly add by using channel lock/vicegrips dipping the end of the ingot into the melt and holding it there for a bit allowing heat tranfer/conduction to hopefully evaporated most/any collected moisture in the area that is still above/outside the melt at that point. Only when satified that its safe to I allow the rest of the ingot to slide into the deep. While I never awoken a fairy w/adding an ingot to the melt, the bubbling has impressed me to exercise a measure of caution. Afterall, its my skin and the foregoing is within my power to do.

[watkibe]

I never add ingots to a melt. I decide how much to use to start with. As I cast, I knock off all the sprues into a small metal baking pan. Every dozen or so, I empty the sprues back into the melt. Any bullets that miss the "water-drop" bucket or are otherwise damaged or imperfect go into the pan also. I finally end up with an almost empty pot that I pick up and pour out into a muffin tin "ingot mold".
No problems so far, but I'm sure there's somebody who is going to tell me how lucky I am that I haven't had a catastrophe yet.

[songdog53]

I have never had any problems from ingots dropped into hot melt but learned that a cooler ladle will spit at you and even saw chips from firewood cutting will cause spitting and awake the Tinsel Fairy. But can see where cooler ingot will have some condensation on it and cause her to come calling.

[Love Life]

Saw my buddy yesterday. He has deep burns along his forehead and upper right arm. The doctor cut away all the dead skin so he should heal just fine with minor scarring. As I told him it was a good thing he was already ugly. He said it was the craziest thing he's ever had happen to him (which is saying alot). He said it blew about 10 pounds out of the pot, and lucky for him most of it ended up on the floor and the wall. He now sees the wisdom in preheating and will continue to cast his own.

[Doc Highwall]

The ingots that are the worse are the ones poured in layers with a small ladle or lead that is cooling too fast as it is being poured because the temperature of the lead is too low causing layers with cracks and crevices holding moisture.

[odoh]

The ingots that are the worse are the ones poured in layers with a small ladle or lead that is cooling too fast as it is being poured because the temperature of the lead is too low causing layers with cracks and crevices holding moisture.

I recently started to have a bernz torch handy. I hit the mould a bit before the pour as it seems to level the surface abit and for the rare occasion I'm unable to ladle a full 1# I'll hit the surface of the lead just prior to the followup pour to aid in fusion of the layers

[Doc Highwall]

I bought a ladle that holds 5lbs and now it is no problem.

[41mag]

Well I have only been pouring boolits for a couple of months if you put all of it together. I have however been playing with lead for quite a hwile making up my own surf weights which sometimes can weigh upwards of a couple of pounds for shark fishing.

One hot afternoon I came in from work and set up everything to melt down a pot full for weight making. I had already set up and had the pot going for a while and was adding weights a few at a time. Out of nowhere I got blasted by a cool breeze, which I knew immediately what was fixing to happen. I only had time to shut the valve on the fish cooker when the huge rain drops started hitting all around.

I have to say I have seen a LOT of crazy stuff in my lifetime, but that had to be about tops. I watched from a good distance as things just went haywire in that pot. I bet it easily blew more than half of it out in strands and blobs across a 20' area of my back yard. The lone summer rain cloud had come across from the front side of the house where I didn't even notice it until it was too late. The sun was still shining while this was all going on and to be honest it was pretty cool looking, but it sure was a bummer cleaning it all up.

Since then I have had a VERY great respect for what could happen, and I keep everything under cover of some type nowadays. I even had it blow once when one single drop of sweat fell into the pot. Now I keep a towel wrapped around my forehead as well.

Preheat, you bet, make SURE moisture don't get in the pot, oh yea.

[Charlie Two Tracks]

My casting room is in a climate controlled garage. It never gets below 50 and never above 80. I keep the moisture down with a dehumidifier. I have not had any problems with adding ingots but this may be because of the lack of moisture in the air and the fact that the ingots are not too cold. I do believe that I will start to preheat my ingots though. A little bit of extra safety is not going to hurt a thing. Burns from lead are not a good thing.

[lwknight]

Since then I have had a VERY great respect for what could happen, and I keep everything under cover of some type nowadays. I even had it blow once when one single drop of sweat fell into the pot. Now I keep a towel wrapped around my forehead as well.
I know that strange things happen but the moisture has to actually get under the melt to explode. A drop of water on top would just fizzle and maybe spatter a bit.
Imagine that a water drop landed on the ingot that you just dropped in and got submerged then you get kablewy everywhere.

It was a lead pipe that got me. I had only a shallow melt and several pieces of pipe started into the pot. I thought that as they melted off the heat would preheat enough to expel any moisture. Eventually the melt got deeper and a piece of pipe slid in pretty fast then blew several pounds of lead everywhere. I have a scar on my arm to remind me everyday.

[colonelhogan44]

I smelted ~40 pounds of lead outside, over an open fire in a drizzle. Rain pattered on my molten WWs for over an hour, with no ill effects.

It's only a problem when the water gets under the lead.

[Edward429451]

Lead pipe is a prime way to get a visit. Remember that pipe served its life under ground with pressurized water in it. If there was a flaw or void, it probably was filled with water and oxidized over.

