not blowing up magnums

[olafhardt]

In my 500 s&w handy rifle I recentally loaded some Lee modern minies over 6.4 grains of Unique, some nose first, some cavity first. Either way they would shoot right through three one gallon bottles of water. The cavity first super hollow point did only slightly more damage to the first bottle. In comtimplating my results an idea occurred.. Suppose when loading wimp loads in a magnum case with fast powder could I help prevent catastrofic gun failure by using half or the max load of an easily ignited fast powder like 4 grains of Unique behind a 158 gr boolit in a 357. Then if you do double charge you just get noise.

[Charlie Two Tracks]

If a guy knows what a loaded round is supposed to be, he can weigh them and see if they are off or not. It would have to be the same brass and the same weight of boolit in order for this to work. Pretty easy to do though.

[1Shirt]

Agree with Charlie!
1Shirt!:coffeecom

[peerlesscowboy]

Put the cases in a loading block to charge the powder, then when they're all charged visually inspect 'em under a good light before you seat the bullets. It'd be easy to tell the difference between 4 gr Unique and a double charge of 8 gr.

[Bullshop]

When I first started loaded ammo about 35 years ago I thought that the book method of using a loading tray and charging all cases at once seemed like a bad idea.
It seems too easy to get confused or experiance something like highway hypnosis looking at the rows of cases and trying to stay in line.
Right from the beginning of my loading carrier I decided I didn't want to do that so went with a more fool proof method of charging cases.
I set up my bench so that my powder drop is slightly behind and left of my press. I hold the case being charged in my left hand work the drop handle with my right then the charged case get a visual inspection then goes into the shell holder in the press and gets a bullet seated.
There is no chance of a double charge this way, none at all. I do not own a loading block and have no need of one. I initially thought it was a dangerous step 35 years ago and have not been convinced otherwise.

[Char-Gar]

The solution to your issue is very simple. Do as Peerless Cowboy suggested. If you are using some kind of equipment that won't allow visual inspection of the powder charge before seating the bullet, get rid of that equipment.

[GaryN]

When I used to use my loading blocks I would fill the whole block with primed cases. Then I would go up and down the rows filling each row with powder. I did it that way for decades and never made a mistake with my charge.

[waksupi]

When I used to use my loading blocks I would fill the whole block with primed cases. Then I would go up and down the rows filling each row with powder. I did it that way for decades and never made a mistake with my charge.


That is the way I have always loaded. Those who charge one case at a time I believe are more likely to make a mistake.

[Char-Gar]

Yep... I have always done the same thing..

Fill the block with charged cases
With a strong light, look into the cases for uniform charge height.

Be doing it this way for 50 years and nary a double charge.

[XWrench3]

#1, I AM NOT TRYING TO START AN ARGUMENT, I AM SIMPLY STATING SOME OF MY EXPERIENCES


If a guy knows what a loaded round is supposed to be, he can weigh them and see if they are off or not. It would have to be the same brass and the same weight of boolit in order for this to work. Pretty easy to do though.


i have tried that with my 300 win mag before. a double charge of a fast pistol powder will not show up, unless the cases are weight sorted as well. otherwise, there was enough weight varience that i could not tell one from another. i had to tear them all down. it is always much better to be safe, than to end up in a hospital! if it is a lot of work, and some wasted components, that is still going to be way faster, and less costly than even just an emergency room visit. if you end up admitted, then it is that much worse.


I set up my bench so that my powder drop is slightly behind and left of my press. I hold the case being charged in my left hand work the drop handle with my right then the charged case get a visual inspection then goes into the shell holder in the press and gets a bullet seated.


bullshop, i do not mean to make an arguement, and i certainly am not going to fault your process. i have however, had the unfortunate experience of powder bridging in a measure. some of the shells, it was obvoius, others, not so much. if i had not been using a loading block, i am sure some of the charges would have been overlooked. it would have been, in this particular case, a catastrophic event. so for me, i will keep using load blocks.

[Cherokee]

I have used loading blocks from the very beginning back in 1960. Works for me, YMMV

[Bwana]

Let me expound on how I load using loading blocks. I put all the cases in all the loading blocks, one or 23. After setting the charge and checking it about five times I charge all the cases, checking the throw weight about every 200 cases. Before placing the bullets in the cases I check the powder level in the cases.
Here is an important step: When I have the loading block with charged cases in front of me I look at the powder level in all cases while tilting the block slightly away from me, vertical, and slightly towards me. This eliminates, or reduces, errors due to lighting.
Perhaps this will help someone.

