40-70 ss Reloading help for a beginner.

[iln143]

I just bought my first bpcr. It is a Uberti High Wall action in 40-70 SS with a 34 inch badger barrel 1-16 twist. It came with a bunch of loose bullets, 430 grn round nose from a nei mold. There was also 16 rounds of loaded amo. The listed load is. Buffalo Armes brass 30/40 craig with 430gn bullet w/60 grainsof 2F GOEX using a 20 thou Walters wad.

When I attempted to load a round I noticed I had to push the round into the chamber with a bit of force. When I tried to eject it I had to use a screw driver (gently) to pull the round out. The bullet was left in the barrel. Upon examining the loaded rounds the bullets are easily twisted by hand. I meassured the overall length of the loaded rounds and they are 3.22 which is longer than the 3.18 max listed length. I also took apart a round and noticed the powder does not just pour out when the wad is removed. I have to tap the side with somthing hard to loosen the powder. Is this a compressed load? I have reloaded metalic cartridge for years but I am not familiar with bpcr. Is this normal?? Any help would be appreciated!

Thanks
Ivan

[sliphammer]

It sounds like the brass is 30-40 Krag cases blown out to 40-70. Its possible the cases needed to be trimmed but weren't. I wouldn't worry about the black powder being compressed in the case. The stuff has a tendency to do that. Your next step should be to slug the bore and measure the bullet dia. You could probably find a smokeless load to use in this rifle as well.

[kodiak1]

iln143
Black powder is compressed to make sure there is no voids inside anywhere, between primer and powder, powder and wad, wad and bullet.
Your cartridge is long thus seating the bullet into your rifling when you push it in with force.
These cartridges can be shot the way they are no different than folks the seat their bullets into the rifling really.

430 grain to me seems a little heavy maybe I usually shoot mine with 350 or 370 grain bullets.

Ken.

[Lead pot]

Chances are when who ever loaded those cases used the bullet to compress the powder and got the nose swelled out.

Measure some of the bullets that haven't been loaded they should be .408" or .001 or .002 less at the bore riding portion ahead of the first driving band is normal. (.406-.407) then the shank should be .408.

As far as the .30-40 brass is concerned it is good brass I been using the same 500 cases for 13 years and it is just starting to fail, but the rifle has been shot 12,000 rounds when I lost track in 04. By the way you cant just blow out 30/40 cases they will be a bunch to short. The 40-70 cases are 2.5". Jamison makes .40-70 brass with the correct head stamp and they work great.
Your 430 grain bullet might be on the border for length depending the type of ogive radius it has. A 430 grain RN will be shorter than a elliptical. The weight is not the factor, it's the length that kills the accuracy with the .40-70SS.
Put enough 2F black powder in that case to compress it .380" and seat the bullet just touching the lands and go from there.

[NickSS]

Sounds to me that the guy who loaded the shells you have seated them out so that they were started into the rifling when seated. This is normal for target shooters though most only seat them to just touch the rifling but some like the bullet to be engraved by it. The round you have can be safely shot then you can work up your own loads. Personally I would seat the slug a little deeper so that I do not have to worry about pulling the bullet if I have to unload the gun. When you start reloading your own you will have to experiment a bit to find what compression your rifle likes best. They are all a little different in this respect.

[Red River Rick]

By the way you cant just blow out 30/40 cases they will be a bunch to short. The 40-70 cases are 2.5". Jamison makes .40-70 brass with the correct head stamp and they work great.

Or, stretch your brass to the length required, such as these, from various brands of .303 brass.

The heaviest walled brass is Privi (nny), #17, I was able to get a OAL 2.950" from it, yet still maintaining more wall thickness than some factory brass.

1) Factory Remington .303 British brass
2) Annealed and taper expand neck from .30 - .35, then .35 -.40
3) RP brass stretched
4) “ “ “
5) Winchester brass stretched
6) Factory UMC .35 WCF
7) Stretched Federal brass formed into .35 WCF
8) “ “ “ “ “ “
9) Stretched Federal brass, unformed
10) Stretched Imperial (Canadian) brass, unformed
11) Stretched Imperial (Canadian) brass formed into 40-70 SS
12) Factory UMC 38-72
13) Factory UMC 40-72
14) Stretched Imperial (Canadian) brass, formed in .405 Win
15) Stretched Privi (nny / Serbia) brass, unformed
16) Stretched IGMAN (Bosnia) brass, unformed
17) Stretched IGMAN (Bosnia) brass, formed into .40 – 2.9”

All brass was stretched using the same tooling and the same number of draws. It just proves to show you how much difference there is in the construction from one manufacturer to another.

Seems like Remington brass is the thinnest, Winchester next, then Federal, Imperial, Privi (nny) and finally IGMAN having the thickest walled brass of all.


Ken, did you get your's yet?


RRR

[kodiak1]

Rick got a notice in the mail tonight, so they should be there.
Will let you know tommorrow evening after the little mrs's picks up the mail and I get back from the gun show.

Ken.

[41wyom]

Try Hornandy 405 Winch brass IF the rifle's chamber will accept the case rim correctly. These cases start out too long but you can trim them to your desired length. Less messing around than stretching cases.

[Red River Rick]

Great tip 41wyom, when you can get the brass!

Did you happen to notice where Kodiak1 and I are from? Were not quite as fortunate as you are, ordering brass is somewhat of a PITA if you want to get it here.

So, us resourceful types come up with solutions to help overcome government restrictions impossed on us by foreign governments, in this case yours.

So stretching what's available (brass) is our way being able to shoot some of these old time cartridges.

RRR

[kodiak1]

Rick got the brass today.
That 303 stretched brass looks AMAZING if it didn't have 303 on the rim you would swear it was 40 70 SS brass right out of the box.

41wyom for president then he can work on resinding some of these jask **** laws that have been brought in since 911.

Ken.