This is incorrect. I've been plumbing a long time and never have seen lead used underground or on any supply line which would be the only possible pressurized application. Lead pipes were only used above ground in non-pressurized gravity drain systems. They use cast iron underground.

Ya know, casting didn't used to be so dangerous. You gave it the respect due to molten metal and ya got lots of Boolits for your efforts.

[a.squibload]

Love Life:
Best wishes for the patient, have him check out aloe vera juice / gel to put on his burns. Good right from the plant, cut leaf open and spread on the gel, feels cool.
Can get it in a tube.

I made a propane tank pot, it's pretty big. After pouring or casting a potful
I don't really want to add more so I shut it off for a while.
Usually get down to a shallow puddle in the bottom.
Start over, add WWs or ingots, ramp up the heat.

Saved the top part of the tank and made a lid, fairly heavy, will start using it
when melting just in case.

I can stand some pain.
I can go a long time without beer.
No reason to put myself through either condition if I can help it!

[dagger dog]

I had stored ingots outside in my unheated garage, they were about 6 month old. Started a casting session ,pulled these ingots from the cabinet and noticed they were a little white colored from oxidation, well when I droppedd a couple into a half full pot they blew out. !

I was lucky and only lightly spattered , no damage.

I'm keeping all my ingot in a temp controlled A/C heated area now. I believe it is the oxidation that harbours the moisture, you know that white powder that collects on lead. Stop the oxidation and the moisture has no place to gather, the ingots stay shiny, etc.

Sorry to hear about your friend hope he heals well.

[Big Boomer]

cbrick mentioned a very important factor: temperature difference.

I use a small cast iron skillet-shaped dipper on a length of 2X2 (bolted on) to transfer molten/fluxed lead from my big smelting pot to a Lee bottom pour. When I first picked up the cold cast iron dipper and lowered it into the molten lead, there was a vibration I felt through the wood handle as the dipper experienced temperature shock and the temp began to rise. If that happens with cast iron, it must happen similarly with lead or any other alloy as well. Care should be exercised when introducing cold or even room temperature lead to a pot that is running close to 600 degrees or more higher.

That is not a comforting feeling for that thing to vibrate in my hands ... and after the first time, I now do it more slowly ... MUCH more slowly. 'Tuck

[rintinglen]

There is another reason for pre-heating and that is to maintain a more consistent melt temperature. I use corn cob ingots, because they lay atop my Lee 20 pounder easily and provide me with several benefits. By preheating ingots, I can add lead regularly as required with out causing the pot temp to plunge and messing with my boolits. I boil out any lurking water that may be hiding in there, and I reduce my cost by capturing waste heat that would other wise escape out the top. As a bottom caster, I get more consistent boolit weights and better fill-out when I keep the pot at a near constant temperature and keep the level in the pot fairly constant. If I let the level drop by more than two inches, my boolit weight drops, even though the boolits appear to identical. Preheating the ingots let's me keep my productivity rate up, which is important to those of us blessed with wives, children , jobs and homes, all of which require time to maintain.

[Colorado4wheel]

I use two pots. I put the old sprue on top of the lead when I switch to the next pot. It's still warm at that point but the sprue cools it enough that the entire pot cools off. I then load the pot up with lead and it melts in slowly. At the end I do add individual pieces. I am going to need to be really carefully about adding those last couple pieces. Thanks for the warning.

[doghawg]

This is incorrect. I've been plumbing a long time and never have seen lead used underground or on any supply line which would be the only possible pressurized application. Lead pipes were only used above ground in non-pressurized gravity drain systems. They use cast iron underground.

Ya know, casting didn't used to be so dangerous. You gave it the respect due to molten metal and ya got lots of Boolits for your efforts.

Lead water pipe from UNDERGROUND used in SUPPLY LINES to a residential neighborhood.

[M-Tecs]

Lead water pipe from UNDERGROUND used in SUPPLY LINES to a residential neighborhood.

In the early 70's they pulled all of the residential lead pipe supply lines in my small town. The going price was three cents a pound. I paid for 1000 pounds but they gave me 3000 or 4000 pounds. I was 12 or 13 at the time and I was reloading and casting for a 7th Cavalry reenactment group. I still have about 400 pounds left. Most of it had a white build up on the inside. It stunk to high heaven when you melted it. The pipe was dead soft but the joints and elbows had a lot of tin in them. Cut it with an axe.

[Southron Sanders]

Many years ago I had a 25 pound pot of lead blow up on me. It was NOT A FUN experience as I got burned on my arms, face, head, chest, etc. Fortunately, I was wearing glasses.

The pot had just melted and I put the lead ladle in it to stir it. The ladle was at room temperature and apparently it had some moisture on it.

LEARNED MY LESSON. I KEEP ANY TYPE OF MOISTURE WELL AWAY FROM MOLTEN LEAD!

[bpratl]

The pot had just melted and I put the lead ladle in it to stir it. The ladle was at room temperature and apparently it had some moisture on it.
LEARNED MY LESSON. I KEEP ANY TYPE OF MOISTURE WELL AWAY FROM MOLTEN LEAD!

I experienced the same thing a couple of weeks ago when I was showing a friend now to cast. It scared the life out of both of us and it will never happen again.
Luckily neither of us got burned and there is still lead on my shop ceiling. :killingpc