[leftiye]

Use an automeasure. They beep if they go over .010gr.. Yes, you can have it both ways. Besides this, they almost completely remove the time usually needed for setup, checking every tenth charge, and actual charging itself (as you are doing something else - seating boolit in previous cartridge - while the measure works). Put the charge in and mark the round by putting a boolit in it. No double charge.

[stubert]

Use a powder with a higher load density. A double charge will overflow.

[shotstring]

I think I mentioned this technique in another thread, but it is the best way I have found to insure that all powder charges are equal in a loading block full of cases.

Just use a pencil or a wood dowel and place it into each case after the whole block has been filled with powder. It only takes 10 to 12 seconds to do 50 cases. I takes a person that long just to check the cases visually, and with this method, you don't even have to look into the cases if you don't want to, so it takes no longer to do a totally infallable check. Your finger tips will touch the edge of the loaded case every time unless you have an over or under charged case. Absolutely no way to make a mistake by relying on vision alone, which can be difficult depending on the lighting, shadows and reflections.

Personally, I like to do a visual check at the same time I'm doing this manual check since they can be done at the same time and thus get two checks done in the same time it takes to do either check individually. Doing checks this way, I have seen that there is no overcharge and I have FELT that there is no overcharge. I can then relax and enjoy, as I can now be certain that the powder charge is correct. Peace of mind.....priceless.

[imashooter2]

When using load blocks, I place the empties in a bin. I pick one up, charge it, then place it in the block. When the block is full, all the cases get examined with a nice LED flashlight.

Lots of methods work, this one works for me.

[Gtek]

For many years, one clean block on left and one primed case block on right. Pick one up with right hand transfer to left hand and charge. Set in block on left. One in, one out. Dad said is was the only way about forty years ago, it stuck. No BOO-BOO's or OMG's as of today. Gtek

[cbrick]

Haven't used a loading block in years and I'm even less likely to with small charges of fast powder. For these and hard to meter powders (4759 as an example) I use the RCBS ChargeMaster. When it throws the charge it beeps and advances the counter. I pour the powder in the case, look in the case, put a bullet in the case mouth and seat the bullet while the chargeMaster is doing the next charge.

When I am finished and have loaded 100 rounds the counter had best say 100 and not 101 or 103 or . . .

Rick

[Charlie Two Tracks]

I load mine the way Bullshop does. Primed case in left hand, operate RCBS powder measure with the right hand, look at the powder in the case (I have a light just above the press) and seat the boolit. I am confident with this set up. As with anything else, there are many ways to go about putting powder in your brass. Attention to detail and consistently doing the same thing the same way seems to work for me so far. I have to be very careful of not daydreaming or thinking about work or whatever................

[uscra112]

Ditto. I always charge the case, start a boolit before I put it down. My defense against variation in the charge thrown by the measure is that I start out weighing each and every one. Throw the charge into the pan, set it on the scale, while the scale is settling I pick up the previous round and run it through the press. Check the scale, trickle if necessary, charge a case, start a boolit. Repeat.

For pistol ammo only, after twenty or thirty rounds, if the scale is telling me that the measure really is throwing consistently, I'll weigh every third charge, maybe every fifth. But even so, every charge is thrown into the scale pan. That gives me a chance to see if it "looks right".

Slow, but I rarely load more than 100 rounds at a sitting. I once tried visually inspecting a batch of charged cases, as some folks do prefer to do, but found that I could not see well enough to be sure of what was in there, if the charge didn't fill the case above halfway. The calibrated stick method is better, but IMHO rather uncertain with small charges in large cases.

[selmerfan]

I'm not trying to start an argument here, just sharing experience. For those of you using the "fill the block with primed cases and go down row by row then check with a flashlight" method, I was in your camp for over 20 years. It finally bit me in the butt this spring when a double charge from this method took apart my .30-06 - check out my avatar and the link in my signature. It can be tough to determine how much powder there is - 4 gr. vs. 8 gr. in a .500 S&W isn't going to be that noticeable. Either do one case at a time, or if you insist on using a block, leave the primed cases headstamp up, mouth down, until they are charged, then immediately seat the boolit. Or just don't use the block. I won't use the old method again, I loaded tens of thousands of rounds that way, but it only takes one...

