Opinions wanted on cutting a 30-06 down to 16.5”.

[2ndAmendmentNut]

I few months ago a picked up a Sears M53 in 30-06 (for those who don’t know it is basically a plain Jane M70, made by Winchester for Sears.) It is a good old rifle, nice trigger pull, shoots j-words into 1.5” groups and so far boolits into 3” groups at 100yards. Not super accurate but plenty for hunting in the brush. I have been toying with the idea of cutting down its 22” barrel to 16.5”. I doubt accuracy would be effected, and if anything it might be improved. I figure I might lose about 200 or so f.p.s. which is significant, but will most likely only be noticed with j-words, and deer and hogs are unlikely to know the difference, bullet/boolit placement would still be the biggest factor in clean kills, not 200f.p.s. give or take. So am I missing anything? Is there a serious reason not to cut the barrel back? I personally think minus 6” of barrel the rifle would be over all handier, without any serious tradeoffs. Opinions and advice are welcome.

[Blammer]

you touch that sucker off with a full house load you better be wearing hearing protection.

the fireball at lo light may be something to behold too....

[462]

If my Mosin-Nagant M38 (18-inch barrel) is any indicator, the muzzle blast and noise will take quite a bit of the fun out of the shooting. Increased recoil may be another consideration. I've heard a few people say that the Enfield Jungle Carbine is not fun to shoot.

Perhaps a Winchester or Marlin, in .30-30, might be a better option? There is an increased cost factor involved, though.

Just my two-cents.

[btroj]

What? Sorry, I didn't hear the question. Someone just fired a short barreled '06 near me.

Sounds like someone needs a 30-30.

Brad

[lreed]

I had a FN-98 '06 with a 16 inch barrel, was real handy almost like a pistol. The muzzle blast was rough on the ears,so much in fact the 16 inch barrel is in my parts bin and the FN has a 24 inch barrel. lreed

[JeffinNZ]

It's a great idea if you are only going to burn 10 grains of Red Dot.

[geargnasher]

What? Sorry, I didn't hear the question. Someone just fired a short barreled '06 near me.

Sounds like someone needs a 30-30.

Brad

Nahhh, "someone" needs a .35 Remington! ;)

Gear

[Phillip]

If it was a .308, I would say 16.5 would be OK with 1:12 twist and 150gr boolits. There not too bad to shoot, but a 30-06, no thanks. The muzzle blast would be over the top.

If You do want to cut is down, I would make it 18" min to 20" max. This will keep it form becoming unfriendly from the blast.

[Tracy]

I think 16.5" would be fine. For deer with jacketed bullets, I would load 150 grain bullets or lighter, or perhaps 170s that were intended for the .30/30. 165s and up may lose enough velocity to prevent sufficient expansion. I base this on the fact that 165 Remington PSPs do not open well on deer from my 18" .308, while they open fine from longer barrels.

[Larry Gibson]

Stick with the 22" barrel. "Handy" doesn't cut it when it comes to shooting it. You'll also get better cast bullet velcocity because you won't have to use as much pressure to drive the cast bullets to 1900 - 2000 + fps for hunting. You'll have to use more powder to achieve that velocity in the shorter barrel. This means increases thrust/accelleration.....bad for a softer cast bullet for hunting. The increased muzzle blast isn't worth it as mentioned.

Larry Gibson

[steg]

An acquaintance did this to a really nice 375 H&H, ruined the gun in my opinion, said he was trying for a fast shooting guide gun, a long action bolt gun, also a pre 74 mod 70, BTW he was asked not to bring it back to the range, something about the noise factor. .........steg

[bgokk]

I had a Sears M53 in .30-06 back in the 70's. I cut mine to 17" because I hunted in thick cover and used the rifle to push the scrub oak branches aside. That was to keep them from scraping on my clothing.

Removing that 5" made all the difference. I no longer had sore forearm mussels and never noticed the muzzle blast. But I can't remember ever hearing the shot when shooting at a deer.:???:

I chrono'ed the rifle with W-W 150 Gr. Power Points before and after and only lost 98 FPS.

The rifle always was and still is a 1.5" shooter. My oldest son now owns it.

Back then I did not cast boolits and it has only shot J-words.

BG
Larry is right about shooting boolits longer will be better.

[snowtigger]

One of my Brothers in law has a Pre 64 model 70 in 338 Win mag. He had it re-barreled to a 16 1/2" bull barrel.
He always shot Federal Premium Safari grade ammo. These cartridges are loaded with some tough Nosler bullets.

Beyond 50 yards, they did not expand. Pencil sized holed through and through. I kept telling him they were too slow. I offered to load him some that would expand.
Finally, two years ago, he showed up with Remington core-lokt ammo. His moose went right down, DRT.
He still won't admit the Nosler,s were goim too slow, but last year, he was back in the field with thre Rems...... Pick your bullets , pick your powder, put up with the noise, and above all have fun.

