newb with a 219 zipper

[WyomingWhitetail]

hello all i just signed up in my quest for information. I recently put together a marlin 336 in 219 zipper and i can't buy suitable bullets locally so i was thinking of trying cast. Now the zipper is a fairly high velocity 22 round which seems to be a highly specialized area of casting. This rifle will be mainly plinking and varmint hunting with a few coyotes. I would like to be able to shoot at least close to 2500 fps with out any problems which ive heard is possible with cast im just not sure how to do it. Any advice on this would be appreciated. Also any one with any ideals on where i could maybe even buy a few 22cal cast just to try and see if i want to proceed with trying to make my own (anybody on hear cast 22s that would want to sell a box??) looking forward to hearing advice on this.

[Johnch]

Look at Ranch Dog's 22 cal mold ( banner at the top )

I have been running them in the 223 , so your velosity should be fine

Sorry , fat fingers
Cast 22 cal is trying
So I would have to charge 3- 4 X what jacketed would cost LOL

John

[357 Voodoo]

welcome to the madness/fun of little boolits.

Bull shop has a very good selection that you can try he is one of the venders here if you check the vs section.

[Bullshop]

Yes we do have a good selection of designs and weights to choose from.
We also understand your needs as we dont just sell boolits we also use them.
I personally have no experiance with the zipper but have lots of experiance with boolits at the velocity you are talking about.
You may query Michael (Ranch Dog) as I know that he has a Marlin in 219 zipper.
I know this because I tried to get it from him but he wont sell. Actually he has two of them (bugger) and wont sell either. That just ain't right.

[onceabull]

WyoW'tail... I'm shooting one of bullshops 224 Offerings in my marlin Zipper,but can't find precise info within reach,and may not until after NCBS'11..memory says 55 gr.though....Onceabull

[WyomingWhitetail]

thanks for the help and suggestions guys. you have at least given me enough hope to try cast in it and see what happens. Im hoping if i can get it to shoot cast then i can buy a mold and just make my own so that i can shoot this thing a lot. I did find a guy about 2 hours away that offers 22 caliber cast so i might try some of his or i have a friend who said he has some that a friend of his cast that just need sized lubed and gas checked so i might do that just to see what happens. i would be interested in any loads for shooting cast out of a zipper.

[WyomingWhitetail]

Looking for some input from those with cast reloading manuals. I would like to know which reloading manuals list loads for the zipper. I want to get a couple of manuals but would like one that has the zipper in it. I doubt the newer ones list loads for such an obsolete round. Im thinking maybe one of the older lyman or lee manuals. Anybody have some manuals that could give me some insight.

[whisler]

My 1973 Lyman cast bullet manual does not have load info for .219 Zipper. Sorry.

[Wayne Smith]

Both my Serria Second edition and P.O. Ackley's V.1 have data for the Zipper. You can use bullet data for boolits because the lead boolit has less barrel resistance than the harder bullet and consequently produces lower pressure for the same loads. Just back off from the listed maximum just as you would if loading bullets.

[onondaga]

Load ID #8854 over on reloadersnest.com might be a place to start.

It is with the 46 gr Speer FN, so a cast GC bullet would have less pressure. The H4895 powder is great with cast bullets in about every caliber also because of its lower pressure. Link to load:

http://www.reloadersnest.com/detail.asp?CaliberID=11&Powder=Hodgdon+H4895&LoadID=8854

A similar weight cast GC bullet usually yields a very slight increase in velocity over a jacketed bullet with the same charge.

The 26.9 grs of H4895 in that load yields 2400 fps for the author's rifle and the loads listed at this site are generally MAXIMUM loads the authors have worked up for their rifles. His is a 336 in this case.

There are other Zipper loads at that site you can navigate to , but I would stick with the H4895 because of it's great reputation with cast bullets.

The velocity and the pressure you will get with the Zipper at 2400 fps will likely require a harder alloy than Lyman #2 at 15 BHN. An alloy with a BHN 18-20 would be a good place to start with your targeted velocity.. Going low on alloy hardness at 2400 fps could easily be a disappointment to you in accuracy and leading even if your bullet fit and lube are perfect....My opinion, I'd start with straight Lino alloy for 2400 fps.



Gary

[gnoahhh]

Well, a tip-0-the-hat to a newbie going straight to high velocity .22 cast bullets!

To the OP: where do you live that you can't find .22 jacketed bullets?

[WyomingWhitetail]

well i live in wyoming and my dad has 100s of rounds of jacketed 22 bullets, however my rifle is is a tube fed marlin 336 which narrows the bullets options down from 1000s to just a few. and flat nose 22 bullets are not a big seller so most stores don't stock them. The other night i did find some 45gr hornady hollow points made for the 218 bee that will work so i got to boxes of them to try and work up some loads. Still want to try cast tho. So basically i want as hard a bullet as i can make and push it at low pressure. I will try the 4895 for sure since that has always been a good powder for me and my dad and right now im useing 3031.

[Rocky Raab]

When I had a Zipper Contender barrel, I discovered that book loads for the 222 would work fine. The larger case volume of the Zipper works to lower the peak pressure to under the limit for that round. Velocity comes out less than the 222 would produce, of course.

There are several roundnose bullets meant for the Hornet that would work in your tube magazine. The Sierra 45-gr #1210 is an example. They hold up at speeds up to 3000, and are very explosive above 2800.

Those same 222 loads ought to work with cast bullets, although I never tried that.

[johnly]

I have a pair of Marlin 336 219 Zippers. I looked for the first one for years and just stumbled on to the second. I'm working with the Lyman 225646 and the 22 Bator mold with the bullets cast from linotype and sized to .225".

John

[scrapcan]

Wyoming Whitetail,

Where are you at in Wyoming? there are a few of us on here from the state.

If you don't have a mould, depending on where youare located we might be able to work a loan until you can get one.

[WyomingWhitetail]

Well right now im in Sheridan for the summer but the rest of the time im in laramie (university). I would be interested in possibly talking to some local poeple nothing else just to bs about guns. Johnly how have those two moulds been working in your rifle? What are you using for powders and how is accuracy and velocity. Don't need specifics just curious as to a possible starting point.

[scrapcan]

When you get back down to UW send me a PM, I am in Cheyenne. As a side note my wife is from Story.

FECMech is in your area. Dan Walker is in Casper wehn he is not on a Rig. Bunch of other guys/gals her also.

[WyomingWhitetail]

kind of funny that my friend who is gunna help me (i believe he is a member on hear RwBeV) also lives in chey town.

[XWrench3]

you will need some linotype for that ol girl. probably not pure, but you will need some of it. start looking, as sometimes it can be a pita to find. personally, i dont take anyones word that what they are selling is linotype, unless it is still in type form. that, or from a place like rotometals where they guarantee (or certify) the alloy. waterdropping, or heat treating will be your freind. i am running a 2/3rds wheel weights, 1/3rd linotype alloy (water dropped) gas check boolits in my 300 magnum i just found a good accurate load last time out, so chronographing them will come soon. that alloy is pretty hard, you may very well be able to get away with that mix. which will save you a bunch of money for sure. lino isn't cheap. anyway, as for the mold, i am not going to be much help. i have a freind that sent me some of the boolits he made for his 223, but neither of us were real impressed with the accuracy. and that is what i worry about the most. chronogaphs are a fine tool, but a boolit traveling 5000 fps will not kill anything, if it can not find its target. i can tell you that the larger ranch dog molds make boolits that shoot wonderfully. they are certainly not the most areodynamic things on the market, but they fly straight, and with the metplat on them, there should be no problem transfering energy into whatever you shoot! plus you have to love making 6 at a time!