[Bwana]

selmerfan,
I only check powder levels by sight with pistol rounds. I don't think anyone else is advocating it for long rifle rounds either. All my rifle rounds are weighed by hand.

[Three44s]

I use a loading block.

Visual the cases that make sense and use an appropriate rod to check small charges in long cases.

For real small batches, I will charge and check and then seat each round individually.

For me, just stuffing a bullet immediately after charging is still leaving room for a double charge. Therefore I use a visual or "mechanical" check on each case whether its getting a bullet seated in gross or individually.

Three 44s

[captaint]

Over the 35 years of handloading, I've done it both ways. About 30 years ago, I'm pretty sure I double charged one (didn't hurt anything) using the "line em up in the tray and drop a charge in each, then pick up one at a time and seat the bullet" method. Since I have only taken primed case, drop powder in, look to see it's there, and seat boolit. No problems, since. Mike

[41mag]

or if you insist on using a block, leave the primed cases headstamp up, mouth down, until they are charged,

When charging any cases one at a time this is the method I have used since I was being taught the steps by my pop. I do not use many reduced charges, but when I do I use the same method, case heads up on empties, necks up on charged. When I get through the whole batch I seat bullets.

The only time I don't use this is when loading on the progressive. I haven't been able to make it do a double charge on anything yet.

[Char-Gar]

Selmerfan... It wasn't the method that failed you. It was the person who implemented the method that dropped the ball.

If you now lack the confidence to tell the difference by looking into the case, make a gauge. The easy way is to take stub of a good old fashioned pencil, drop it in to a charged case (single charge please) and make a mark on the pencil at the case mouth. You now have a fool proof gauge.

Drop the pencil stub into each charged case and if the mark is too high, you have an overcharge.

[dverna]

I do as cbrick does for "single stage" reloading. If you double charge a case using that method, you should seriously consider NOT reloading.

Before I acquired the Chargemaster, I used Bullshops method and powders that do not bridge.

If you think you have a double charge, the only safe option is to pull ALL the bullets on "wimp" loads that have very little powder to start with. Weighing finished rounds may not catch the problem

Don

[Echo]

I use a loading block (home-made - 9x11, because 10x10 is boring) for pistol and carbine loading. Set the expanded, belled, and primed cases therein and charge with my Hornady Pistol Measure. And count as I go. When all are charged, plus one to make 100, eyeball for consistency. Set boolits on charged cases and press on.
Rifle stuff gets BS's treatment - throw the charge from the Duo-Measure and seat the bullet/boolit. Once I have adjusted the measure to throw the charge I want, it is consistent enough that I don't check anymore.
On a related case - Once I was loading some 38 popcorn on my Dillon. I knew exactly how many boolits I had (something over 100), so I counted out that many cases and had at it. A couple of interruptions later, I was finished - but had an extra case! Hmmmmm. I must have put TWO boolits in one case! Weighed all the loaded rounds, and found one that weighed about 110 grs more than the rest...
Takes talent to do that...

[rintinglen]

The real deal here is consistent attention to detail. Whether you use a block and a light like I do, or fill and cap individually, the real key is to pay constant attention.
For years, I had an "infallible" method for ensuring my powder type was correct for the application. I only used IMR in a can for my rifle loads, H-110 in Hogdon's round plastic bottles for my magnum pistol loads, and for standard pistol loads, Hercules Red Dot in it's card board Tube. All was well until I bought a grab lot of stuff at an estate sale, which included a can of HP-38. It was new, unopened, and as a struggling young father of two, I was not in the position to just throw it away. Powder cost money. I put that bottle on the shelf and more or less forgot about it, since I wasn't loading many Magnum Loads. The day came when I had a couple hundred 357 cases to refill, So I grabbed the "Bottle" that was for magnums and proceeded to load 200 cases with 15.7 grains--OF HP-38. Luckily for me, I noticed the label when I was pouring the powder back into the can from the powder measure. It took me hours to break that ammo down, but that was cheaper than a new gun, or a new eye or hand. Watch what you are doing--words to live by!