PS; I shoot a Model 660 Rem in 350 Rem mag, so I know about noise.....

[nicholst55]

As everyone has stated, muzzle blast is going to be unpleasant. For a hunting rifle, you'll probably never notice. For a range toy, I'd want it to be at least 18" long.

I shoot an 18" FAL a bit, and it isn't that bad; no muzzle brake (aka Noise Enhancer) on it though.

[Lloyd Smale]

go for it if its what you want. You carrry a gun all day and only hear muzzle blast for a fraction of a second.

[bobthenailer]

IMO 18 1/2" would be ideal , i currently have 2 rifles that have 18 1/2 inch barrels a marlin 1894 357 mag and a custom 350 rem mag in a mannulacher stock and they are a joy to shoot & hunt with.
In the past ive owned a ruger # 3 in 22 hornet & another in 45/70 barrel length ? but they sure were handy and 2 rem 600s in 243 & 308 with 18/1/2 " barrels
I have a few other rifles with 24" 26 " & 30" barrels and IMO they are ony used for shots over 200 + yards and they sure arent even close to being as handy as the shorter barrels.
dont worry about the muzzel! blast it may bother some people at the bench but in the field you will never notice it , whats the difference if you shoot a 30/06 with a shorter barrel or a 300 mag with a 24 " barrel ? as far as noise.
I also have a few friends who have the remington 760 game master pump 30/06 carbine with factory 18 1/2 inch barrels and they both love them. of the bench the noise doesent bother me .

[pdawg_shooter]

If you want a 30-30, why not buy a 30-30?

[Echo]

I'm with KiwiJeff - load with a fast powder (4198, say), and adjust for accuracy and MV. I'll bet the fast(er) powder will have pretty much burnt up before boolit exit.

My dos centavos...

[MT Gianni]

If you want a 30-30, why not buy a 30-30?

The best handling guns I own are my 20" bbl BLR's. I would think 18-20" would be the max I would go and there is no real advantage from there to a 22". I vote to leave it as is or replace it with a smaller cartridge /shorter bbl gun.

[Artful]

18 would be shortest on '06 for me - I have some 308 with 17 and with suppressor they are ok but with muzzlebeaks they are noisy suckers - before you take it to field you have to take it to the range.

[JeffinNZ]

The longer this thread goes on the more deaf I become. HAHA.

[Gunfixer]

due to the burn ban I would think this falls under "outdoor fires":veryconfu

[bearcove]

Load it like its an encore pistol barrel with medium burning rate powders and it won't be too bad. Lyman 48th has encore data for 30-06.

Yeah if you shoot 4350 in it will boom. DUH! Use powder that will burn in the barrel.

[firefly1957]

I hunt in brush with a Remington 740 w/22 inch barrel and a model 700 with same length and have never had a problem. The problem is noticed with my Shilo Sharps with a 34 inch barrel but it is rare and the rifle is to heavy to make quick shots while moving in brush. The sharps is a better brush round it is 50-3 1/4 caliber which is a bit much for deer here in Michigan.

[gnoahhh]

Not to mention loss of balance. Those extreme shorties don't balance well for deliberate off hand shooting. They carry nicely though. Honestly I've never felt handicapped in the slightest using 24" barreled rifles and 28" barreled shotguns in the thick stuff.

[lurch]

18 would be shortest on '06 for me - I have some 308 with 17 and with suppressor they are ok but with muzzlebeaks they are noisy suckers - before you take it to field you have to take it to the range.

I've got a DPMS LR308 with an 18" barrel and a Miculek brake. It will definitely get your attention when you pull the trigger. The brake is very effective and recoil is almost non existent, but that muzzle blast coming back at you from the brake will definitely ring your bell. A friend wanted to shoot it one day and did so without hearing protection. The look on his face after that first round was priceless. Mr. "Macho I can take it" then decided that some muffs might be in order. I had intended to do some hunting with it but have scrubbed that idea. I might try taking the brake off and see how it is. Right now, the noise is more than I am willing to endure in field conditions for even a single round.

[troy_mclure]

Load it like its an encore pistol barrel with medium burning rate powders and it won't be too bad. Lyman 48th has encore data for 30-06.

Yeah if you shoot 4350 in it will boom. DUH! Use powder that will burn in the barrel.

ive shot a 15" .30-06 encore pistol(bullberry bull barrel) before. the blast was pretty brutal. iirc he was using 200gr bullets.

i dont know the velocity but it was putting 2" groups at 100yds from a rest.

[bearcove]

I don't have a 30-06 but have had a 270 Encore pistol barrel. Blast it has but not like a barrel with a brake. Some powders are worse than others it requires experimenting.

As far as balance, I like shorter rifles. A Encore with a 20" barrel makes a short carbine but handles fine for me. Cutting a rifle down might not have as much weight in the barrel. Use it and you will get used to it. Took out my father in laws Weatherby and found it Horribly long to me. Pick what you want and try it out for a while. I was a handgun only hunter for probably 20 years all rifles feel cumbersome compared to a pistol in a holster

[bobthenailer]

MY 350 rem mag with a 18 1/2 barrel & magnaported , the muzzel blast hasent bothered me while hunting or when shooting from the bench and wearing hearing protection. ive had this rifle since 1977 and have used it alot . i usually use IMR 4895 powder but i tried some H332 or H335 powder ? accuracy was excellent but it had a more pronounced muzzel blast than with the IMR 4895 powder.
Now lets talk about loud! try hunting with a 454 Casull with magna porting and 36 grs of 296 and a 260 gr bullet you will only do it once . after bagging my first buck with the Casull my ears were ringing for a day. When the buck dropped in one shot the first words from my mouth were oww my f en ears . I was useing nortion sonic ear valves but after about 3 hours of use they were driving me crazey so i removed them . i gladley purchased a set of pro ears electronic hearing protection for the next hunt
I bagged 5 bucks years ago with a 44 mag without hearing protection and the noise never botherd me .
I guess the extra 12 graines of powder made the difference as the 44 with a 8 3/8 barrel was also magna ported i cant imagen a 460 S&W with approx 24 more grs of powder than the 44 and approx 12 grs more than the 454 casull would be like !!!!!!!!!!!

[Char-Gar]

Ouch! No way I would do that.

[gnoahhh]

Ye gods and little fishes, you guys are tougher than I am! I got past the painful muzzle blast guns a long time ago. The ungodly tinnitus I endure makes me wish I would've never gone there at all.

[mroliver77]

Willbird brought out a M44? Mosin a couple years back with a pile of surplus ammo. We were shooting it off of a railroad bridge into a 20' deep ravine with a creek flowing through it. The ravine is prolly 30' - 50' wide. Bridge was built out of concrete in "27" by Henry Ford's D, T & I RR. Anyhow you now have a mental picture of the scene of the........
Wow! These things really belch fire!! I do not remember which surplus ammo he had but it was a load of square flakes.Powder looked like cut up movie film. 3' - 4' fire balls and concussion like thunder! The steel butt plate can become painfull after shooting for a while We had oil boiling out of the wood and it started smoking! What a riot! What a good day! What a BLAST!
Jay

[bearcove]

Ye gods and little fishes, you guys are tougher than I am! I got past the painful muzzle blast guns a long time ago. The ungodly tinnitus I endure makes me wish I would've never gone there at all.

Yeah I wish I had taken up fly fishing instead of shooting/hunting sometimes.
Mine ring 7/24 volume changes but I can't tell why.

[462]

"Mine ring 7/24 volume changes but I can't tell why."

Mine do, too, and jet engines were the cause. The volume is constant but there are sudden, attention grabbing changes in frequency.

[bearcove]

I was a helicopter mechanic and crew chief. It did get loud on the flight line.

[flounderman]

you don't want to hunt wearing hearing protectors and you will do permanent damage to your hearing, without them shooting what you are talking about. I was one of those people that didn't need hearing protection and shooting glasses. in hindsight, they both would have saved me a lot of problems. I just put a sleeve over the holes in a mag ported 7 mag because of the noise level. I don't see the need to go below 24 inches on an 06

[MT Gianni]

It seems like the thing to do is buy an Encore in "06 and shoot it a bit with 15" bbl before you do this. You can't put metal back. You should be able to get your money out of the Encore if you decide to do it or sell the "06 and get a 20" bbl 308. I think your velocity will be about the same.
I can not handle a 24" shotgun to save me and much prefer a 28" bbl length there. I fear the same might happen in going to 16.5" with your rifle. Though Sears sold it there is still a lot of advantages from the Winchester 53 that I would not cut it for that reason.

[troy_mclure]

on a side note, m70 barrels are readily available, and not too expensive. just in case you regret the cut.

[2ndAmendmentNut]

Thank you guys for all the input, I think as of now my rifle will continue wear its 22" barrel.

[JRMTactical]

Nah, cut it down.....don't listen to these guys! I don't....of course I don't listen cuz I can't hear 'em. I think 16.5" and a MUZZLE BRAKE!! Go ALL THE WAY! [smilie=l:

[redneckdan]

I have a 6" 357 herret with a JP brake on it for a range toy. The first time I fired it in side I sent the partition curtain on fire. It usually lives in the bottom of my range bag for times when the krinkov boys show up and insist on shooting right next to me.

[dk17hmr]

Just knocked down one of my 30-06's to 16 3/4"
I have only put 2 rounds through it so far, this weekend I hope to get some range time with it.

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?p=1290182#post1290182

Yea its loud, I dont intended to shoot it all the time though....more of a leave in the truck just in case I need it rifle.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fkCqPJi8VrU